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  1. #1
    Senior Member sparks_219's Avatar
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    Shamino Dual Control Durability???

    I'm thinking of going with a new XTR (M975) Shamino hydraulic brake lever, and shifter combo, some may refer to it as the Dual Control System or Flippy shifters. However my friend said the shifters tend to wear out quickly and cause unwanted shifting.

    Is this really a concern???

    Thanks

    Ming

  2. #2
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    I test rode a bike with that crap on it, and I inadvertantly shifted dropping off of a curb with my hand on the brake.

  3. #3
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    I don't know. I know guys that run them for xc and racing and they last fine. I suppose there could potentially be problems with the bushings as it is a 4 way moving lever.

    My biggest concern would be potential replacement costs. Break on of those and you are broke

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    And compatibility with other things. With separate shifter and brake levers, you can easily switch between components, but with everything integrated, it is Shimano's not-so-subtle attempt to monopolize the industry.

  5. #5
    Senior Member sparks_219's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom
    I don't know. I know guys that run them for xc and racing and they last fine. I suppose there could potentially be problems with the bushings as it is a 4 way moving lever.

    My biggest concern would be potential replacement costs. Break on of those and you are broke
    Yeah, I tend to crash a lot according to my friends, but I guess that's not a bad thing because we all learn from our mistakes

    Ming

  6. #6
    Senior Member sparks_219's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trekkie820
    And compatibility with other things. With separate shifter and brake levers, you can easily switch between components, but with everything integrated, it is Shimano's not-so-subtle attempt to monopolize the industry.
    I'm going to keep my XT shifter pods so that's not really a concern Now the question is if I should go with 6-bolt XT hubs or centerlock hubs

  7. #7
    Senior Member CranxOC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trekkie820
    I test rode a bike with that crap on it, and I inadvertantly shifted dropping off of a curb with my hand on the brake.
    This coming from someone who "test rode" a bike through a parking lot and made a snap judgement without actually trying them. Based upon the fact that you use the word "crap" in describing these, you lead me, and everyone else, to believe that you had a preconceived notion as to the merits of this particular component long before you ever "tried" them. Give it a rest; you're not qualified to answer the guy's question.


    Sparks,

    As to your question, they are exceptionally durable. I have a set of the XT shifters and have had them for a little over a year. I ride very aggressive XC/AM style and, as a result of that, I have my fair share of crashes and I can tell you, without a doubt, these things will take pretty much any kind of punishment you throw at them. The funny thing is, the first day I rode with them I actually wount up face-diving into a rock off a small, but technical, 2-3 foot drop. I plowed my shifters right into the rock, scratching the crap out of my brand new toys, but I didn't experience a single problem.

    Since then I've literally gone off a cliff (a story for another time), plowed into trees and have just generally thrashed them and they've held up without fail. I'm also not a svelt rider (5'11", 195lbs) so these things take some extra punishment when I pound on them.

    Finally, once you get used to them - and the learning curve is surprisingly short - you will LOVE the fact that don't have to take your thumbs off the grips to shift as this adds a whole new level of stability you never really knew you had. While these aren't for everyone, they are great components and something you should really try before you let people who have no idea what they're talking about steer you away from them.
    "If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein

  8. #8
    Wood Licker Maelstrom's Avatar
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    Meanwhile I know guys who have destroys the levers in a day and ended up going back to the old seperated system. (then again this guy also destroy the awesome new deraileuer on a stick system

  9. #9
    Senior Member CranxOC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom
    Meanwhile I know guys who have destroys the levers in a day and ended up going back to the old seperated system. (then again this guy also destroy the awesome new deraileuer on a stick system
    Like you said, they're probably not suited for FR type riding but for just about any XC application they're great. Again, they're not for everyone but, when it comes to durability, I can honestly say they've been - essentially - bulletproof.
    "If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein

  10. #10
    I drink your MILKSHAKE Raiyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sparks_219
    I'm going to keep my XT shifter pods so that's not really a concern Now the question is if I should go with 6-bolt XT hubs or centerlock hubs
    I Like the idea of centerlock, but I hate how they executed the rotor design specifically the rivet thing (What were they thinking?). If it were me I'd get the Centerlock hubs with the DTSwiss Adapter
    Quote Originally Posted by CranxOC
    Like you said, they're probably not suited for FR type riding but for just about any XC application they're great. Again, they're not for everyone but, when it comes to durability, I can honestly say they've been - essentially - bulletproof.
    I ride XC and I hate them. Besides one crash and you're out MAJOR coinage

  11. #11
    Senior Member CranxOC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raiyn
    [color=blue]
    I ride XC and I hate them. Besides one crash and you're out MAJOR coinage
    Like I said, I've crashed, smashed and bashed them plenty of times and they're still going strong a year and a half later.
    "If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein

  12. #12
    I drink your MILKSHAKE Raiyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CranxOC
    Like I said, I've crashed, smashed and bashed them plenty of times and they're still going strong a year and a half later.
    You must crash like a feather then.

