J-McKech

I test rode the Hoss and the Dawg and the Coiler. I loved them all, I love they way the shifted and felt. Although I didn't take kindly to the FS's. I just didn't like the fact it felt semi-out of control in the rear end, I don't know how to explain it, it just didn't feel right. I rode the Hoss (wanted the Stuff). The guy said the Hoss was basically the Stuff, just the stuff had more travel, A LOT more travel. He didn't have an Stuff's in the store so he ordered me one, a large. My question is what happens if for some crazy reason I hate it and don't want to buy it. Am I obligated to buy it because he ordered it? The Hoss was an 18in, is that Kona's large? It felt kinda cramped to me but then I have been riding GF and I hear their geometry kinda stretches a rider out so maybe just some getting use too? I just feel this is a big buy for me and I wanna make sure I'm doing everything right. Thanks guys.

Maelstrom 

No you should be obliged. Kona's large used to be 19".

Kona's have a shortish tt. I feel cramped on them now that I ride a specialized and my transition. You can get used to it or simply buy a slightly longer stem.

The stuff and hoss shouldn't be the same bike exactly. the geometry is the same but the sizing is different. The stuff used to be a tiny dj bike (2003 and 2004) while the hoss fit like a xc/fr bike. Definately try the stuff out, it may feel even more cramped/small.

mindbogger

Ummm...

I don't think you should be obliged to buy it if it doesn't fit. If they force you to buy it, say no and walk away.

seely

Really thats a question you should have asked him when you ordered... different shops have different policies, though if we require a purchase, generally we ask for a deposit at the time of ordering. Its a hot bike in a common size so I'd say theres a good chance you aren't obligated to buy.

J-McKech

I didn't say, "hey order it for me." He offered to order it for a test ride. In fact, he wrote on the slip "Order for test ride, Stuff L." So I'm assuming that I'm no obligated to buy it. I just hope its big enough, I guess time will only tell.

Maelstrom 

Typo...I meant shouldn't haha

handlebarsfsr

you get used to that feeling on the back end really quick (of a f/s bike), and you learn to love it. it feels weird for the first couple of rides, but after that, its all gravy. get a f/s bike, you'll thank yourself for it.

hooligan

Hm, for me, I love the standover height. The stuff doesn't have too much more travel. The difference is pure strength. I would think the Stuff is more dirt jump/ free ride oriented, compared to the hoss, and basically, it's less effiecient, but will take a ton of abuse. These bikes are supposed to be small for djing. You don't wanna break your package into many teeny pieces, now would you?

Maelstrom 

Hoss is the same if not stronger. They put some extra gussets on the chainstay like the old 2002 roast.

DjRider04

2001 and 2002 Kona's rocked, I think they went downhill from there......except the Stab line.

hooligan

Hoss is same as stuff? You're kidding! (Why aren't the dj lines looking like the hoss lines then?)

EDIT: Sorry, I thought the hosses were like wiry things. I guessed wrong. Still, shouldn't djers be stronger than big guy bikes?

hooligan

Wait we're talking about 2004 right?

handlebarsfsr

the hoss is simply the clydesdale specific hardtail. i belive that its geared toward more general riding rather than dj/fr. its just built tough to withstand a heavy rider, not big jumps and such. im sure it would work for a dj bike, but the stuff is a more fr/dj specific hardtail.

Maelstrom 

Stab line has gotten good, Stinky isn't bad (now the stinky deelux I think is basically a 2002 stab)

For a little history holligan. 2002 was roast, chute and stuff. Only diff was more gussetts on the chainstay of the roast and chute which, in theory, made the bike stronger.
2003 they made the hoss which in reality was the 2002 roast/chute frame and used the exact same geometry to make the stuff (dj series) smaller. Same bike, just small. They did this because big guys, like myself, were buying the roast because it was tough and had a fr geometry. When in reality kona wanted these bikes (roast and stuff and then 2003.5 the cowan) to be for djing and fr. So they split the line kept one normal sized (hoss) and shrunk (stuff) the other. (they even advertised this point in the early 2003 catelog)
2004 I think are the same (I could be wrong) but they still look the same, just different sizing. Again same reasoning to 2003.
2005 there does seem to be a slight change in the way the tt is welded to the downtube and how the headtube attaches. But really the change seems small.

The bikes can both hande the same loads they are just advertised differently and are different sizes. The old 19" roast in 2002 was a real 19". The 2003 and 2004 roast in 19" is tiny.
The only thing I am not sure of is if they continued the enchanced chainstay into 2003.

hooligan

Okay. I get it. Now.

J-McKech

Well scratch Kona. I called the guy back and told him not to order it. I was worried that the Large was going to be too small being that the L is 17" while the hoss I rode was 18". So I'm back to square one, I did test ride a Cannondale Prophet and boy was it SWEET! Too bad its a tad bit outta my price range. I am going to see about ordering a Norco or a Cove, only problem is...no one is Texas carries either so I don't want to order one blindly off the internet. Any suggestions?

Maelstrom 

If you know the geometry you currently like you could buy blindly.

What about a neighbouring state for norco. Also if you like the 18" Hoss you could compare the geometry to the cove bike in question. Should feel similar.

swifferman

But if you're doing urban or free ride the smaller standover height would be better...Unless you're doing cross-country riding than you should be looking at the Caldera, Cinder Cone line up.

So if you're doing tricks, the smaller bikes make it easier but if you're not, and you're not going to do really intense punishing riding, than look at the cross-country line.