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  1. #1
    RacingBear UmneyDurak's Avatar
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    I hate local news

    Saw ABC7 "news" today. What a bunch of B.S. Very negative towards cyclists, and using data which I think is flawed.
    I see hills.... Bring them on!!!
    Stay calm and bring a towel.

  2. #2
    Spinning like a gerbel spingineer's Avatar
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    Can you elaborate a little more. What was the context of their story?
    I'm in it to finish it.

    My Cycling Blog

  3. #3
    RacingBear UmneyDurak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spingineer
    Can you elaborate a little more. What was the context of their story?
    Well with couple CM incidents they decided to do a show about cyclists and who is really at fault. They spent most of the segment showing this bike messenger riding against traffic then some interviews with him, but by that point he wasn't all that credible because of the footage. They used him as the representative for all the cyclists. Then they proceeded to use CHP database to tell that cyclists are at fault 70% of the time and three times more likely to be drunk while cycling. Of course they showed the rep from bike coalition who mentioned that statistics are not very accurate because of under reporting and CHP officers not always understanding the situation, thus blaming cyclist when in fact motorist was at fault. She just sounded very defensive in light of previous footage and the commentary. So whole thing was basically playing fiddle to the masses that are against cyclists. Of course adds like "cyclists are at fault" that promoted this piece of "journalism" didn't help either.
    I see hills.... Bring them on!!!
    Stay calm and bring a towel.

  4. #4
    Tandem Mountain Climber
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    Great thing to put into the minds of the motorists... Now if they hit me, the news told them it was my fault

  5. #5
    Direct Hit Not Required BlastRadius's Avatar
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    I missed the TV segment so here's the web story. The whole thing is infuriating to read.
    http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?sec...eam&id=5329449
    http://iteamblog.abc7news.com/2007/0...vs_cars_c.html

  6. #6
    Senior Member waterboy's Avatar
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    What chapped my hide was that they only spoke with one cyclist- a messenger. I am sorry, but messengers are not representative of all cyclists. Unfortunately messengers are often the worst form of cyclists. They are under time pressures and are among the most likely to violate traffic laws. As a daily commuter I am very concerned about the one sided journalism. It would have been nice if they had presented a bit more broad picture of the cycling community.

    The other stat I found surprising was the per capita incendent rate in Marin being the highest.

  7. #7
    Spinning like a gerbel spingineer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by waterboy
    What chapped my hide was that they only spoke with one cyclist- a messenger. I am sorry, but messengers are not representative of all cyclists. Unfortunately messengers are often the worst form of cyclists. They are under time pressures and are among the most likely to violate traffic laws. As a daily commuter I am very concerned about the one sided journalism. It would have been nice if they had presented a bit more broad picture of the cycling community.

    The other stat I found surprising was the per capita incendent rate in Marin being the highest.
    It's not surprising. On the one hand, they did a big story on bike to work day. Then, they turn around and do this. I think what really hurts the cycling community is the Critical Mass. This event tends to escalate the animosity between motorists and cyclists. IMHO, Critical Mass does an injustice to us.
    I'm in it to finish it.

    My Cycling Blog

  8. #8
    Senior Member Dchiefransom's Avatar
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    Is this the same CHP that lobbied against and defeated a bill to make all bike lanes be built outside the door zone of parked cars? The same CHP that doesn't do much when a cyclist is run over and the motor vehicle operator is obviously at fault?
    Silver Eagle Pilot

  9. #9
    Direct Hit Not Required BlastRadius's Avatar
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    Why do the CHP have any say about city streets? Is it even their jurisdiction?

  10. #10
    Senior Member Dchiefransom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlastRadius
    Why do the CHP have any say about city streets? Is it even their jurisdiction?
    If the Legislators have any questions about the Vehicle Code, they ask the CHP.
    Silver Eagle Pilot

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    "Unfortunately messengers are often the worst form of cyclists."

    It is hard to keep from getting emotional about our passion, however generalizing about our
    brothers and sisters who make a living on their bikes doesn’t help the discussion.

