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Old 12-09-06, 05:38 PM   #1
Katzenjammer
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Trek's ZR9000 frame alloy -- real or hype?

"Lighter than Al, stronger than steel". Sounds wonderful. If true. Anyone know how much of it is true and whether a ZR9000 frame would suit someone who likes steel, trusts steel, & doesn't want to mess with aluminum?
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Old 12-09-06, 06:23 PM   #2
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Does the 9000 stand for the aluminum series? I read in a book that like 6000 series is Al and some other metals, and same with 7000, but with silicon or magnesium or those are with another series. I cant tell a difference on my fuel from regular Al. Except I know the tube walls are slimmer (and lighter?). Though, I would like to experience a nice steel framed bike.
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Old 12-09-06, 07:21 PM   #3
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It's basically very thin aluminum tubing.
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Old 12-09-06, 08:15 PM   #4
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Hype mostly.

Don't get me wrong, I consider myself a Trek fan (I still own three of them).

Trek is tight-lipped about the exact aluminum alloy they've coined "ZR9000", but my best guess is it's 6013.

"Lighter than aluminum, stronger than steel" means very little. There are many grades of steel, and yes, some of the higher grades of aluminum are stronger than the weakest grades of steel.

If you're a fan of steel frames and their ride, you may not like the ride of Al, but longevity-wise, Trek stands behind their products quite well.
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Old 12-09-06, 08:42 PM   #5
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I have a 2003 Trek Fuel 80 with the ZR9000 that I have beat the crap out of, but it still is in one piece with no cracks. I was a steel only guy too but it's made a believer out of me.
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Old 12-09-06, 09:36 PM   #6
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What series AL would Trek's Alpha Aluminum be?
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Old 12-09-06, 09:37 PM   #7
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The only thing that I like bout TREK is their Lifetime warranty, my friend he did a jump and his frame cracked. Send to TREK and they replace a new one for him. How good is that
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Old 12-10-06, 12:38 AM   #8
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is it bad that I picture this guy for wheelhot

"Dr. Jones, Dr. Jones!"

oh, just read some of his posts and imagine the kid from Indiana Jones saying it, it gives me a laugh and a half

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Old 12-10-06, 12:40 AM   #9
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huh? dun get ya
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Old 12-10-06, 01:15 AM   #10
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Me neither
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Old 12-10-06, 01:17 AM   #11
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not know what "Indiana Jones" is
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Old 12-10-06, 01:21 AM   #12
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I foo, i mean doo.
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Old 12-10-06, 02:40 AM   #13
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Sombody say Indiana Jones?

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Old 12-10-06, 05:01 AM   #14
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haha, i remember that scene from Indiana
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Old 12-10-06, 05:49 AM   #15
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They say it has some Zirconium in it? *shrugs*
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Old 12-10-06, 07:55 AM   #16
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whats Zirconium, I failed my Chemistry
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Old 12-10-06, 08:59 AM   #17
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Trek owns Gary Fisher. They're sister companies. Why can't they be called brother companies?

Anyway, I broke my frame a couple months ago and got a brand new one back with my choice of custom color.

That's what they're supposed to do, they have a lifetime warranty.

The ZR9000 is supposedly the first aluminum designed solely for bicycle construction. Other aluminums have been made for other things and then adapted to bikes. (quoted from either Trek or Fisher's site)

I like mine though it did break once.
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Old 12-10-06, 02:08 PM   #18
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Where's Falanx when you need him?
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Old 12-10-06, 03:03 PM   #19
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Could it be 7075 AL? The most abundant metal mixed in is Zirconium.

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Old 12-12-06, 02:03 PM   #20
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Sorry, but...


[IMG]http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m254/_Falanx_/callingbull****8ot-1.jpg[/IMG]
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Old 12-12-06, 02:03 PM   #21
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Damnit
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Old 12-12-06, 02:08 PM   #22
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Um, it's aluminum? It works for me...
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Old 12-12-06, 02:36 PM   #23
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This is total horse.

Okay.

Quick caption metallurgy -

6000 series: Al-Si-Mg. Precipitation hardenable, medium strength, readily weldable, suffers from grain boundary weakness.
7000 series: Al-Zn-Mg-Cu-Ti. Precipitation hardenable, very high strength, weldable or so, suffers from grain boundary weakness unless doped with silver.
8000 series: Al-Li, principally, but were developed from 7000 series, so may have any additions from them. Precipitation hardenable, high strength, 1%Li lowers alloy density by 3%, so lighter than most Al alloys but Li boils in the weldpool making them a b*st*rd to weld until the Russians developed new techniques. Now only a partial b*st*rd to weld.

9000 series: at present unassigned to a specific precipitate chain. So, what I think Trek have done is a "Look, look, here, totally NEW alloy system" mental association with the four-digit moniker. Which is outright intellectually dishonest, but, meh. This will be a doped 7000 series. What's even more silly is that zirconium, if I recall tends to cause overaging in alloys....

The only alloying element that causes any behaviour at all like a steel in Al alloys is scandium. And that is not added to make the alloy stronger

Thats the only thing you need to remember.
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Old 12-12-06, 03:11 PM   #24
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Please dont outsmart the censor. That is a very expensive censor and every time one of you guys outsmart it it makes someone at the home office feel bad. We dont wanna do that. So dont cleverly disguise bad words.
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Old 12-12-06, 03:13 PM   #25
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Thanks Falanx - -to the rescue before I could (in my limited fashion) respond. I did find a reference to a Russian engineering paper on scandium and zirconium alloying, but that's all the further I got before you stepped in and set things straight.
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