"How the 29er Conquered America"
11-21-11, 10:57 PM
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My turn to put grumpy guy hat on.
When it comes to thinking about 29r it is important to ask what was wrong with 26in and to remember what companies do - Sell the sizzle, not the steak. There are few things going for 29r and none of them are about the steak - or at least none of them were. What do i mean by that you ask, well around here courses are now being turned into some sort of parking lot crit. These polished MTB race courses are all about speed and "flow" but this flow is the kind any amateur can figure out. This is being done to accommodate 29rs and perhaps roadies too scared to ride the road. I guess this is what it means when a new product makes waves, it rocks the boat of everybody else. These course changes are the only bit of steak 29r owners can actually eat, but it's going to be bitter because it comes at a cost. ****. I am going to miss slow and challenging, it's getting harder to find.
Why do people constantly talk about 29r like they're sooo great? Why can't they just shutup and ride? We have all met somebody, the kool-aid drinker, doing this. It has nothing todo with the actual performance, but with the person's desire to reinforce what the marketing has told them is true and that they've spent their resources properly. It is funny because all these 29r riders parrot the same little toolkit supplied by gary fisher for dealing with mr big bad 26in guy who is stuck in the past yet nobody has actually evaluated them in a meaningful way to determine a difference. You see, when comparing apples to oranges anything goes and all of it is horse ****.
I have tried 29r, yes. I feel like i'm driving a bus when i ride one, i can't imagine doing anything trials or urban related on it by choice. Technology is attempting to ammend the inequalities of skill and fitness among riders, but it's making a mess and ruining my local courses. I don't ride my 26 on the 24 guys dirt jumps, you keep your damn 29r of my sweet 26r course!
When it comes to thinking about 29r it is important to ask what was wrong with 26in and to remember what companies do - Sell the sizzle, not the steak. There are few things going for 29r and none of them are about the steak - or at least none of them were. What do i mean by that you ask, well around here courses are now being turned into some sort of parking lot crit. These polished MTB race courses are all about speed and "flow" but this flow is the kind any amateur can figure out. This is being done to accommodate 29rs and perhaps roadies too scared to ride the road. I guess this is what it means when a new product makes waves, it rocks the boat of everybody else. These course changes are the only bit of steak 29r owners can actually eat, but it's going to be bitter because it comes at a cost. ****. I am going to miss slow and challenging, it's getting harder to find.
Why do people constantly talk about 29r like they're sooo great? Why can't they just shutup and ride? We have all met somebody, the kool-aid drinker, doing this. It has nothing todo with the actual performance, but with the person's desire to reinforce what the marketing has told them is true and that they've spent their resources properly. It is funny because all these 29r riders parrot the same little toolkit supplied by gary fisher for dealing with mr big bad 26in guy who is stuck in the past yet nobody has actually evaluated them in a meaningful way to determine a difference. You see, when comparing apples to oranges anything goes and all of it is horse ****.
I have tried 29r, yes. I feel like i'm driving a bus when i ride one, i can't imagine doing anything trials or urban related on it by choice. Technology is attempting to ammend the inequalities of skill and fitness among riders, but it's making a mess and ruining my local courses. I don't ride my 26 on the 24 guys dirt jumps, you keep your damn 29r of my sweet 26r course!
11-21-11, 11:04 PM
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Some people want to drive their monster trucks on the jeep course.
I was with some people yesterday on very rock trails, the guys on 29r did ok(not one of them ended up leading the group) and some came out with variously bent wheels. I think that trail is safe because those rocks won't get moved easily - ok the whole thing is rocks.
I took a friend out on "my section of trail" the other day. It's pretty slow and rock-crawley. She was on an Anthem 29 and I was on the Komodo. She spent most of her time hiking. She likes plain old XC trails that she can motor up the speed. I do to...but I really like crawling up a rock and dropping off the other end. The trails I've been riding have multi levels. Top level is smooth, groomed, and flowy. The lower "shoreline" level is very chunky. I like both, but I think the lower level favors 26 or maybe even 24 if you can lurch. (which I can't)
11-21-11, 11:18 PM
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grumpy guy hat
I think it is true that mtb racing has become more and more of a spectator sport, by making the course a multi lap venue.
off topic: many road events have focused more on climbing.
everything changes.
