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Old 08-14-09, 10:43 PM   #1
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Progression...digression...sidegression???

1998 Kona Mokomoko "Hmmm...let's try a rocker link with a vertical rear shock."


1998 Jamis Dakar "my bike's the best...it's a MacStrut/swing link"


1998 FSR "Mine's the best...it's a Horstlinkage design with a horizontal shock behind the main frame"


1999 Fisher Joshie "no man...single pivot is where it's at...who cares if it's a URT?"


2000 Sugar "wait...maybe Jamis has it right...let's do the same but flip the rocker"


2000 Kona Kikapu "Still works fine"


2001 Trek Fuel "Hmmm...Kona seems to be doing well..."


2004 Fisher Cake "Single pivot is obviously gonna be better than anything"


2004 Kona Dawg "Still workin' good"


2005 Trek Liquid "Now we're cookin!"
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Old 08-14-09, 10:45 PM   #2
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I'm getting to some sort of point.
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Old 08-14-09, 10:46 PM   #3
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2006 Fisher Fat Possum "single pivot is workin' for us...how 'bout renaming it?"


2006 Coiler "Still workin' good"


2006 Trek Remedy "Still workin' good"


2007 Jamis XAM "Maybe Fisher was on to something with that flipped swing link...or was it Specialized? Heck let's just combine the two."


2007 Fisher ProCaliber "Hmmm...I dunno if this is a good idea'...but let's see what all the XC'ers think about a single pivot"


2008 Stumpy FSR "All those years of FSR linkage were wrong...let's abandon what we fed to the publick was the "only way to roll" and go with a rocker link with a vertical shock...its the only way"


2009 Jamis Parker "Maybe we had a good thing goin"


2009 Fisher Roscoe "Maybe Jamis had it right all along..."


2009 Kona Coilair Supreme "Still workin"


2009 Trek Remedy "Still workin"
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Old 08-14-09, 10:47 PM   #4
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2010 Fisher HiFi "Let's try it again...but back to the XC arena"


2010 Specialized Stumpy "Well what the freak...now we don't know what to do."


2010 Giant Glory "Still workin"


2010 Kona Cadabra "Still workin"


2010 Stinky "Still workin"
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Old 08-14-09, 10:48 PM   #5
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Okay...my point...


Specialized had a pretty good thing going right? I know there are minor details that make a huge difference, therefore I'm just talking about the bare-bones basics. Specialized said that their way was the law...until they discovered the rocker link that Kona had been using for how long? Then that design became superior. Now...2010...they're moving back to some hippie retro crap that was designed by...Specialized...back in the long, long time ago.

Fisher has been all over the freakin' map, man. 2010 Fisher is the reason I started all this crap. They basically moved back to the same design as the original MacStrut Jamis Dakar. (which worked well)

Trek has been pretty spotty too...at least they saw a good thing when Kona started wiping their Dawgs butt with Fuels.

All these different designs...you'd think someone would come up with something that works. I know MTB's are pretty infant, but how long does it take to find "The Design"? The right one that works every time?

The only mfgr who seems to have not budged...are like the Cowboys of biking, man. Kona is either stubborn and relying on their silly names to sell bikes...or maybe the multi link design with a rocker link and vertical shock is where it's at.




Will my next bike be a Dawg? A Stinky? Coilair?





Maybe so.

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Old 08-14-09, 10:50 PM   #6
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Ed, The Maestro suspension on the glory and the magic link on the cadabra and coilair are fairly new designs.
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Old 08-14-09, 11:00 PM   #7
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Jamis still not budging

2010 XCR
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Old 08-14-09, 11:01 PM   #8
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Ed, The Maestro suspension on the glory and the magic link on the cadabra and coilair are fairly new designs.
This, I realize and as I already said...the details can make a HUGE difference...yet the rocker link with vertical shock remains. The "magic link" sounds awefully magical though. I'd like to dissect one to really watch it tick.


2010 Giant Reign (Still workin)
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Old 08-14-09, 11:07 PM   #9
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There will never be THE design. My favorite suspension design you haven't even posted yet. Lawwill suspension design.

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Old 08-14-09, 11:14 PM   #10
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Yeah...I think the thread was a round-about way of showing the irony over the years.


Oh Lawwill was a freakin' genius though. And that one's absolutely beautiful.

Back in the day...straight six and four bangers woohooo.

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Old 08-14-09, 11:17 PM   #11
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And these
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Old 08-14-09, 11:19 PM   #12
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it also seems odd to me as well...
in motocross in 1981ish everyone jumped on the single shock Pro-Link/Uni-Trak/MonoShock (cant recall Suzuki's version) Yamaha even said their Gary Fisher horizontal style was so good they would never do a vertically mounted shock, they did though!!! etc etc band wagon...
we were promised different rise rate longer travel plushness etc etc etc.
I think Horst even had his hand in some early motocross suspensions with Can-Am Bombardier...
.
alas I also have a point...
.
few years back i grab a dirt bike magazine and low and behold they are talking about old dual shock suspension and how the only real gain with single shocks with linkage was longer travel... but the rising rates rebound rates and all was almost identical to the old set up...
.
although i havent been an avid mtber for very long i have follwed the bikes and their evolution...
.
love this thread... and it is intruiging with millions spent in development for MX/offroad motorcycles that are so closely related to mtbs... why hasn't a clear design come around that has lasted?

KONA seems to have as well as Specialized...
.
intruiging for sure...

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Old 08-14-09, 11:22 PM   #13
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It appears to me that Kona hadn't changed diddly until the Magic link, and Specialized didn't change anything until they went with the rocker link...tried it...didn't dig it...went back.

None of it matter, i guess. The Nomad is supposed to be the bike to end all bikes, right?
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Old 08-15-09, 12:49 AM   #14
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Go Kona!

lol
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Old 08-15-09, 12:51 AM   #15
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I think I shall name my child 'Kona' .........
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Old 08-15-09, 12:59 AM   #16
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LOL!

It wouldnt be that bad of a name, it'd be different lol.
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Old 08-15-09, 05:55 AM   #17
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You should name your child Cheeto....or Humuhumunukuhukuapua'a.
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Old 08-15-09, 07:36 AM   #18
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Tha magic link looks more like a marketing trick more than anything. The local Kona dealer was like..."check this out,a 4" xc bike can go to 6.7 inches if you need it".....Why?
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Old 08-15-09, 08:01 AM   #19
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There are worse names anyway. You could be naming your child Giant. Or Yeti. Or Evil.
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Old 08-15-09, 08:58 AM   #20
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Tha magic link looks more like a marketing trick more than anything. The local Kona dealer was like..."check this out,a 4" xc bike can go to 6.7 inches if you need it".....Why?
I'm soooo freakin' tempted to "Visa" that Dawg Dlx at Wheelworld.com for a future build before Kona decides to get lost in the hype. It's such a great deal...I just can't convince the wife though.
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Old 08-15-09, 08:59 AM   #21
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There are worse names anyway. You could be naming your child Giant. Or Yeti. Or Evil.
Or Stiffy, or Handjob, or ________(enter another Cove favorite...sick b'tards)
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Old 08-15-09, 09:43 AM   #22
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There are worse names anyway. You could be naming your child Giant. Or Yeti. Or Evil.
or Specialized.
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Old 08-15-09, 10:56 AM   #23
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or nomad
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Old 08-15-09, 12:23 PM   #24
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.....all my kids are Evil.
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Old 08-15-09, 12:56 PM   #25
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a few quick pics of what the motorcycle industry has done... looks very similar...

http://www.carbibles.com/suspension_bible_bikes.html a link to the actual page that is some pretty good tech stuff...
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