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Old 10-28-10, 08:14 AM   #1
SourDieseL
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NY Cyclist - Times eR Changin'

http://gothamist.com/2010/10/27/cop_...icket_cycl.php

Cliff Notes - Cop parks car in bike lane, cyclist go around car parked in bike lane, cop flags cyclist down for riding outside the bike lane, cyclist fined $130, city...PROFIT!

I'm not exactly sure what the new rules and laws are, but I could have sworn I read somewhere that the cycling speed limit is now 30mph. So, let's pay 20-30 salaries to staff officers along the hudson river greenway to sit there with a speedometer clocking cyclist to make sure they are abiding by the speed law.

C'Mon Son!
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Old 10-28-10, 10:47 AM   #2
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If I got a ticket from that guy I'd laugh. I wasn't aware that you had to use a bike lane if one was present, but the conditional part of the law is enough to get out of most tickets. Bicycle awareness is so laughable in most of the United States.

Did you read the one about a Senator proposing that drivers actually be taught about cyclists/"alternative transportation" on driver's ed. exams? It never even occurred to me that I in fact did not learn about that--although the driver's tests here are such a joke that I don't really remember much about getting my license. I fear reading the comments on that article.
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Old 10-28-10, 11:06 AM   #3
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The speed limit has always been 30mph. And yes they are taking steps to deal with autos.

At the same time, let's face it -- cars do not run red lights, drive the wrong way, or go up on sidewalks nearly as frequently as cyclists do. Lots of NYC cyclists are completely out of control, so a bike-specific crackdown makes sense. Proclaiming that cyclists are the aggrieved party when they are so clearly flaunting traffic laws, in a way that is unsafe for everyone, is not persuasive.

As to this particular incident: I concur that the officer shouldn't have parked in the bike lane. However, a) apparently the cyclist went around the cop by riding on the sidewalk, which if correct is definitely a ticketable offense; and b) the rabidly anti-cop statements in that article were made by an attorney. I don't believe the attorney was hired by anyone in the article, but I'm not sure either he or the cyclist qualify as impartial observers.

Oh, and apparently there's all sorts of misconduct in the bike lanes. Cops don't need to park in a bike lane to "force" cyclists into illegal behavior, all they have to do is stand on the corner.
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Old 10-28-10, 11:25 AM   #4
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Shouldn't there be a law (or is there already one) that no motor vehicles shall park on a bike lane? Then the cop should have got a ticket for violation.
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Old 10-28-10, 12:15 PM   #5
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I was cited for "riding" on the sidewalk when in reality I was dismounting to go into the corner bodega. The crack down on cyclists seems to be at the hands of very uninformed police. BTW my summons was thrown out but had to waste a day in dealing with it.
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Old 10-28-10, 07:32 PM   #6
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"The speed limit has always been 30mph. And yes they are taking steps to deal with autos. "

Well, actually their not, or at least they are making no more effort on auto speeding then they usually do. The "crackdown" is on bikes currently. And that's what the street/beat cops are concentrating on.

"At the same time, let's face it -- cars do not run red lights, drive the wrong way, or go up on sidewalks nearly as frequently as cyclists do. Lots of NYC cyclists are completely out of control, so a bike-specific crackdown makes sense. Proclaiming that cyclists are the aggrieved party when they are so clearly flaunting traffic laws, in a way that is unsafe for everyone, is not persuasive."

Agree totally. And not for nothing does it seem they are mostly concentrating on Manhattan and downtown Brooklyn ?. Maybe that's a good thing.

"As to this particular incident: I concur that the officer shouldn't have parked in the bike lane. However, a) apparently the cyclist went around the cop by riding on the sidewalk, which if correct is definitely a ticketable offense; and b) the rabidly anti-cop statements in that article were made by an attorney. I don't believe the attorney was hired by anyone in the article, but I'm not sure either he or the cyclist qualify as impartial observers."

Not for nothing, but this is yet another example of an NYC PO totally forgetting that EVERYBODY carries around a cell phone camera and video recorder !. And as is typical of the NYPD they take an adversarial stance towards cyclists. No real effort at education - which might solve 90% of the issues, but totally based around ticket writing so as to get those statistics into the computer. God forbid a cop ON A BIKE, WEARING A HELMET, actually stop cyclists and instead of writing a ticket, issue a warning and possibly handing out a pamphlet describing the laws pertaining to cycling in NYC and how to get about safely ?. WHAT A ****ING CONCEPT !

"Oh, and apparently there's all sorts of misconduct in the bike lanes. Cops don't need to park in a bike lane to "force" cyclists into illegal behavior, all they have to do is stand on the corner."

As the photo shows, some apparently feel they need to do exactly that if they're going to meet they're ticket quota.

