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  1. #1
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    Haro Werks XLS...opinions?

    Im looking at this Haro Werks XLS 2.0, i will be using is for XC and day to day trail riding. Does any one ride one or know of people who ride one. Im just looking for opinions on this bike. it seams to have good specs and looks kinda like the Santa Cruz superlight in design.

    Thanks!
    Jonathan

  2. #2
    DiL
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    The Werks are all a single pivot design which suffer from pedal induced bob and brake jack. Not many people are crazy about them
    Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night. Light a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

  3. #3
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    have you ridden this bike? ANYONE?
    -Full speed ahead,Hard and fast!
    -You've always got to keep on trying, if you don't try you'll only fail!

  4. #4
    DiL
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    I've ridden several of their FS designs, including the Werks, and they all are a very typical single pivot design.

    For $400 less you could get a Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Comp, or for around the same price you could get a Specialized Enduro Comp.

    If Specialized isn't your thing, you could get a Kona Kikapu Deluxe or a Fuji Diamond Lite 3 in the same price range.

    Edit: Stumpy FSR Comp is $270 cheaper than the werks. Math was never my thing, I guess.
    Last edited by DiL; 06-02-03 at 09:32 PM.
    Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night. Light a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

  5. #5
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    I can get the Werks 2.0 for about a grand so...

    Any way, is there something wrong with single pivot designs? The Sanata Cruz Superlight is very close in design and the stores around here cant keep them in stock.
    Last edited by Mad Dog JR; 06-03-03 at 05:24 PM.

  6. #6
    DiL
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    Here are some links where you can get some info on suspension designs:

    http://www.titusti.com/techtalk.html : Doesn't directly cover the single-pivot design, but I consider it among the best sources of non-biased info on suspension design.

    http://www.specialized.com/sbc4Bar.jsp?a=b : (or directly to the single pivot discussion here) Can't go wrong with nifty animated GIFs.
    Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night. Light a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

  7. #7
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Mad Dog JR
    I can get the Werks 2.0 for about a grand so...

    Any way, is there something wrong with single pivot designs? The Sanata Cruz Superlight is very close in design and the stores around here cant keep them in stock.
    But that very close does make a difference on performance. It is difficult to explain but santa cruz is one of VERY few companies who have found a decent sweet spot for the single pivot design.

    that said with the right shock a single pivot cxan perform very well and for general xc should be good. Won't make a very good race bike though.

    BTW I expect the Superlight may go the way of the Super8. Just a gut feeling that has no basis more than me seeing their v10 but even they have to admit the incredible performance improvement with the vpp over a single pivot

  8. #8
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    I also wanted to point out that Santa Cruz is probably still using a single pivot design because

    a) the design is simple and durable when done right
    b) cheap. The r&d is payed for on the design so they can sell REALLY well made high quality frames for reasonable prices. Where else can you buy a well qualified freeride frame built strong from a small company with a wicked reputation for under 2000$ candian (the builtit in this case). It doesn't happen to often.

    Most low end bike use a single pivot design for the above reasons. This makes a lot of sense in marketing terms

  9. #9
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    what about the K2 razorback? isent that a single pivot design? the K2 was my first choice but the haro is a little cheaper with more travel)
    -Full speed ahead,Hard and fast!
    -You've always got to keep on trying, if you don't try you'll only fail!

  10. #10
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    Reading the reviews it seems like a xc machine. I have neve seen one but it is a pullbased suspension design.

    The air/oil shock works as a 'pull shock'. The shock shaft is attached to the seat post, and as the bike settles into a bump, the seat stays push the main shock body into the casing. The Mega Air shock is vastly lighter than last year's coil over oil affair, saving weight on the frame. The actual bit that moves is the bit that you can't see: the piston on the inside of the stay brace. This means that any mud on the white casing really won't effect anything.
    It is a low single pivot bike. Reading through the reviews this doesn't seem to be a very active suspension and has some problems with over stiffness which may or may not be a good thing. If you can test ride one that would be best. And you are right there isn't much travel but this bike was initially marketted as a real xc racer dually

  11. #11
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    i dont really NEED a lot of travel, just somthing to smooth out the bumps a bit. right now im riding a K2 Animal thats way to small for me (size small) and is real heavy to be using as a XC bike. i was thinking about going to a hardtail but i dont think i would like it much... i like to have some dampening. im also fairly light weight at only 135 or so pounds so maybe 3" of travel is plenty for me?
    so what do you think i should lean tords?

