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Old 04-01-06, 01:57 PM   #1
Chone
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Err... what differentiates a Downhill from a Freeride bike?

I mean, both are heavy bikes meant to take a huge beating and be abused and pedal/climb poorly, so why is that I always see companies put downhill and freeride bikes as a separate thing altogether?

Enlight me.
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Old 04-01-06, 02:22 PM   #2
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Geometry is the biggest. I would say weight to but that depends if you are looking at competition level.
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Old 04-01-06, 05:25 PM   #3
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hmmm, both my freeride bikes climb like mad. and arent overly heavy.
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Old 04-01-06, 05:31 PM   #4
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I doubt very much they climb like mad, talk to any xc guy and it is likely the climb well, but to claim the climb like "mad" is downright comical.

FR bikes typically weight 40 - 45 pounds but can get up as high as 60. DH bikes usually sit around 36 pounds to 42 pounds competitve and get as high as 45pounds.
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Old 04-01-06, 05:32 PM   #5
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Most DH bikes have a slacker head angle.
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Old 04-01-06, 05:51 PM   #6
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I would say a DH has a bit more bulk than a freeride bike.
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Old 04-01-06, 05:55 PM   #7
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I would say a DH has a bit more bulk than a freeride bike.
FR has a greater range, but the lighter fr bikes are still heavier than race worthy dh bikes.
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Old 04-01-06, 07:47 PM   #8
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FR has a greater range, but the lighter fr bikes are still heavier than race worthy dh bikes.
Light and super expensive.My bud was building his ne Demo 8 with cane creek Ti wheels,Sram Black Box,Boxxer world cup.Mucho $$$$$$$$ !
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Old 04-01-06, 08:08 PM   #9
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So a thread search for more answers. Freeride is more abusive than dh. A dh bikes suspension is dialed in for high frequency hits. DH riding involves some drops, harsh terrain, etc. Freeride bikes are beefier with a "slowed down" rebound and perhaps less sag on the suspension. The idea in DH is to keep the wheels on the ground to maintain traction, control and speed. FR is just downright abusive with big drops, casing trannies, etc.
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Old 04-02-06, 03:03 AM   #10
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DH bikes usually have slacker angles so the bike is more level on the downhills, and arguably have a longer wheel base. However the wheelbase on DH bikes varies heaps from super short (comparitive to all mountain bikes) to long. Freeride bikes have slightly tighter angles and usually ar better to climb uphill with compared to a DH bike.
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Old 04-02-06, 09:42 PM   #11
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DH bikes are more laid back and have longer wheelbases so they won't be twitchy at high speeds.
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Old 04-02-06, 10:05 PM   #12
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Besides the slacker angles most people mention, a dedicated DH race rig will have a single-ring setup with a DH chain retention system. A Freerider will often ave a two-ring setup of some sort with a granny gear for climbing. Also, a full-on DH rig might get away with using some lighter-weight parts to save weight, because the spares are at the bottom in the pits. On a freeride rig, you gotta go stout, 'cause if you pedal it in, you have to pedal it back out too.
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Old 04-03-06, 09:22 AM   #13
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What exactly is a slack headangle? (or the opposite) Any diagrams?
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Old 04-03-06, 09:45 AM   #14
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A DH-slack headtube angle is going to be on one side or the other of 65 degrees. This is the angle from horizontal. On motorcycles, it's referred to as rake and the angle is measured differently but still equates to the same angle. On a bicycle, the "slacker" the angle (the more it's laid back from 90 deg. perpendicular), the slower it's going to steer and the more stable it will be at speed.

There are other factors involved which rarely get mentioned on bikes - like 'trail' - that has as much bearing on high-speed stability as head angle. Trail is how much distance the axle's center is behind a line drawn from the head angle to the ground. That is determined by the fork crown's offset (how much the legs are out ahead of the steer tube). Trail is what makes the wheel return to straight after hit gets deflected (like the front wheels on a shopping cart)

An excellent little discussion of all this that I just found - with diagrams - is by Lennard Zinn: http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/...es/7322.0.html. Check that out.
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Old 04-03-06, 09:55 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dminor
A DH-slack headtube angle is going to be on one side or the other of 65 degrees. This is the angle from horizontal. On motorcycles, it's referred to as rake and the angle is measured differently but still equates to the same angle. On a bicycle, the "slacker" the angle (the more it's laid back from 90 deg. perpendicular), the slower it's going to steer and the more stable it will be at speed.

