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  1. #1
    :\ ping of death troie's Avatar
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    Nishiki Blazer FS or Diamondback Outlook?

    First and foremost, hello. I am a complete Noob to mtbing. I just bought a Nishiki Blazer FS at SportsChalet for $179.99. I like it but I dont think I got a good bike. The salesperson suggested the Diamondback Outlook. Although it is a hardtail, its lighter and stronger?

    Anyway, my question is, should I exchange the Nishiki for the Diamonback? Im going to be riding on simple trails, no major jumping but alot of downhill. Im worried about the comfort of the hardtail and the durability of the fs.

    What do you guys suggest?

  2. #2
    Madman of Princeton sparticus's Avatar
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    who made your fork? if its RST or suntour, the fork will not be durable. Why dont you shell out 600 dollars for a spectacular SID Race (no just kidding, but eventually the price wont sound rediculous) It may sound excessive at this point in time, but try looking to models in the 300-600 dollar range (hardtails) and you will find bikes that after you ride and get into the whole mountain bikeing scene, you will thank yourself for paying the extra money so you can have a reliable and well build bike. You can get fairly mid to high end bike for 600 dollars used on sites like www.mtbr.com . These would be bikes that you would pay 1000 plus for new. So I suggest throwing in a little extra dough if you thing that you will be mountainbiking regularly, and its not just something that you will be trying for a month or so and then leave in the dust of our everchanging lives.
    -Adam

    '02 Kona bear frame $500
    '02 Marzo MXC 100mm $100
    Mavic tubeless 24 spoke wheelset $100

  3. #3
    :\ ping of death troie's Avatar
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    Its Suntour. I dont plan on going all out hard core, just simple leisure stuff.

  4. #4
    I drink your MILKSHAKE Raiyn's Avatar
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    Rule of thumb: Don't touch a FS bike with a regular price below $1000. Below this price point they tend to be the bike equivelent of wallowing pigs. (Heavy, hard to control, and inefficent). Where are you purchasing this bike? If it's a department or sporting goods store get your money back and go to a real bike shop one that concentrates on bicycles and or ONE other sport. (ie my favorite shop that I don't work at sells motorscooters as wells as bicycles.) This is a good year to buy a bike - the models are well spec'd due to the stronger dollar at the start of the production run last year so even a $200 - $250 bike will have some decent components.
    Last edited by Raiyn; 05-29-03 at 01:16 PM.

  5. #5
    :\ ping of death troie's Avatar
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    The Nishiki is actually originally $299.00, I got in on sale for the memorial day holiday. The Diamondback is $239.00 straight. People keep telling me the Diamonback is a better bike, im just worried about a rough ride.

    Im really thinking about returning it. Im into weightlifting more than I am mtbing. I could use the money for better, more reasonable purposes. Considering of course that everyone thinks I should get a better bike than the two of them. I guess I just dont have the money right now.

  6. #6
    Senior Member sebring's Avatar
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    I'm very happy with my Diamondback Response, which is like 1 model above the Outlook I believe. The Outlook should be a fine bike.
    www.emsbikeride.org

    The voice of reason is usually a whisper.

    Bike:

    2003 Diamondback Response HT

    2003 Specialized Allez Road

  7. #7
    I ride a REAL Schwinn!
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    Full suspension for $179? RUN AWAY-FAST. The Diamondback will be a better bike. An FS bike under about $1000 is a BAD idea in the majority of cases. Diamondback is a more reputable and widely recognized company in the mountain biking world nowadays. Not to say that the Nishiki won't suit you fine for some casaul riding, but you wouldn't beleive the difference in quality of both the frame and the components between that and the Diamondback. You don't need to be worried about not having full-suspension with the Diamondback unless you've got back or neck problems that would justify it on a first bike when you're not sure if you are going to stick with the sport or not. After all, think of all the years people road off-road with hardtails - even DH riders. Proper riding technique is key. Don't plant yourself on your seat on real rough sections at speed - that's all you've got to do to begin with. I ride and race a hardtail and have beat people riding multi-thousand dollar FS race bikes. It's all in the rider. I ccome out of some rides/races looking less beat up then some of the FS riders. It shouldn't be a concern if this is your first bike and you don't have the cash to buy a quality FS.

    -Moab
    '00 Schwinn Moab 3 - XTR/XT/Thomson/Rhyno Lites/Skareb Super
    Lemond Nevada City - Almost Stock!

  8. #8
    :\ ping of death troie's Avatar
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    Technically its $300, but thats besides the point. Like I said, I dont plan on going all out hardcore. Just some casual trail riding a few times a month. No racing, no jumping, just leisure and fun. Besides I dont feel like paying anymore money, got bills to handle first.

  9. #9
    Senior Member mountaindew's Avatar
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    I hate to say this and I will probably get PMed alot of hatemail but... for a beginner who is not really going to be doing anything hard or really fast I think the economy bikes are a good choice, sure they're crap but they're value is awesome. I may not go with an F/S but the cheaper HT's might be worth it.
    shift for brains

  10. #10
    Senior Member mountaindew's Avatar
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    Besides with an HT you can perfect your skill and technique.
    shift for brains

  11. #11
    NCAA - DUAL CHAMPIONS! a2psyklnut's Avatar
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    I also get a lot of flack for this, but if you're just going to ride around the neighborhood, an inexpensive bike will do. BUT, if you are even considering riding off-road, they just won't hold up and the weight of them will make you work twice as hard.

    There are a ton of choices of quality bike available in the sub-$300 range. A lot of shops don't stock non-suspension bikes, because nowadays, everyone wants at least a suspension fork. But if you flip through a couple of catalogues, you'll see their entry level bikes offered in a non-suspension model. They usually run in the $250 price point.

