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View Poll Results: Does LL stand for Levi Leipheimer or Lazy Loser?
LL = Levi Leipheimer! 54 80.60%
LL = Lazy Loser 13 19.40%
Voters: 67. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-18-07, 11:55 PM   #1
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LL = Levi Leipheimer or Lazy Loser?

Does LL stand for Levi Leipheimer or Lazy Loser?

I mean, is LL really holding back for the TTs and to attack in the Pyrenees?
Or is he, well, a Lazy Loser?

Vote before Saturday.
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Old 07-18-07, 11:58 PM   #2
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*sigh* What is with all of the hate on Levi?

Even if he cracks during the TT, or in the Pyrenees, that doesn't IMO mean he is lazy.

If that is your failed attempt at humor, then I apologize.
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Old 07-19-07, 01:22 AM   #3
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If that is your failed attempt at humor, then I apologize.
If that's the case, I hardly think you should be doing the apologizing. While things might not go the way Levi would like them to, I see no justification for either of the alliterative labels that HelmetHead seems to be suggesting.
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Old 07-19-07, 06:49 AM   #4
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Halfway through the tour he's a minute 20 out of second place.

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Old 07-19-07, 07:02 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmet Head View Post
Does LL stand for Levi Leipheimer or Lazy Loser?

I mean, is LL really holding back for the TTs and to attack in the Pyrenees?
Or is he, well, a Lazy Loser?

Vote before Saturday.
Tell us how you would do it HH, since obviously you are much more qualified to ride the TDF than Levi...at least in your own mind. Don't you have a bike lane debate or something in A&S to attend to?
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Old 07-19-07, 07:35 AM   #6
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No hes not lazy, but he doesnt seem to have that fire about him that I would like to see. Hes not all that alluring as a personality or in his riding style but he is clearly an effective rider and a podium finish could be within reach.
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Old 07-19-07, 07:36 AM   #7
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nobody riding le Tour is lazy......

but Levi is not as good as many on this forum seem to think.
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Old 07-19-07, 07:41 AM   #8
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Please define how good. Levi is a pretty dang ole good rider. He is a top 10 TDF rider, and a stage race winner. Man I can only dream.

Richard

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nobody riding le Tour is lazy......

but Levi is not as good as many on this forum seem to think.
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Old 07-19-07, 07:54 AM   #9
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Does he have good form? We'll find out in the mountains next week. However, he hasn't shown much to date. Whether this is to plan or not remains to be seen. It does seem that there are a group of GC guys that are very close. That list included Levi ...... for now.

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Old 07-19-07, 08:13 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by bad timmy View Post
nobody riding le Tour is lazy......

but Levi is not as good as many on this forum seem to think.
yeah we all know that vinokourev is a much better rider and is heavily favored to win le tour which he "deserves" .

ed rader
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Old 07-19-07, 08:18 AM   #11
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Lazy Loser. Otherwise he'd go out on solo breaks from the start every day.
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Old 07-19-07, 08:51 AM   #12
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Please define how good. Levi is a pretty dang ole good rider. He is a top 10 TDF rider, and a stage race winner. Man I can only dream.

Richard

But of the GC contenders this year, so far he's in the second tier. That doesn't mean he's not a good stage racer, just not a tour de france winner. Top 10 in years past doesn't equal podium, ask Moreau.

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Old 07-19-07, 09:06 AM   #13
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The question wasn't whether Levi would win the tour. The question was whether he was a lazy loser.

Richard

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Originally Posted by GGDub View Post
But of the GC contenders this year, so far he's in the second tier. That doesn't mean he's not a good stage racer, just not a tour de france winner. Top 10 in years past doesn't equal podium, ask Moreau.
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Old 07-19-07, 09:12 AM   #14
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Another point Levi is in 6th place right now, so your 1st tier must be pretty small.

Richard

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Originally Posted by GGDub View Post
But of the GC contenders this year, so far he's in the second tier. That doesn't mean he's not a good stage racer, just not a tour de france winner. Top 10 in years past doesn't equal podium, ask Moreau.
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Old 07-19-07, 09:42 AM   #15
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Another point Levi is in 6th place right now, so your 1st tier must be pretty small.

