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Old 11-16-04, 12:37 AM   #1
dkinaev
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Noob needs some advice please!

Hey guys,

My name is Dmitri, and I am from Brisbane, Australia. I used to have a bike as a kid maybe 5 years ago. Now I am 19, have a trail bike (wr200) and love riding. But something urges me to buy a mountain bike as well.

I dont have much money but I am constanty seeing these bike on ebay. The brand is Greenwood and it has all shimano gear on it. This for example: ebay link

it sells for around 250 AUD. It has both front and rear shocks, alloy parts and they look pretty good.

I weigh 72 kgs, and will ride some road, flattrack, a bit of offraod some bush, little jumps etc...

Are these bike good for my applicaiton? Or is it all just a scam??

-Cheers guys, you all seem like a great bunch,

regards,
Dmitri.
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Old 11-16-04, 12:51 AM   #2
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whoa - that rear triangle looks dodgy and flimsy... and "designer artwork"?! what the... no sir, i cannot endorse it. there's very little out there that can be called "competent" on the trails that's a new bike under AUD500. used bikes maybe. but as far as new sub-AUD300 bikes go, i'd trust ebay item # 7114026126 a BIT more ebay norco

if you stick to a really low price range, try to avoid dual suspension, i'm guessing they'd be really flimsy.

i know fitness first in sydney has a promotion to win a norco mtb - not sure what model but with acera components, if brissie fitness first has the same promotion on you might go for it?
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Old 11-16-04, 01:36 AM   #3
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That bike looks all sorts of dodgy.. I'd avoid it and like FunkyChicken says, probably a good idea to stay away from full suspension bikes at that price point. That thing looks like it would bob like crazy while pedalling. It's best to learn on a hardtail anyway.
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Old 11-16-04, 02:28 AM   #4
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"Hi-ten suspension, tig welding, super strong."
bull****, chromoly strong, tensile BAD!.
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Old 11-16-04, 02:34 AM   #5
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I think they KNOW Hi Tensiile steel is bad.... so they try to juice it up by calling it "Hi-Ten" which sounds a lot like Hi-Tech, thereby confusing the uninformed buyer.
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Old 11-16-04, 02:38 AM   #6
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Maybe we should market tin foil as Ti-Fo?
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Old 11-16-04, 02:41 AM   #7
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people would be like "OMG!! Titanium Foil?!?!?!?"
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Old 11-16-04, 02:45 AM   #8
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"weight APPROXIMATELY 17kg"- I would get very tired of pushing that much weight combined with my own not inconsiderable bulk around
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Old 11-16-04, 02:47 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiyn
Maybe we should market tin foil as Ti-Fo?
maybe thats why people sometimes call aluminium just "alloy" ----like ALuminium alLOY -it is all a clever marketing trick
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Old 11-16-04, 02:52 AM   #10
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also the words alloy and composite trigger the "wow, hi-tech" reaction in people. There's nothing special about an alloy. An alloy is just two metals mixed together basically. I was always under the impression that every aluminum frame is alloyed with another metal. Titanium is too.. I've not seen any strictly Ti frames yet.. they all seem to be Titanium, Aluminum and Vanadium in various concentrations.
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Old 11-16-04, 02:56 AM   #11
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OK, Thanks guys,

What do you think will be the biggest negative factor in buying one of these as opposed to an expensive one. Remember i dont really want to do huge jumps on it, just mainly road / trail / small jumps etc.. Also why are they so cheap? Are the materials really that inferior? I know with dirt bikes there are the following factors to consider: Frame: steel vs aluminium (al has high regidity, lightweight but ABSOLUTELY 0 flex, that means if stressed hard enough will fracture without warning / steel a bit heavier also strong and cheaper) The swingarm has to be thick and not look too flimsy, and the forks have to be thick and also not look like they will snap upon landing! )

Also with dirt bikes fork and shock service is a big issue. If any dirt goes up through the seals, the fork starts leaking oil and if it scratches the chromium plated surface, you need a new shock basically. Thats a lot of $$$. We also have to re-gas, put fresh fork oil in, bla bla bla... Is this the same with these MT Bikes?