    Then, there is always the USED option. You can usually find a $500-600 two year old bike for $250-300.

    L8R
    "Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming, "WOW, What a Ride!" - unknown
    "Your Bike Sucks" - Sky Yaeger

  12. #12
    :\ ping of death troie's Avatar
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    Every saturday Ill be going off road. Its not life threatining terrain though. Most of it is just dirt and some gravel. I think the biggest rock Ill encounter is roughly the size of a watermelon. No tree stumps, no creeks, no 6 feet drops, just dirt.

    When you say "just wont hold up" whatdya mean?

  13. #13
    NCAA - DUAL CHAMPIONS! a2psyklnut's Avatar
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    The quality of the parts is poor at best. The first thing to go will be the pedals. The axles will bend and you'll feel like a Duck in Heat trying to pedal.

    Next will be the brakes. They will come out of adjustment, and numerous attempts to repair will fail and they'll continue to move to one side and rub the rim.

    Then the shifters. Crisp clean shifts will no longer occur after about two months. You'll have to "feel" your way into a gear, and ghostshifting will occur off and on.

    Wheels, they'll come out of true through your first rock garden and will rub the brakes that are already out of adjustment.

    The one-piece cranks will become loose and sloppy, the headset will start to loosen, and if you try to jump at all, the handlebars will start to get bent towards the ground. The seat will strip and become loose and you now have aa $179 piece of scrap metal.

    O.k, this is a bit of an exaggeration and regular maintenance (good way to learn) will prevent a lot of this from happening. But, the parts are inexpensive pot metal or hi-tensile steel. They won't last to the rigors of off-road riding. Not to mention, they are HEAVY!

    If you get suspension, the elastomers (springy foam things) only work when compressed, and have no dampening, so they spring back to initial point as quickly as possible. Kinda like a pogo stick! They will develop some flex and just always feel loose.

    If you're mechancially inclined and have a willingness to learn bicycle mechanics, it's a great learning tool.

    BTW, I often give estimates of similar bikes and the parts and labor to just get the bike working again is often more than half the original cost. I call these type of bikes "disposable", but they do have a purpose and get people riding bikes in lieu of watching TV. Plus, they keep bikes shop repair areas busy!

    L8R
    "Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming, "WOW, What a Ride!" - unknown
    "Your Bike Sucks" - Sky Yaeger

  14. #14
    :\ ping of death troie's Avatar
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    Wow, thanks for the uh...feedback? lol. Well, I hope it lasts a long time for me. I guess the only way to find out is to ride it. If it ends up crap, oh well, lesson learned. Thanks anyways guys.

  15. #15
    Senior Member mountaindew's Avatar
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    Originally posted by a2psyklnut
    BUT, if you are even considering riding off-road, they just won't hold up and the weight of them will make you work twice as hard.

    I don't know about that, I took my Magna to Whistler and went down a ski run when it was wet (have you ever tried stopping a "200 lb." bike with those crappy brakes... you can't) needless to say it was a rush and the bike was still alive in one peice and so was I. While they aren't great on the trail or on technical sections they still work, besides going uphill with a 50 lb. F/S bike will turn lungs into iron and your legs into buff pipes.
    shift for brains

  16. #16
    Senior Member mountaindew's Avatar
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    Originally posted by a2psyklnut
    The quality of the parts is poor at best. The first thing to go will be the pedals. The axles will bend and you'll feel like a Duck in Heat trying to pedal.

    Next will be the brakes. They will come out of adjustment, and numerous attempts to repair will fail and they'll continue to move to one side and rub the rim.

    Then the shifters. Crisp clean shifts will no longer occur after about two months. You'll have to "feel" your way into a gear, and ghostshifting will occur off and on.

    Wheels, they'll come out of true through your first rock garden and will rub the brakes that are already out of adjustment.

    The one-piece cranks will become loose and sloppy, the headset will start to loosen, and if you try to jump at all, the handlebars will start to get bent towards the ground. The seat will strip and become loose and you now have aa $179 piece of scrap metal.

    O.k, this is a bit of an exaggeration and regular maintenance (good way to learn) will prevent a lot of this from happening. But, the parts are inexpensive pot metal or hi-tensile steel. They won't last to the rigors of off-road riding. Not to mention, they are HEAVY!

    If you get suspension, the elastomers (springy foam things) only work when compressed, and have no dampening, so they spring back to initial point as quickly as possible. Kinda like a pogo stick! They will develop some flex and just always feel loose.

    If you're mechancially inclined and have a willingness to learn bicycle mechanics, it's a great learning tool.

    BTW, I often give estimates of similar bikes and the parts and labor to just get the bike working again is often more than half the original cost. I call these type of bikes "disposable", but they do have a purpose and get people riding bikes in lieu of watching TV. Plus, they keep bikes shop repair areas busy!

    L8R
    Dang, you must of beat the crap out of your dep. bike...errrr whats left of it I never had those problems with mine, granted I didn't have it very long before my aunt backed into it. But the only thing wrong with it was the cassette was crooked, so my freind got a hammer and beat it into place now it works fine.
    shift for brains

  17. #17
    :\ ping of death troie's Avatar
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    mdew, was it a dept store bike?

  18. #18
    Senior Member mountaindew's Avatar
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    Originally posted by troie
    mdew, was it a dept store bike?
    One of those bikes from Target or Mall-wart (Wal-Mart)
    shift for brains

  19. #19
    :\ ping of death troie's Avatar
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    Do you still ride it? Is it still intact and worth riding?

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