scorpio516

I'd still rather see the supposed Tracy line finished. Not that that's any closer to Sac than Richmond or Concord... Or the theoretical Hercules/Fairfield/Vacaville/I80 expansion I've heard very little about it.

EatMyA**

ok cool, Thats interesting.

I don't use the train, I just ride everywhere, but that would explain alot.

mayukawa

I knew it was going to be expensive...but I didn't know it was $100M/mile expensive! Everybody, just keep riding your bikes...I could use some company on my commute from San Francisco to San Mateo.

genec

How do you not talk to them... when a conductor has pointed you out.

becnal

F'ing outrageous! I hope the conductor and the sheriff get nut cancer!

murphstahoe

groups.google.com/group/sf2g

parity

I live in Redwood City and work in Cupertino. If I took the Samtrans bus, CalTrain and finally VTA to work the whole exchange is more then an hour to get to work. So instead I ride my bike the whole way and it takes me just under an hour. Caltrain needs to get it through their head that people need to get to & from their stations some how. And in some cases, public transit on the other end isn't a viable option.

The guy was in the wrong by not obeying the conductor. Regardless of the situation, if he told him not to get on the train he shouldn't have. It sucks to be bumped but whats the point of getting arrested.

BigDaddyPete

Makes me forget how much I missed the Santa Clara County Sheriffs. Is it just me? I didn't see his bike come off the train, just his bag. That's the biggest problem with the new trains, fewer seats and fewer bikes allowed in the bike cars. CalTrain needs to wake up to the new reality that there are going to be more and more cyclists and but bike trains at both ends of the train, there's enough room for them to platform an extra car at almost every station. I've seen 20 cyclists on the platform at the Redwood City station in AM. Pretty sure not all of them got on either.

EatMyA**

You keep your mouth shut my friend. Keep your lips and teeth togheter and do what they tell you. EXCEPT TALK!!! Here let me "spell it out"

You are not gonna talk yourself out of anything. You are not that good

all they do all day is talk and listen to excuses. They are PROs at it. You are an amateur.

They are not your friends.

Anything you SAY can be used against you (they write all that **** down)

Nothing you SAY can be used in your favor (you get this part? You cant even help yourself with it, so why do it)

If the officer is gonna give you a ticket you are getting a ticket buddy. (can't talk him out of it)

If they went there to arrest you, you are getting arrested PERIOD! (you are not that charming)

The street is not where you plead your case (its where you lose it though). THE COURT IS WHERE YOUR WORDS COUNT! (unless you told them to the cop)

Cappish?

rog

Nonsense. I've talked my way out of probably a dozen tickets over the years. Hell, I talked my way out of one just recently, with a young cop, by pretending I knew the law better than he did.

EatMyA**

Ask any cop if they have ever been talked out of a ticket. They probably did not have the intention to ticket you when they approached you. Bluf.

You would have come out the same had you just shut up. I don't think any of those cops issued you a ticket and then said "oh heck you're right let me rip this right up for ya!". They didn't write it in the first place did they?

The only people that get tickets for things like not riding on the bike lane and jaywalking and such are the ones that can't keep their mouths shut and are rude.

Point is: either way just shut up, and you'll come out as good as possible. With that man on the video. What they were doing when talking to him IS TRYING TO GET HIM TO INCRIMINATE HIMSELF, because they cant do that in court. If he had just shut up and been totally relaxed and in control of himself like the freaking Kama Sutra, they might have let him go (doubt it). But either way his words (or the interpretation of his words by the officer) cannot help him in a situation like this.

EatMyA**

I understand that some of you weren't raised by wolves, and probably had responsible, able parents that taught you well, and you have a problem with seeming rude. being silent can be seen as rude I guess. like ignoring right?

for these people there is a very polite phrase when pressed for answers:

"I am sorry, I have nothing to say". you can even shrug afterward.

if you live in a big city, chances are they are not your friends, they will be rude to you in a heartbeat. No reason to worry if you insulted them then. Respect is a two ways street right? What matters is how bad are they gonna shaft you. It is your job to make as difficult as possible to have them pin something on you.

sweetnsourbkr

What an absolute waste of taxpayer money and time.

x136 

[OT]

I so very much hope the HSR plan doesn't get screwed up. Sacramento to San Jose/Redwood City/San Francisco in 1.5-2 hours for $35-40 (And that's even if they don't do the Fresno-Oakland cutacross)? Want.

[/OT]

mrlassiter

In agreement with EatMYa**....

Do not give statements to the cops...


https://video.google.com/videoplay?do...85833865&hl=en

murphstahoe

I invite you to do the following.
1) Go to Sausalito with your bike.
2) Wait for a cop to be around.
3) Ride down the main drag outside the bike lane.
4) When (not if) you get pulled over, keep your mouth shut.