But ..yeah.. I would just like to know the difference between these cheap bikes and the good ones.

-Thanx heaps fellas,
regards,
Dmitri.
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Old 11-16-04, 03:06 AM   #12
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I would definetly be avoiding a full suspension bike at the price range, it might even be worth checking out the weekend shopper, i check it out for the hell of it each week and some in there dont seem to be too bad by the descriptions.

Nice to see a fellow brisbane rider on here, where do you plan on riding, Mt-Cootha? Daisy Hill? Anyway just curious
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Old 11-16-04, 03:09 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkinaev
OK, Thanks guys,

What do you think will be the biggest negative factor in buying one of these as opposed to an expensive one. Remember i dont really want to do huge jumps on it, just mainly road / trail / small jumps etc.. Also why are they so cheap? Are the materials really that inferior? I know with dirt bikes there are the following factors to consider: Frame: steel vs aluminium (al has high regidity, lightweight but ABSOLUTELY 0 flex, that means if stressed hard enough will fracture without warning / steel a bit heavier also strong and cheaper) The swingarm has to be thick and not look too flimsy, and the forks have to be thick and also not look like they will snap upon landing! )

Also with dirt bikes fork and shock service is a big issue. If any dirt goes up through the seals, the fork starts leaking oil and if it scratches the chromium plated surface, you need a new shock basically. Thats a lot of $$$. We also have to re-gas, put fresh fork oil in, bla bla bla... Is this the same with these MT Bikes?

But ..yeah.. I would just like to know the difference between these cheap bikes and the good ones.

-Thanx heaps fellas,
regards,
Dmitri.
Read this and learn friend http://www.bikesrnottoys.com/
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Old 11-16-04, 03:48 AM   #14
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I have just read that whole website, but still cannot see anything wrong with these bikes on ebay.

Eg. They have alloy wheels and hubs. Which the website says is good.
The website lists Hi-tensile steel as still a good strong material. (its a little heavier than say al, but hey.. the bike weighs 17 kilos!!!! my dumbells are heavier than that ATM!! My motorbike weighs around 120 with all fluids and everything else..!

I dont know. Any other ideas about it??

-regards,
-Dmitri.
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Old 11-16-04, 04:31 AM   #15
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Bottom line Dmitri, the bike is made mass produced from cheap components and things, you would be better off looking for a hardtail bike, such as that norco that was suggested earlier, if you buy that bike, its going to fall to bits on you.
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Old 11-16-04, 04:36 AM   #16
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Aight, I get the point.

BTW, Aus_MTB yeah, probably Mt Cootha, maybe even trails that I ride on my dirt bike out near Forest Lake / Browns Plains (Paradise rd etc..)

Yeah, looks like I will be looking for someting a bit more quality then!

-cheers
-Dmitri.
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Old 11-16-04, 04:38 AM   #17
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hell, just hope the seller stole it and that its worth like $700...

dunno if you want to hear the truth or something to make you smile. I have a $400 duallie which i bought in 2000. It is a POC. So something less cant be 2 good
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Old 11-16-04, 05:13 AM   #18
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Thats really interesting! What problems did u have with it???

Btw there is a Raleigh m10 in there for 250. Any good?? Its single suspension though.

Click Here for the Ebay Link

-Cheers
-Dmitri
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Old 11-16-04, 05:54 AM   #19
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I would stay away from the first bike. Save your money and buy something with front suspension maybe like the second one but it wouldn't be very good for jumps. For jumps you might want something with different geometry(built for jumping).