Richard
Its the guys who are in the fastest group on the climbs, and can make the attacks. Not the guys in the second fastest group barely holding on. So yeah, its pretty small.
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Old 07-19-07, 09:47 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by bad timmy View Post
nobody riding le Tour is lazy......

but Levi is not as good as many on this forum seem to think.
I agree with this. Who ever the American hope is often elevated to be better than they really are. Mostly out of hope and optimism brought on by Lance Armstrong and to a certain degree Landis. The last 8 tours have been won by an American. So Levi being the biggest american threat is then elevated to hope for that level.

I personally think a podium finish would be a HUGE victory. Top 5 a good tour and a top 10 a dissapointment.

Hes not lazy.
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Old 07-19-07, 09:49 AM   #17
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And I would bet that after the upcoming time trial that he moves up and not down but then so will Kloden big time (small top tier indeed). When all is said and done, you've got to love this Tour, half way thru, no clear winner, no one playing safe and methodically protecting a lead, one bad day and you're on your way out. Really enjoying this one.
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Old 07-19-07, 09:55 AM   #18
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All of the same things being said about Levi were also said about Landis last year. Go back and check the old forums. Levi is a good racer. He could win the TDF, but it is unlikely. This tour is so wide open though, anything can happen.

With no major crashes or meltdowns by the GC guys I suspect Levi will finish 4th or 5th.

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Old 07-19-07, 10:05 AM   #19
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Anyone who thinks Levi is showing weakness by his current performance (or lack thereof) is someone I'd like to sell some nice swampland to. Not saying he will win, but if his strategy is translated into actual performance in the TT and Pyrenees, rather than just wishful thinking, he has a good chance of getting on the podium.
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Old 07-19-07, 10:16 AM   #20
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The thing is, being an attacking fool doesn't win Tours. This year there are two 50k TTs and the bulk of the climbing in the third week. OK, Rasmussen had a big day, but Levi'll easily gain 3:50 in those two time trials and probably a lot more. Beyond that he's only 1:20 out of second place. Being conservative in the first two weeks is clearly the right move. And you might say that it'll continue to be the right move. If he can continue to do exactly what he's been doing he'll only have to compete with Evans and Kloden in the TTs. If he can only match them in the TTs and gain time on just one day in the mountains, he'll win the Tour.

By GGDub's logic, Levi is stuck with Evans, Kloden and Sastre in the second tier with I suppose Rasmussen, Valverde, Mayo and Contador in the first tier. I reckon Levi will take that. I figure the only one of those "first tier" guys the "second tier" guys are at all worried about is Valverde.

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Old 07-19-07, 10:35 AM   #21
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Huh, so attacking doesn't win tours? Better tell that to the last 9 winners.

How will he gain time, if he's always following wheels? Evans, Contador, and Kloden all finished ahead of him in the prologue and Valverde finished just behind him. If you're expecting Levi to put serious time into these guys in the TTs then you're expecting one of these guys to have a really bad day.
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Old 07-19-07, 10:45 AM   #22
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Huh, so attacking doesn't win tours? Better tell that to the last 9 winners.

How will he gain time, if he's always following wheels? Evans, Contador, and Kloden all finished ahead of him in the prologue and Valverde finished just behind him. If you're expecting Levi to put serious time into these guys in the TTs then you're expecting one of these guys to have a really bad day.
There is a difference between attacking and being an 'attacking fool'. What is the point of expending unnecessary energy early if you can wheelsuck and still remain within striking distance of the leaders? The time for attacking will come in the Pyrenees. This isn't the last 9 tours, this tour is the only one these guys are concerned about.
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Old 07-19-07, 10:46 AM   #23
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Levi has said repeatedly that he will attack in the Pyrenees. We will find out if he is just blowing smoke on Sunday.

Richard
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Old 07-19-07, 10:50 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GGDub View Post
How will he gain time, if he's always following wheels? Evans, Contador, and Kloden all finished ahead of him in the prologue and Valverde finished just behind him. If you're expecting Levi to put serious time into these guys in the TTs then you're expecting one of these guys to have a really bad day.
Like I said, the bulk of the Tour is still to come. If he can gain time one day in the mountains and follow the wheels the rest, he'll win the tour.

Ya think an 8k TT is an indicator of performance in a 55k TT? er............well, I'll remember that when reading your posts!
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Old 07-19-07, 11:02 AM   #25
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Yes, you are right, there is a difference. Look up last years two TT's then, if you want a better guide. Hint: You are going to have to look a little farther down the list to find Levi.
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