    Thanks a lot BTW for speedy response!
    Jonathan
    -Full speed ahead,Hard and fast!
    -You've always got to keep on trying, if you don't try you'll only fail!

  12. #12
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    K2...nice looking xc bike. K2 is a very reputable company for xc bikes while Haro is known for bmx's and crossing over to mtb. I don't know if I trust them yet ...

  13. #13
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    i know a few people who loved there haro HT's (i think it was a A1 or something) and i have a haro monocoque that i raced with and liked a lot. but i think you might be right about the K2, i just dont know yet... no one around here has any razorbacks in stock to test ride so its hard to do that.
    -Full speed ahead,Hard and fast!
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  14. #14
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    Haro ht's would be fine as they can use the same strenght and design of bmx's. In fact some of them are very similar. But duallies require a little more engineerng. I don't honestly know but to me haro hasn't proven itself as a DUALLY I would buy

  15. #15
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    i kinda feel the same way. no one stockes haro MTB's here so thats kinda saying something i would think.
    -Full speed ahead,Hard and fast!
    -You've always got to keep on trying, if you don't try you'll only fail!

  16. #16
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    I'm riding a Haro HT right now (V3) and have nothing but good things to say about it. The majority of bikes that my LBS stocks is Haro and the owner swears by them.....FS, HT, you name it.

    I guess it's just a personal preference. I might be just biased, but i have a feeling we will be hearing good things about Haro's once they get a little more exposure.

  17. #17
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    see.... but i still would liketo ride one first. but no one carrys them around here (mtb thats is)
    -Full speed ahead,Hard and fast!
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  18. #18
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    Originally posted by HaroLuver
    I'm riding a Haro HT right now (V3) and have nothing but good things to say about it. The majority of bikes that my LBS stocks is Haro and the owner swears by them.....FS, HT, you name it.
    They even have a couple of high end freeriders sponsored for their ht's. I just don't know if I would trust their duallies yet

  19. #19
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    well i think them DH bikes are made by Intense so there not really haro's. they just put there name on it.

  20. #20
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    BTW i went to the LBS and was looking at this Marin RiftZone "Quad series" bike. I can get it for about $900 at a shop in washington. It looks to be a good bike. the only thing im not to sure of is the Truative cranks, it does have full hydro hayes disc brakes. It's like 27 pounds.
    -Full speed ahead,Hard and fast!
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  21. #21
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    Truvativs are good cranks. I use them. Great bike for lightweight riders

  22. #22
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    ok i think im going to forget the Haro, it's down to the K2 razorback 3.0 or 4.0 or the Marin Quad Rift zone
    Marin= $900 or so
    K2 3.0= $700 or so
    K2 4.0= $930
    -Full speed ahead,Hard and fast!
    -You've always got to keep on trying, if you don't try you'll only fail!

  23. #23
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    Hmmm tough one. I personally would go with the Marin as it is 4 bar. K2 pull based suspension doesn't offer a lot of different shocks while a typical 4 bar you can buy a different shock for a different feeling bike

  24. #24
    Speed Racer Mad Dog JR's Avatar
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    ya, it has that for sure over the K2, but i dont plan on buying different shocks anyhow.
    the K2 4.0 has a little better component line over the others.
    i talked with the guy at the shop and he said the marin was a little more comfy over the k2. i can see that with having 1 inch more travel in the rear
    -Full speed ahead,Hard and fast!
    -You've always got to keep on trying, if you don't try you'll only fail!

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