I think it is true that mtb racing has become more and more of a spectator sport, by making the course a multi lap venue.
off topic: many road events have focused more on climbing.
everything changes.
11-21-11, 11:21 PM
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this may hurt:
"How the 29er Conquered America" on the Tour Divide.
the year I made my attempt, there was one 26er.
"How the 29er Conquered America" on the Tour Divide.
the year I made my attempt, there was one 26er.
11-21-11, 11:28 PM
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That being said at some point during that race you'll have the WRONG bicycle.
11-21-11, 11:45 PM
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of course the whole thing depends on the rider, and how they can adapt.
11-21-11, 11:52 PM
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verbatim ----> "How the 29er Conquered America" on The Tour Divide
11-22-11, 01:53 PM
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Someone contact the WWE and see if we can arrange a cage match! 5 - 26er riders and 5 - 29ers, winner takes all bragging rights. Payperview on LMN!
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I can't even find my bike when I'm on drugs. -Willie N.
11-22-11, 01:54 PM
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67 start and 15 finish. WOW, that is XC MTBing at the extreme. i say next year we all put $50. in a pot and send dminor, he has experience in distance stuff.
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I think its disgusting and terrible how people treat Lance Armstrong, especially after winning 7 Tour de France Titles while on drugs!
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I think its disgusting and terrible how people treat Lance Armstrong, especially after winning 7 Tour de France Titles while on drugs!
I can't even find my bike when I'm on drugs. -Willie N.
Last edited by Daspydyr; 11-22-11 at 02:03 PM.
11-22-11, 04:59 PM
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You just gotta love the aggressive marketing. They seem to think they're doing me a favor by selling me a slightly different version of something I already own. It's gotten worse in the past six months or so -- they're worried, and they should be. The 29er hasn't conquered the masses yet. The most recent group ride I attended, seven out of ten riders were on 26" wheels.
As for me, I'll vote with my wallet. Let capitalism rule. One of the smaller "all 29" shops in my area has gone out of business. I'm the customer, and I demand 26" wheeled products. The customer is always right. Trying to say I'm wrong will just make me spend my money elsewhere.
As for me, I'll vote with my wallet. Let capitalism rule. One of the smaller "all 29" shops in my area has gone out of business. I'm the customer, and I demand 26" wheeled products. The customer is always right. Trying to say I'm wrong will just make me spend my money elsewhere.
11-22-11, 06:45 PM
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If it was all about never adapting or developing beyond what worked, shouldn't you all be on road bikes built up as mountain bikes? I grew up on BMX bikes and then transitioned in the late 80s to cruiser-grade 26" BMX racing.
For me, personally, at 6' and riding SS mountain bikes with the intent of racing again at 40 - I like 29ers. Why? Because a 26" feels too small on the flats for me. I don't know why. If I was in a heavy climbing area, maybe the 26er wouldn't feel so much like riding my son's 24. I've ridden plenty of 26" mountain bikes (hardtails) in my time. They feel snappy, but I always feel like I have to have a 4' seatpost. Also, outside the Surly 1x1 - none of the companies I trust, like or buy from actually make a 26-inch single speed.
For me, personally, at 6' and riding SS mountain bikes with the intent of racing again at 40 - I like 29ers. Why? Because a 26" feels too small on the flats for me. I don't know why. If I was in a heavy climbing area, maybe the 26er wouldn't feel so much like riding my son's 24. I've ridden plenty of 26" mountain bikes (hardtails) in my time. They feel snappy, but I always feel like I have to have a 4' seatpost. Also, outside the Surly 1x1 - none of the companies I trust, like or buy from actually make a 26-inch single speed.