Last edited by trlpmp; 11-16-04 at 06:02 AM.
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Old 11-16-04, 07:19 AM   #20
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dkinaev I don't think you realise just how inferior that bike is! I see hundreds of those bikes virtually every school kid has one to ride to school and back his parent probably got it from a supermarket whilst buying washing up powder, they sell them at my local supermarket from £80.
I HATE those bikes so much because they are a con, the bikes have virtually no off road potential and they only put the FAKE suspension on them to make them more appealing to suckers who have no idea about bikes (sorry no offence intended).
And as for looking after the suspension or servicing as you put it you CAN'T its not real! the fork is simply a tube with a spring in and maybe just maybe some rubber to kinda damp things, the forks seals will never break/wear out and oil will never leak from the forks because the forks have no oil or seal's (spring in a tube thats all it is!). And as for the rear pivot PLASTIC! and the rear shock again just a simple spring maybe just maybe the can is sealed so you get some form of air damping but that will leak out pretty quick, the rear shock is most likly friction damped which is like 1905 technology. DO NOT CONFUSE THAT BIKE WITH ANY OTHER PROPER MOUNTAIN BIKE!
And as for that bike looking like new in 2 years time like the ad say FORGET it! it will probably be siezed up and useless.

I recently tried to sell my custom built hardtail which had handbuilt wheels, hydrualic brakes, all aftermarket parts and quality Marzocchi Bomber forks for £650 but he said he wanted a decent full suspension bike and bought a carbon copy of this one http://unitedbike.biz/hunter.htm for £450 except his had rear supension! spec otherwise the same.

I really hate those cheapy FAKE FS bikes

Marc
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Old 11-16-04, 07:28 AM   #21
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OK, thanx so much Evo.
Btw, no offence taken, coz i really do not know much about mtn bikes. Ask me about dirt bikes and I will be able to answer some questions!

That was exactly the reply I was searching for. The good old rule of "If it looks to good to be true, it probably is." comes in to play here.

Just a question about the quality bikes: With suspension, does it require as much maintenance as say a dirt bike suspension? Eg., wash after every ride, check that seals are not leaking, clean seals with either a money note or 35mm film, replace fork oil / regass rear shock ..the list goes on. ??

And would a quality second hand single-suspension (forks) bike be good in the woods? Small jumps / trails and road riding?

-Thanks so much for your replies! -so much quicker than other forums!
regards,
-Dmitri.
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Old 11-16-04, 07:51 AM   #22
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Hmm that can really depend on the forks and the riding you do. I have MX comp forks which are very good entry level oil bath forks, they are part of Marzocchi Bomber range which have legendary reliability. I have had mine 20 months and in that time all I have done is keep them clean no stripping down or anything, and occasionally topping up the air pressure (only on leg has air on my fork) I have heard people reccomend an oil change every year and from what I've heard with regards to my MX comp its not hard to do! My forks still feel good so I'm leaving the oil change.
Some forks like certain Manitou designs have grease ports similar to what you get on dirt bike pivot points which need regreasing more frequently. One of the main reason I got Marzocchi fork was because I heard they were easy to look after and that has been true so far, in the summer I may only clean my bike once a month but if I ride in very dirty conditions I'll obviously clear the muck from the seals after the ride.

Yes I would look for a second hand front suspension bike even some 2nd hand fully sus'd bike are good buys, its just that you need to know what to look for, have another look on ebay and any other site for bike's in your price range then post them on this forum most people here will let you know if its a good buy or not. Try to find a well known brand like Specialzed, Kona or Trek etc.


Marc
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Old 11-16-04, 08:14 AM   #23
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those bikes that are that low of price with fs are usually full of troubles. Give trek a go, it might be slightly more costly but at leaest it has a good reputation.
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Old 11-16-04, 04:24 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkinaev
I have just read that whole website, but still cannot see anything wrong with these bikes on ebay.

Eg. They have alloy wheels and hubs. Which the website says is good.
The website lists Hi-tensile steel as still a good strong material. (its a little heavier than say al, but hey.. the bike weighs 17 kilos!!!! my dumbells are heavier than that ATM!! My motorbike weighs around 120 with all fluids and everything else..!

I dont know. Any other ideas about it??

-regards,
-Dmitri.
It's a mass market piece of crap. There I said it. Their website is going to blow smoke straight up your rectum when it comes to the frame and components so you'll buy the boat anchor.
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Old 11-16-04, 04:25 PM   #25
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omg Raiyn - your text lost its colour!
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