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Is your normal trail harder than the olympic course

Old 08-25-08, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Rutnick
but what is your point? The olympic course was what? 4.4km done 8 times so that's about 21 miles. The winning time was just sub 2hour. The pros at the 11 mile course that I listed earlier do it in around 48 minutes so that's 22 miles in about 96 minutes.

While the course might not look all that challenging, the constant up and down of the course for 4.4k with 8 loops leaves little room to really build speed in the flats which means you are constantly up and down with no rest.

Sometimes...you have to look at a course hard. We might ride it and think...well that wasn't tough. Try to ride it fast...multiply by 8, add passing and the heat of a 3pm start time.

Some course that I ride are a freaking breeze when I ride them. They become more challenging when you try to make places to go faster.

As technical, no....hard...probably. slower...yes.
Yeah we definately don't want to take away anything from the athletes, they are strong. We are simply noting the difficulty of the course. I have two local trails, Dornwood, and the Lawrence river trails, that really offer nothing in a technical ride. However if I ride them as hard as I can,(which is slow at best compared to an Olympic athlete) I still can get a hell of a workout.
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Old 08-25-08, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Rutnick
the constant up and down of the course for 4.4k with 8 loops leaves little room to really build speed in the flats which means you are constantly up and down with no rest.

This is a good description of KS trails. Never any extended climbs that reward you with a looooog/fast DH. Actually, I think I would do better riding in a mountainous or at least "hilly" area b/c I tend to do better when my speed is built up and I can "blow-through" sections or jump over technical sections.


Who am I kidding? I'm not fast anymore, hehe.
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Old 08-25-08, 12:55 PM
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Man, you guys are a pretty tough bunch.

Parts of that Olympic course looked plenty tough to me. I would have been over the bars on some of the sketchy descents. Or eating trees.
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Old 08-25-08, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Rutnick;7338261[COLOR="Silver"
]but what is your point? The olympic course was what? 4.4km done 8 times so that's about 21 miles. The winning time was just sub 2hour. The pros at the 11 mile course that I listed earlier do it in around 48 minutes so that's 22 miles in about 96 minutes. [/COLOR]

While the course might not look all that challenging, the constant up and down of the course for 4.4k with 8 loops leaves little room to really build speed in the flats which means you are constantly up and down with no rest.

Sometimes...you have to look at a course hard. We might ride it and think...well that wasn't tough. Try to ride it fast...multiply by 8, add passing and the heat of a 3pm start time.

Some course that I ride are a freaking breeze when I ride them. They become more challenging when you try to make places to go faster.

As technical, no....hard...probably. slower...yes.
That's right. That's what struck me as I watched the entire race on the internet. There was very, very little in the way of 'rest'. I've done plenty of regional races and 24 hour events, and all have some pretty easy sections where you could recuperate. This race was pretty much flat out hammer time the entire way.
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Old 08-25-08, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by gfrance
Man, you guys are a pretty tough bunch.

Parts of that Olympic course looked plenty tough to me. I would have been over the bars on some of the sketchy descents. Or eating trees.
I didn't see the competition, so I can't really judge. But, what I've noticed is that seeing video of a skilled rider on a gnarly course often makes the course appear easier than it is. Also, the steepness of a climb doesn't always translate well onto video. Without having seen the competition, I can't judge, but this might be part of it.
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Old 08-25-08, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by junkyard
I didn't see the competition, so I can't really judge. But, what I've noticed is that seeing video of a skilled rider on a gnarly course often makes the course appear easier than it is. Also, the steepness of a climb doesn't always translate well onto video. Without having seen the competition, I can't judge, but this might be part of it.
Good, and correct observation.
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Old 08-25-08, 01:13 PM
  #32  
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The Olympic course was not as diffficult as most of what I ride, at least in terms of vertical gain and technical difficulty. Most of our trails have root and/or rock steps on all climbs and descents, loose rock on most and scree on quite a few. There are also mud bogs, cows and the occasional bear.