11-22-11, 07:35 PM
#39
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The issue is some companies are replacing 26" bikes in the slightly above entry level market with 29ers, and that beginners are getting steered towards them with no regard to whether or not it suits their riding style. Look at Specialized...you can't even get a decent 26" Rockhopper anymore. You want a 26" Specialized XC hardtail, you either get a super entry level Hardrock, or you shell out over $2000 for a Stumpjumper. I look at the 29er like I do the dirt jumper. For some people, it's awesome. But it doesn't suit everyone's riding style. If you went into a store, and before the shop guys found out anything about your riding style, tried to sell you a DJ because Specialized was discontinuing their Rockhoppers and replacing them with P.bikes, you'd probably walk out with the wrong bike for your riding style...unless your main use was dirt jumping.
11-22-11, 08:22 PM
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You just gotta love the aggressive marketing. They seem to think they're doing me a favor by selling me a slightly different version of something I already own. It's gotten worse in the past six months or so -- they're worried, and they should be. The 29er hasn't conquered the masses yet. The most recent group ride I attended, seven out of ten riders were on 26" wheels.
As for me, I'll vote with my wallet. Let capitalism rule. One of the smaller "all 29" shops in my area has gone out of business. I'm the customer, and I demand 26" wheeled products. The customer is always right. Trying to say I'm wrong will just make me spend my money elsewhere.
As for me, I'll vote with my wallet. Let capitalism rule. One of the smaller "all 29" shops in my area has gone out of business. I'm the customer, and I demand 26" wheeled products. The customer is always right. Trying to say I'm wrong will just make me spend my money elsewhere.
11-22-11, 08:45 PM
#41
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Innovation and new technology is fine. Some technology is great! Full-suspension mountain bikes? Index shifting? Disc brakes? 15QRs and Maxles on short travel bikes? Dropper posts? Awesome. Other technology never caught on. Suspension on BMX bikes? 96er/69ers? Lots of other stuff that I can't even think of because it disappeared not long after it appeared, or never got past a really niche market? And then you have stuff that's good for some uses, and bad for others. That's the 29er. It's great that it's around for the people whose riding it suits. That's not the issue.
The issue is some companies are replacing 26" bikes in the slightly above entry level market with 29ers, and that beginners are getting steered towards them with no regard to whether or not it suits their riding style. Look at Specialized...you can't even get a decent 26" Rockhopper anymore. You want a 26" Specialized XC hardtail, you either get a super entry level Hardrock, or you shell out over $2000 for a Stumpjumper. I look at the 29er like I do the dirt jumper. For some people, it's awesome. But it doesn't suit everyone's riding style. If you went into a store, and before the shop guys found out anything about your riding style, tried to sell you a DJ because Specialized was discontinuing their Rockhoppers and replacing them with P.bikes, you'd probably walk out with the wrong bike for your riding style...unless your main use was dirt jumping.
The issue is some companies are replacing 26" bikes in the slightly above entry level market with 29ers, and that beginners are getting steered towards them with no regard to whether or not it suits their riding style. Look at Specialized...you can't even get a decent 26" Rockhopper anymore. You want a 26" Specialized XC hardtail, you either get a super entry level Hardrock, or you shell out over $2000 for a Stumpjumper. I look at the 29er like I do the dirt jumper. For some people, it's awesome. But it doesn't suit everyone's riding style. If you went into a store, and before the shop guys found out anything about your riding style, tried to sell you a DJ because Specialized was discontinuing their Rockhoppers and replacing them with P.bikes, you'd probably walk out with the wrong bike for your riding style...unless your main use was dirt jumping.
11-26-11, 10:33 PM
#42
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I suspect that folks in my demographic (middle-age, want to stay fit, enjoy the outdoors, and have decent disposable income) are a sizeable part of the target market for many of the 29ers being sold out there for recreational use.