There are other factors involved which rarely get mentioned on bikes - like 'trail' - that has as much bearing on high-speed stability as head angle. Trail is how much distance the axle's center is behind a line drawn from the head angle to the ground. That is determined by the fork crown's offset (how much the legs are out ahead of the steer tube). Trail is what makes the wheel return to straight after hit gets deflected (like the front wheels on a shopping cart)

An excellent little discussion of all this that I just found - with diagrams - is by Lennard Zinn: http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/...es/7322.0.html. Check that out.
Thanks, I'll have a read of that now.
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Old 04-03-06, 10:02 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dminor
A DH-slack headtube angle is going to be on one side or the other of 65 degrees. This is the angle from horizontal. On motorcycles, it's referred to as rake and the angle is measured differently but still equates to the same angle. On a bicycle, the "slacker" the angle (the more it's laid back from 90 deg. perpendicular), the slower it's going to steer and the more stable it will be at speed.

There are other factors involved which rarely get mentioned on bikes - like 'trail' - that has as much bearing on high-speed stability as head angle. Trail is how much distance the axle's center is behind a line drawn from the head angle to the ground. That is determined by the fork crown's offset (how much the legs are out ahead of the steer tube). Trail is what makes the wheel return to straight after hit gets deflected (like the front wheels on a shopping cart)

An excellent little discussion of all this that I just found - with diagrams - is by Lennard Zinn: http://www.velonews.com/tech/report/...es/7322.0.html. Check that out.
Thanks, I'll have a read of that now.
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Old 04-03-06, 11:47 AM   #17
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A couple more links with diagrams and explanation:
http://web.uct.ac.za/depts/psychology/bok/posneg.html
http://www.kreuzotter.de/english/elenk.htm
Try to ignore the funkiness of some of the actual pictures)
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Old 04-03-06, 06:40 PM   #18
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I addition to the points above, A DH bike is MUCH more likely to be straddled by a corpulent chain smoker who would be hard-pressed to pedal their bike 1/4 mile, even on the flats.
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Old 04-03-06, 08:24 PM   #19
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I addition to the points above, A DH bike is MUCH more likely to be straddled by a corpulent chain smoker who would be hard-pressed to pedal their bike 1/4 mile, even on the flats.
I really hope you are being sarcastic? I haven't seen such an uneducated narrow minded point of view in several years on this site, and I was quite happy to see those fools leave.
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Old 04-04-06, 09:35 AM   #20
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Testing, I was the last one to post and my name doesn't show up. Does this fix it.
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Old 04-04-06, 11:03 AM   #21
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dup, time to fix those nagging server issues...
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Old 04-04-06, 11:04 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maelstrom
I really hope you are being sarcastic? I haven't seen such an uneducated narrow minded point of view in several years on this site, and I was quite happy to see those fools leave.
No, not sacrastic, just my observation based upon a whole bunch of riding.

I have never seen a corpulent chainsmoker on a freeride bike. I have seen a handful of corpulent chain smokers on DH bikes at Mt. Snow, Northstar, and Whistler, waiting for the lifts to whisk them up the hill.

How do you get uneducated and narrow-minded from an observation like that?
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Old 04-04-06, 11:15 AM   #23
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Hopefully this posts.

Narrow minded because you point of view seems skewed. Having lived in whistler 5 years and met just about every pro on the circuit and knowing a lot of expert level riders, I can't think of a single one who can't pedal uphill, smoking - yes I will give you that a few do. Narrow minded because you don't see them outside the resort and your claim is based on short viewings. I would hazard an educated guess that most are in better shape than the average freerider as they are extremely powerful and most have extended road training regiments during the off season. Your view seems outdated and narrow minded, even after having explained why you believe that. Just because most aren't superiour endurance athletes doesn't make them out the way you desribe. I guess you could put any power sport in that category. And if you don't think dh racing while pinning it is difficult, come up to whistler and ride garbonzo to angry pirate to whatever lower trail you like while pedaling through all the rough stuff and just pinning it. that 14minutes will require a tonne of physical power and endurance.
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Old 04-04-06, 11:20 AM   #24
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ok hopefully this posts. I was on a roll for a second, one whole post.

Maybe you are thinking of sport class where the weekend warriors get to come out and test there gumption for racing.
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Old 04-04-06, 11:24 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maelstrom
Narrow minded because you point of view seems skewed. Having lived in whistler 5 years and met just about every pro on the circuit and knowing a lot of expert level riders, I can't think of a single one who can't pedal uphill, smoking - yes I will give you that a few do. Narrow minded because you don't see them outside the resort and your claim is based on short viewings.
You're suffering from some serious reading comprehension issues and/or you're jumping to conclusions.

I made no comment about pro and/or expert DHers. Apparently you took my comment about what type of bike corpulent, out of shape, chain smokers are more likely to ride based upon my observations and somehow twisted it, in your mid, into some kind of indictment against all DHers.

There's a BIG difference between what I wrote and what you think I wrote. I would suggest that you go back and read my posts again. Focus on "A DH bike is MUCH more likely to be" for starters.

Good luck.
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