A good example of the riding we have locally is the UCI World Cup Course in Canmore, Alberta. I recall being at the top of the first pitch of the main climb, and watching pros pushing their bikes up the hill on the 3rd or 4th lap. The last [?] year they ran the race, it snowed for the women's final and a bunch of people got hypothermia. Normal daytime high at that tiime of year was about 22C, but it only got as warm as 6C that day.
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Old 08-26-08, 07:35 AM
  #33  
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just got back from a 24hr race this weekend at a nearby park, and spent a while checking out the youtube coverage...

looks like a fun trail to ride! but taking the tougher of our local trails... the nearly impossible 50m climb, the huge switchback climbs, the fast downhills, technical rock gardens and whoops, and often slick catwalks, including that one that turns and goes uphill...

our course seems faster on the downhills, but has gnarlier climbs methinks. lots of roots and they get steep.

harder? i think the T.O. crew will likely agree, catalyst, P.A. and the dropoffs considered.

(this is the city trail, the one for the 24hrs is def. harder. 15.5km, with massive climbs and sicker downhills for sure)
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Old 08-26-08, 08:50 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by junkyard
I didn't see the competition, so I can't really judge. But, what I've noticed is that seeing video of a skilled rider on a gnarly course often makes the course appear easier than it is. Also, the steepness of a climb doesn't always translate well onto video. Without having seen the competition, I can't judge, but this might be part of it.
I noticed that too. At first, I thought, "that doesn't look so hard". Then I watched the winner spin up the hill in her small ring & you could tell she was working. "Hmmm... I don't have legs like her, or do this for a living - maybe it isn't as easy at it seems....". Also, the difference between watching the leaders and the stragglers do the technical downhills also lead me to believe they weren't quite as "easy" as it looked at first.
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Old 08-26-08, 09:19 AM
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^^

thats actually another very valid consideration, and it all comes back into the earlier mentioned lack of rest periods, eight laps, smog, and stiff competition trying to kill themselves to pass you.

i was thinking simply in technical chops, as in it is difficult to actually ride, not in race loop terms. There are a few recuperatory sections in our trails, even at the race there were some flats, so in that sense ours arent as difficult. thinking about it as a loop and taking endurance and speed into is key, but easily overlooked when you begin to compare swathes of dirt..

EDIT: and as an olympian, even hell should look easy to ride when you hit it
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Old 08-27-08, 06:00 AM
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Of course all these bad *** members could have beat any of those olympic contenders on any course... I seen the subject on this thread and new all the bench racers would be out in full force saying how hard they have it on their trails and that the olympic trails are flat and easy, blah, blah, blah. You guys are funny....
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Old 08-27-08, 07:08 AM
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Originally Posted by RIC0
Of course all these bad *** members could have beat any of those olympic contenders on any course... I seen the subject on this thread and new all the bench racers would be out in full force saying how hard they have it on their trails and that the olympic trails are flat and easy, blah, blah, blah. You guys are funny....
hmmmm...perhaps you meant to post in a different thread because no one in this thread has posted anything like that.

re: the course - I would like to see more technical climbing. roots, rocks, ledges, etc. It seemed like all the rocks/ruts/roots were on the descents, but the climbs were basically paved.

re: the race - It was pretty clear to me that Absalon won because he was so much smoother than the swiss riders on the tech parts.
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Old 08-27-08, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by RIC0
Of course all these bad *** members could have beat any of those olympic contenders on any course... I seen the subject on this thread and new all the bench racers would be out in full force saying how hard they have it on their trails and that the olympic trails are flat and easy, blah, blah, blah. You guys are funny....
I didn't see anyone post that they could beat olympic racers. How 'bout poting that quote up?
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Old 08-27-08, 08:16 AM
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Exactly, I never wrote that I could climb quicker or that I would pwn them on the descents. I compared the terrain.
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Old 08-27-08, 08:20 AM
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Originally Posted by mtnbiker66
I didn't see anyone post that they could beat olympic racers. How 'bout posting that quote up?
Yah...that was a pretty poor assumption.

I was basically saying that the technical level of the course was poop. I think the rider's endurance levels are most likely top notch and lightyears ahead of my lazy butt. I have been pissing and moaning this year an aweful lot about the lack of "off road terrain" on MTB races.

Basically dirt/road races.

There's more to high level MTB'ing than endurance. I feel that the focus should be on the technical skills aspect. Then you'd have Olympian Roadies pissing and moaning b/c they're not quite tough enough for the road course, but skinny lil' Ryan Leech kicked their tails on the MTB course, haha.

(and no...I don't think the MTB courses should be a "trials course"...I was just giving an example of a person who has mastered their technical skills)

Last edited by ed; 08-27-08 at 09:48 AM.
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Old 08-27-08, 06:41 PM
  #41  
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66 could beat all the olympic riders. He is by far better than any of those hacks.
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