I'm a regular roadie, but a MTB neophyte (but with a decent bit of off-road MC experience). At 51 years old, I want to pursue recreational/fitness mountain biking and sometimes simply enjoy something different than just cranking out the miles for 2-3 hours, 3 times a week.
When shopping for a MTB, I rode 26" and 29" bikes, FS and hardtail. I bought what I liked riding the best that was within my self-imposed budget, which was a Felt Nine hardtail. I don't pay any attention to what competitive riders favor and figure that stuff wouldn't truly translate well to my needs. The trails I ride around here are not really technical, but just interesting (and narrow) enough to be fun and a good workout. The 29er that's good for me (at 6'2" and 220#) and my uses may well be the wrong thing for someone else.
Come to think of it, it may be time to go kick that doc who rides the 650-wheeled bike out of our roadie group. Weirdo.
I'm a regular roadie, but a MTB neophyte (but with a decent bit of off-road MC experience). At 51 years old, I want to pursue recreational/fitness mountain biking and sometimes simply enjoy something different than just cranking out the miles for 2-3 hours, 3 times a week.
When shopping for a MTB, I rode 26" and 29" bikes, FS and hardtail. I bought what I liked riding the best that was within my self-imposed budget, which was a Felt Nine hardtail. I don't pay any attention to what competitive riders favor and figure that stuff wouldn't truly translate well to my needs. The trails I ride around here are not really technical, but just interesting (and narrow) enough to be fun and a good workout. The 29er that's good for me (at 6'2" and 220#) and my uses may well be the wrong thing for someone else.
Come to think of it, it may be time to go kick that doc who rides the 650-wheeled bike out of our roadie group.
Weirdo.
11-27-11, 07:37 AM
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Don't blink, but 650B is soon to be the new 29er when the world realizes you can have a snappy quick bike with rollover capabilities. For 2012 Jamis or is it KHS has like 6 650B models, it's only a matter of time until TREK or Specialized is going to be forced into this wheelsize also. The 650B will be the new NEXT greatest marketing push as 29 sales flatten out.
11-27-11, 10:16 AM
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This was a much better experience than deciding between a paraglider and a hang glider 10 yrs ago - now there's a rigged market if ever I've seen one. Those guys were hardly listening to what I had to say.
Last edited by ChasH; 11-27-11 at 10:20 AM.
11-27-11, 12:33 PM
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Don't blink, but 650B is soon to be the new 29er when the world realizes you can have a snappy quick bike with rollover capabilities. For 2012 Jamis or is it KHS has like 6 650B models, it's only a matter of time until TREK or Specialized is going to be forced into this wheelsize also. The 650B will be the new NEXT greatest marketing push as 29 sales flatten out.
11-27-11, 12:37 PM
#46
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I hear full suspension single-speed 28ers are gonna be the next big thing. Oh wait, that was in 1905 
Clement 1905 full suspension safety bicycle by Bristolbikes, on Flickr
Clement 1905 full suspension safety bicycle by Bristolbikes, on Flickr
Clement 1905 full suspension safety bicycle by Bristolbikes, on Flickr
Clement 1905 full suspension safety bicycle by Bristolbikes, on Flickr
11-28-11, 04:19 AM
#47
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11-28-11, 07:42 AM
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There is a functional reason why the 29'er is taking over, it's not marketing hype, rather it is the response to the biggest marketing hype ever inflicted on the riding public, the FS MTB. A FS bike that's good enough for real riding starts ~$2500 and takes lots of dorking around to tune it for the rider. It's been hype'd as the bike real men ride, "Watch the World Cup!", as if that's good for most riders. Along comes the HT 29'er...rigid or suspension fork, it works for 99% MTB'ers. No need to tune the rear shock, just pump the fork to the rated psi based on rider weight. Riders are happier, shops are happier, it is that simple.
11-28-11, 10:35 AM
#49
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^^ I love it when 'Mr. IGH' pops back in every now and then to the MTB forum and graces us with his infinite wisdom and pithy insights 
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