  13. #13
    Senior Member CranxOC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raiyn
    You must crash like a feather then.
    Don't knock 'em 'till you try 'em. I know you're an avid Shimano hater but you simply cannot deny first hand experience. A lot of people have dismissed the dual control levers off hand because they THINK they're going to be fragile and they THINK that they're not going to hold up to abuse, well, perception absolutely is not reality in this case.

    I crash and I crash hard because I ride hard and like to push my limits (thus the massive number of scars crisscrossing my body) and the duallies have held up without fail.

    Don't take this the wrong way but your opinion on this really should be discounted given your hatred for all things Shimano.
    "If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein

  14. #14
    I drink your MILKSHAKE Raiyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CranxOC
    Don't knock 'em 'till you try 'em. I know you're an avid Shimano hater but you simply cannot deny first hand experience. A lot of people have dismissed the dual control levers off hand because they THINK they're going to be fragile and they THINK that they're not going to hold up to abuse, well, perception absolutely is not reality in this case.

    Don't take this the wrong way but your opinion on this really should be discounted given your hatred for all things Shimano.
    I don't hate all things Shimano I hate the new line of stuff that they're forcing on us such as Rapid Rise and Dual Control.

    I have tried them on trails they didn't do anything to impress me. There's no way you can convince me to put all my eggs in one basket like that.
    Levers and shifter pods individually are cheap and you can use whatever brakes you want.
    In a dual control setup you're looking in the neighborhood of $300 and you have to use what they tell you to use. (disc wise)
    No thanks. I like STI just fine on roadbikes where having the stuff integrated makes sense (as opposed to downtube, stem or even barcon shifting) but keep it off my MTB

  15. #15
    Senior Member CranxOC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raiyn
    I don't hate all things Shimano I hate the new line of stuff that they're forcing on us such as Rapid Rise and Dual Control.

    I have tried them on trails they didn't do anything to impress me. There's no way you can convince me to put all my eggs in one basket like that.
    Levers and shifter pods individually are cheap and you can use whatever brakes you want.
    In a dual control setup you're looking in the neighborhood of $300 and you have to use what they tell you to use. (disc wise)
    No thanks. I like STI just fine on roadbikes where having the stuff integrated makes sense (as opposed to downtube, stem or even barcon shifting) but keep it off my MTB
    I can see your points however, I'm not here trying to argue the general merits of the components; as I said, they're not for everybody. All I'm trying to say is that I have first hand experience with these suckers, abusing the crap out of them, and I can honestly say they've held up impeccably. The rest of the arguments are just one man's opinion vs. another, the durability thing, at least where my experience is concerned, is just plain fact.
    "If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein

  16. #16
    Senior Member sparks_219's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raiyn
    I Like the idea of centerlock, but I hate how they executed the rotor design specifically the rivet thing (What were they thinking?). If it were me I'd get the Centerlock hubs with the DTSwiss Adapter
    I ride XC and I hate them. Besides one crash and you're out MAJOR coinage

    If I do decide with a 6-bolt rotor. I will go with a 6-bolt hub. No point wasting money on adapters

    Still not sure if I want to use the dual control shifters, or just shell out the coinage for Hope Minis. I think both brake sets are going to work perfectly for me...

  17. #17
    I drink your MILKSHAKE Raiyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sparks_219
    If I do decide with a 6-bolt rotor. I will go with a 6-bolt hub. No point wasting money on adapters

    Still not sure if I want to use the dual control shifters, or just shell out the coinage for Hope Minis. I think both brake sets are going to work perfectly for me...
    I like the general idea of the centerlock as it does eliminate 12 small bolts from the equation and the adapter simply allows you to use a better rotor.
    I prefer the concept of a single large easy to torque lockring as opposed the current system. I just don't like the idea of rivets holding together a rotor the way the Shimano Centerlock rotors are made

  18. #18
    Go BIG or don't go at all
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    i have to say, i started off as a dual hater. but a buddy of mine just got a bike with them and let me ride it for about 6 miles on our last xc ride, and i was converted. they shift very nicely, and having the ability to shift back and forth (up and down) with the same finger is very nice. can't speak to durability, obviously, but i have to say that in this case change is actually good (i usually hate change)
    If you're not bleeding - you're not really riding!

    clunger

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