    I ride with several messengers here in the SF area, and I find that I really like the majority, with a couple being very special to me. (They are polite and courteous and take things as they come.) There are a very few I choose not to ride with if they are part of the group because they are vulgar and insulting to drivers, pedestrians and other riders. It is about the same if I meet a bunch of folks at a party… some folks just feel more entitled than others, not just bike riders, and not just Messengers.

    If I sit and have a cup of coffee in the city and watch the bikes, I find there are plenty of folks showing a lot of respect, however we have a long way to go before a reporter can’t in a matter of moments find someone doing something shamelessly Boneheaded on a bike.

    Simply encouraging cyclists to follow the basic rules and laws, wearing helmets, getting off side walks; also, teaching folks to look in car mirrors, brake lights, and check the direction wheels are turning or pointing helps shed a little light on the mind of a driver and helps avoid being in the right of way but annoying or hurt none the less. A little respect for others would diminish much antipathy from the non-riding public.

    The best rider I know, rides for GodSpeed Messenger service, and is a credit to cyclists on any level. Blessings.

  12. #12
    Senior Member 1jacktripper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocke
    "Unfortunately messengers are often the worst form of cyclists."

    It is hard to keep from getting emotional about our passion, however generalizing about our
    brothers and sisters who make a living on their bikes doesn’t help the discussion.

    I ride with several messengers here in the SF area, and I find that I really like the majority, with a couple being very special to me. (They are polite and courteous and take things as they come.) There are a very few I choose not to ride with if they are part of the group because they are vulgar and insulting to drivers, pedestrians and other riders. It is about the same if I meet a bunch of folks at a party… some folks just feel more entitled than others, not just bike riders, and not just Messengers.

    If I sit and have a cup of coffee in the city and watch the bikes, I find there are plenty of folks showing a lot of respect, however we have a long way to go before a reporter can’t in a matter of moments find someone doing something shamelessly Boneheaded on a bike.

    Simply encouraging cyclists to follow the basic rules and laws, wearing helmets, getting off side walks; also, teaching folks to look in car mirrors, brake lights, and check the direction wheels are turning or pointing helps shed a little light on the mind of a driver and helps avoid being in the right of way but annoying or hurt none the less. A little respect for others would diminish much antipathy from the non-riding public.

    The best rider I know, rides for GodSpeed Messenger service, and is a credit to cyclists on any level. Blessings.

    well-written. cyclists come in all flavors, just like motorists...and journalists. until these 3 groups of people can come to an "understanding", let's do our own parts in helping to promote the understanding: ride safely, drive safely, and report/write safely. ommmm.....

  13. #13
    100 kW :) ifox's Avatar
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  14. #14
    Tandem Mountain Climber
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    Here is the comment I made yesterday


    This is garbage journalism, with the potential to incite a negative opinion of cyclist amongst the motorists whom have seen this report.


    There are many problems with this report that make it bad journalism:


    1) The motive and resulting effect on the attitudes of the readers. You obviously did not think about how this is going to negatively impact the cyclist-motorist relationship out on the road, where I could be killed. This relationship is already fragile enough due to the hooligans in Critical Mass. Why make it any worse?


    2) Reversing the shift towards alternative modes of transportation. During a time when cycling should be encouraged, you are discouraging it.

    3) Data is invalid. Until the police can treat all bike-related accidents the same way that they treat car accidents, the data will not be valid. Sometimes the police don't even take reports. Either that, or they are not treated as seriously as an auto accident.


    4) Lack of discussion regarding why there are these problems, and what can be done to fix them. Obviously there are reasons, besides blatant disregard for the law, that cyclists may occasionally break some rules. The transportation networks are designed to accommodate cars. To motorists, the cyclists are just "in the way." This is a topic which should have been included in this type of discussion.

    Bottom line is: This report is shallow, and does nothing other than point a finger at someone. It does so with unreliable and /or incomplete data. Unfortunately, many readers will not look past this.


    Thanks a bunch ABC, for being part of the problem instead of the solution.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ifox
    More information on this: http://www.paloaltoonline.com/news/s...ry.php?id=5122

    Isn't this the 3rd (or more) bicyclist killed by an elderly driver in Woodside within the last couple of years? A Foothill College professor was killed on Skyline last summer. A elementary school teacher was killed on Woodside Road a year or two ago.