SB
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Old 10-28-10, 11:05 PM   #7
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Maybe we should list some of the most-frequently ticketed areas in NYC, so we'll be extra careful when riding in those areas? I suppose the cops will unlikely ticket you in a quiet neighborhood street with little traffic and few pedestrians? Do they ticket you if you ride ultra slowly like regular walking speed on a sidewalk?
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Old 10-29-10, 05:36 AM   #8
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I just wish that everyone tried to work together.
The City has created a lot the of bike lanes which is great, however the police and other NYC departments do little to address them:

1) Car view the bike lane as a place to double park and drop passengers and the police do nothing.
2) The bike lanes have litter in them and no one addresses them. I rode to the Tour De Bronx last Sunday via the Triborough Bridge
The path on the Bronx side was covered with glass and other litter.

3) The Central Park Bike lane is next to the running lane, the runner use it all the time yet they have a dedicated lane for running. This results in a dangerous situation with cycles cutting into the car lane and a large potential to hit runners or be hit by cars.

As cycles we need to be carefully and polite I find excuse me and thank you goes a long way. I regularly nod my head to drivers waiting for me.

I think the old school protests were cycles block traffic is no longer appropriate and hurt the cause of cycles.


Last edited by v70cat; 10-29-10 at 05:44 AM.
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Old 10-29-10, 07:53 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe View Post
The speed limit has always been 30mph. And yes they are taking steps to deal with autos.

At the same time, let's face it -- cars do not run red lights, drive the wrong way, or go up on sidewalks nearly as frequently as cyclists do. Lots of NYC cyclists are completely out of control, so a bike-specific crackdown makes sense. Proclaiming that cyclists are the aggrieved party when they are so clearly flaunting traffic laws, in a way that is unsafe for everyone, is not persuasive.

As to this particular incident: I concur that the officer shouldn't have parked in the bike lane. However, a) apparently the cyclist went around the cop by riding on the sidewalk, which if correct is definitely a ticketable offense; and b) the rabidly anti-cop statements in that article were made by an attorney. I don't believe the attorney was hired by anyone in the article, but I'm not sure either he or the cyclist qualify as impartial observers.

Oh, and apparently there's all sorts of misconduct in the bike lanes. Cops don't need to park in a bike lane to "force" cyclists into illegal behavior, all they have to do is stand on the corner.
Cars don't run red lights more than cyclists eh? where exactly do you live? come to my neighborhood EVERY SINGLE RED LIGHT at least 1 vehicle runs through it.
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Old 10-29-10, 10:25 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightingguy View Post
Well, actually their not, or at least they are making no more effort on auto speeding then they usually do....
Sorry but you are misinformed. They are making a big push to make sure drivers know that the speed limit is 30mph.

http://gothamist.com/2010/10/22/scof...ng_drivers.php
http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?se...cal&id=7738676


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightningguy
Not for nothing, but this is yet another example of an NYC PO totally forgetting that EVERYBODY carries around a cell phone camera and video recorder !. And as is typical of the NYPD they take an adversarial stance towards cyclists....
Sorry, but one cop screwing up the enforcement is not exactly conclusive evidence that the entire NYPD despises cyclists. I won't say they love cyclists to death, and there definitely are some bad eggs. At the same time, it's pretty clear that cyclists are hyper-sensitive and super-whiny every time there's any sort of cycling-related enforcement, so I find the "zomg NYPD hates bikes" presumption to be lacking credibility or objectivity.


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Originally Posted by cappuccino911 View Post
Cars don't run red lights more than cyclists eh? where exactly do you live? come to my neighborhood EVERY SINGLE RED LIGHT at least 1 vehicle runs through it.
I work all over Manhattan, and I ride all over NYC and NJ.

Drivers in NJ suck big time, for example, but they're still more observant of traffic controls than cyclists on the whole.

I have no qualms in stating that cyclists openly flout traffic controls far, far, FAR more often than cars. The only violation that's more common is jaywalking.
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Old 10-29-10, 01:36 PM   #11
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there is a massive difference in cyclists blowing lights and jaywalking. Many jaywalkers actually hold up and disrupt traffic flow. Most cyclists that blow through red lights do so because they see no car coming across so they can easily cross the intersection and continue on their way. A bike is also a hell of a lot smaller and maneuverable and if there are people in the crosswalk, a bike usually easily swerves well around them while pedestrians have to actually stop in their tracks while a car runs a red light. there is really no comparison
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Old 10-29-10, 03:51 PM   #12
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This is why Armstrong wants curbs put up to keep cars out of bike lanes in Austin, Tx.
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Old 10-29-10, 05:05 PM   #13
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"Sorry but you are misinformed."

No I'm not misinformed, I read the same articles and can tell you that the NYPD can spew out press releases all they want and you can go on believing them, but there is there is absolutely no additional enforcement going against cars on that I have witnessed in both my car commute from LI to Brooklyn nor on my bike commute or as I do fun rides around Brooklyn. Possibly they've targeted Mannhattan ?. But who knows, maybe it takes a few weeks for the rank and file to get the message.