I put your chance of not getting a ticket at 0%

My play would have been to shut up as well, but the cops were way out of line - despite the fact that they were being videotaped. The cop standing in front of the camera stating "You're bothering me" is a blatant rights violation.

My take:
1) Conductor did a lousy job - a better conductor would have used nuance to avoid the situation at Burlingame.
2) Conductor did a lousy job part 2. Once the situation escalated into the cops arriving, the cyclist should be asked to exit the train (which he did) and his bag/bike removed, and the train should head Southbound. Perhaps the conductor should also be cited for delaying a train.
3) The cops. Amazingly bad job. Tell the cyclist that somehow he has crossed the conductor, and when that happens you just need to get off the train. If the conductor is in the wrong, file a complaint and maybe you can get the conductor fired. But if the conductor backs off, then he has lost control of his train. Instead they got into a discussion over whether the conductor was right or wrong - that point is moot by the time they get to San Carlos. Attempting to stop the videotaping was blatantly bad from many different angles - both legal and from a PR standpoint. The Police are not supposed to be the goon squad.

uspspro

Not arguing, just curious if you could elaborate here....

How come a cyclist would get pulled over for riding in the lane?

I've rode in Sausalito before, but haven't seen this.

Again, not doubting you, just wondering the details.

murphstahoe

I said "ride outside the bike lane". When you say "riding in the lane" do you mean riding in the primary traffic (car) lane? The law states that cyclists must ride in the bike lane when one is present except for a host of conditions - debris in the lane, overtaking, etc...

Sausalito is notorious for citing cyclists for being outside the lane. The primary reference I can cite points you to the GGTC mailing list on yahoogroups, or sfbike lists on lists.riseup.net

DiabloScott

Is this a Sausalito law? I've read the CVC a lot and I'm pretty sure it never says you have to be in the bike lane (although I've heard cops say that.)

The CVC says if there's no traffic or if you're travelling at the same speed as traffic then you ARE traffic and can take the lane. Otherwise you have to ride as far to the right as practicable except for debris, passing, etc... like you mention.

murphstahoe

Here is the relevant code. Certainly if you are traveling at the same speed as traffic you can go outside the bike lane. If there is no traffic, there probably won't be a cop monitoring traffic (or being a part of traffic) so that's sort of moot. If there is no bike lane, and a cop pulls you over for impeding traffic, you can use all sorts of arguments to protest that you were as far right as practicable, which is a subjective concept. For example on a descent I would pull out all sorts of literature indicating that the safest route through a corner is to come in wide and apex late through the inside of the road.

If there is a bike lane, and you aren't in it, you would be more hard pressed to show a hazardous condition - point at debris, a car, a pothole, etc...

My statement does not really apply so much to the chaos that is the tourist center of Sausalito, but the section from the North end of the tourist section to Mike's Bike's, where traffic goes at 35 MPH. The common ticket scenario is 2 cyclists riding side by side having a chat, leftmost cyclist on the outside left of the bike lane - cop pulls cyclist over for riding outside the bike lane.

https://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21208.htm

21208. (a) Whenever a bicycle lane has been established on a roadway pursuant to Section 21207, any person operating a bicycle upon the roadway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at that time shall ride within the bicycle lane, except that the person may move out of the lane under any of the following situations:

(1) When overtaking and passing another bicycle, vehicle, or pedestrian within the lane or about to enter the lane if the overtaking and passing cannot be done safely within the lane.

(2) When preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.

(3) When reasonably necessary to leave the bicycle lane to avoid debris or other hazardous conditions.

(4) When approaching a place where a right turn is authorized.

DiabloScott

In other words, "as far to the right as practicable" is presumed to be in the bike lane if one is there. I have to say I don't object to that. And to be clear, bike lane here refers to a Class II bikeway, not a Class I (separated lane like MUP).

Not saying the tourist police aren't jerks or that they understand the law, or that they accurately and objectively enforce it; just that the law itself seems reasonable.

murphstahoe

I agree - my point (if we look back) was that if you get pulled over for this in Sausalito, being nice to the cop and keeping your mouth shut won't get you off with a warning. Once pulled over, you are going to get tagged - unless you can specifically support a real rationale that you are not in violation - for example pointing out that there are rows of nails in the bike lane.

mwu

Slightly (or not so slightly) off topic, but those cops need to hop on a couple of bikes themselves. I can't be expected to feel safe when a couple of heavyweights like that are the ones working the street. Then again, maybe that's why they're the ones to respond to the Caltrain "cycling misdemeanor" calls.

One of my major pet peeves - fat cops.