  16. #16
    Senior Member Dchiefransom's Avatar
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    That's part of the Portola Loop ride. Another cyclist was hit by a drunk driver near that same overpass.
    Silver Eagle Pilot

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dchiefransom
    That's part of the Portola Loop ride. Another cyclist was hit by a drunk driver near that same overpass.
    Do you have any more details on this, like the date or name of the victim? Thanks.

  18. #18
    Spinning like a gerbel spingineer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnny99
    Do you have any more details on this, like the date or name of the victim? Thanks.
    He might be referring to John Peckham, who was riding on Old Page Mill Rd, which is very hard to get to, unless you specifically are trying to get on this road. He rode with Webcor, and was doing a lunch time training ride when a drunk driver ran him over. Can't remember the exact date, but it was about 2 years ago (I think).
    I'm in it to finish it.

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  19. #19
    Veni, Vidi, Vomiti SteveE's Avatar
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    This is in the same area as the incident in which MaryAnn Levenson was struck and run over by a 76-yr old Walter Fred Sorenson in December of last year.
    "Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ...'holy *****...what a ride!'"

  20. #20
    Senior Member Dchiefransom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveE
    This is in the same area as the incident in which MaryAnn Levenson was struck and run over by a 76-yr old Walter Fred Sorenson in December of last year.
    That's what I was referring to. The drunk driver was in the left of two lanes, and went off the road to the right, running her over and draggin her. The bike lane in that area is sometimes wide enough for 4 riders to ride side by side in.
    Silver Eagle Pilot

  21. #21
    Don't mince words Red Rider's Avatar
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    How is Mary Ann? What's the status of the case? I haven't read anything here to bring us up to date.

    Naturally I hope she's better & the driver is incarcerated forEVer.
    When my feet hit the floor in the morning, Satan shudders and says, "Oh, *****, she's awake!"

    Visit my blog.

  22. #22
    Veni, Vidi, Vomiti SteveE's Avatar
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    MaryAnn is riding again. She did the Beat The Clock Time Trial earlier this year. I don't know if she rode it again today. There was an arraignment in early Maywhen the driver pleaded not guilty and the trial is scheduled for September 4th.
    "Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ...'holy *****...what a ride!'"

  23. #23
    Member Jym Dyer's Avatar
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    Question "Authorities"

    Quote Originally Posted by BlastRadius
    Why do the CHP have any say about city streets? Is it even their jurisdiction?
    =v= Yeah, that's exactly my complaint. The data is compiled from police reports all around the state, and the CHP guy simply asserts that they were all biased and done properly, but there's no way he could actually know that. The cited SFBC study is based on testimony that some were <i>not</i> unbiased and <i>not</i> done properly, but they let this guy rebut that with nothing but his authority and his say-so. Indeed, the ABC7 web page itself links to an earlier story about an incident where police refused to take any testimony from cyclists on the scene!

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by spingineer
    He might be referring to John Peckham, who was riding on Old Page Mill Rd, which is very hard to get to, unless you specifically are trying to get on this road. He rode with Webcor, and was doing a lunch time training ride when a drunk driver ran him over. Can't remember the exact date, but it was about 2 years ago (I think).
    Hi, I'm John's mother. The date was September 8, 2006 which was about 9 months ago. The guy who killed my son was high on crystal meth and got 19 years for my son's death. Justice? Not on your life. Justice would have been that guy killing himself BEFORE he ever got to my son without harming anyone else. Just to set the story straight. Thanks,
    M.A.Parker

  25. #25
    Climbing Fool terrymorse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dchiefransom
    That's part of the Portola Loop ride. Another cyclist was hit by a drunk driver near that same overpass.
    The latest killing wasn't even near the I-280 overpass. If you know Sand Hill Road, the collision was before the top of the hill you must climb before descending to the overpass. I saw police spray paint markings on the road and one bouquet of flowers on the side of the road a couple of days afterwards.

    Hit from behind, that sucks.
    Managing Director, Undiscovered Country Tours

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