"Sorry, but one cop screwing up the enforcement is not exactly conclusive evidence that the entire NYPD despises cyclists. "

You have to be kidding. Do you live or ride with your head in the sand ?. Go read ANY on-line publication about cycling and NYC and it's FULL of articles about NYPD cops that abuse their positions to hassle cyclists. Ever since the Republican convention in '04, plus all the Critical Mass silliness the NYPD has had it out for cyclists in the 5 boroughs. You have to be blind to think otherwise.

"I have no qualms in stating that cyclists openly flout traffic controls far, far, FAR more often than cars. The only violation that's more common is jaywalking"

Pretty funny as well. How bout speeding. EVERYBODY does it. Go drive any NYC highway - Belt, BQE, LIE, Henry Hudson, Van Wyck, I95, you name it, but think about a couple of hundred thousand motorists daily on roads having posted speed limits of 50. NOBODY does 50. NOBODY - can you understand that ?. EVERYBODY is doing between 60 and 70. EVERYBODY. That alone is far, far many folks breaking the law then cyclists in Manhattan running red lights. Then lets discuss that pretty much no motorists use turn signals correctly or at all. Jeez.....

End of rant

Last edited by Lightingguy; 10-29-10 at 05:09 PM.
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Old 10-29-10, 05:41 PM   #14
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+1 for Lightingguy!
Thank you.
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Old 10-29-10, 08:15 PM   #15
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Plus two
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Old 10-30-10, 06:00 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe View Post
The speed limit has always been 30mph. And yes they are taking steps to deal with autos.

At the same time, let's face it -- cars do not run red lights, drive the wrong way, or go up on sidewalks nearly as frequently as cyclists do. Lots of NYC cyclists are completely out of control, so a bike-specific crackdown makes sense. Proclaiming that cyclists are the aggrieved party when they are so clearly flaunting traffic laws, in a way that is unsafe for everyone, is not persuasive.

As to this particular incident: I concur that the officer shouldn't have parked in the bike lane. However, a) apparently the cyclist went around the cop by riding on the sidewalk, which if correct is definitely a ticketable offense; and b) the rabidly anti-cop statements in that article were made by an attorney. I don't believe the attorney was hired by anyone in the article, but I'm not sure either he or the cyclist qualify as impartial observers.

Oh, and apparently there's all sorts of misconduct in the bike lanes. Cops don't need to park in a bike lane to "force" cyclists into illegal behavior, all they have to do is stand on the corner.
What ?? Do I detect some common sense. BRAVO ! +1
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Old 10-30-10, 06:21 AM   #17
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[QUOTE=




Pretty funny as well. How bout speeding. EVERYBODY does it. Go drive any NYC highway - Belt, BQE, LIE, Henry Hudson, Van Wyck, I95, you name it, but think about a couple of hundred thousand motorists daily on roads having posted speed limits of 50. NOBODY does 50. NOBODY - can you understand that ?. EVERYBODY is doing between 60 and 70. EVERYBODY. That alone is far, far many folks breaking the law then cyclists in Manhattan running red lights. Then lets discuss that pretty much no motorists use turn signals correctly or at all. Jeez.....

End of rant[/QUOTE]
Yeah and almost everyone of them that is cited for speed claims "but everyone else is doing it.." NYC drivers and wild cyclists all have an excuse for why they did it. So let's blame someone else for those actions...good logic. As to the cops and their crack down...There are almost 40 thousand police officers in NYPD and with 1 or even 10 cops that incorrectly write anyone I'd say that's a pretty good ratio . Still perfect would be better, but we don't live in a perfect world. I don't defend officers that purposely violate their oath or the ones that abuse their powers nor do I defend the cyclists that think the rules don't apply to them. 99 chance out of 100 if you are doing the right thing and not drawing attention to yourself when not you won't get written. Why do you think they all speed and not get stopped on the Q or the Grand...because they are all doing it together and not standing out.
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Old 10-30-10, 10:16 AM   #18
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From baiaguloupe;
As to this particular incident: I concur that the officer shouldn't have parked in the bike lane. However, a) apparently the cyclist went around the cop by riding on the sidewalk, which if correct is definitely a ticketable offense; and b) the rabidly anti-cop statements in that article were made by an attorney. I don't believe the attorney was hired by anyone in the article, but I'm not sure either he or the cyclist qualify as impartial observers.

I don't think the rider went up on the sidewalk, But the violation on the ticket was written for riding on the sidewalk.
see the comment exchange,
"So were you riding on the sidewalk? Just because someone's blocking the bike lane doesn't mean you can ride on the sidewalk?"
"I was at no time riding on the sidewalk. I was forced out into the street by the cop car parked in the bike lane, but I did at no time ride on to the sidewalk. However I was issued a ticket for "riding on the sidewalk" likely because the cop had no idea how to designate what I was doing (riding in a bike lane) as illegal - perhaps because it isn't."
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