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-   -   Sitting on the couch, with my fist in the air (http://www.bikeforums.net/professional-cycling-fans/323051-sitting-couch-my-fist-air.html)

Vinokurtov 07-19-07 10:29 PM

Sitting on the couch, with my fist in the air
 
Watching Vino attack, knees with stitched back together, bandages sweating off, 2.5km from the end of today's stage.

In the words of my wife: "Oh my god!"

Followed by a litany of reasons why he should be back home in Kazakhstan drinking fermented goat's milk right now.

Say what you will about the day glo sunglasses, the gold chains, the 3 word interviews. Other than Jens there isn't a single guy in the peleton with that much heart.

No surrender, no quit, die trying. Vino raised a gigantic middle finger to the rest of the race today.

jrmohan 07-19-07 10:37 PM

I was amazed, shocked, awed, bewildered, it was awesome, unexpected, fruitless, but a magnificent gesture to the whole peloton, that Vino would not die without a fight, and one hell of a fight it would be.

Psimet2001 07-19-07 11:28 PM

Day behind on my TIVO, but you've just given me a reason to pull an all-nighter.

sverrefehn 07-19-07 11:50 PM

Love it.
On the heels of that move by Astana, Vino's attack was vintage. Half of the field got a tough lesson in tactics today. The other half worked their butt's off to avoid that lesson.
Awesome.

roadwarrior 07-20-07 03:58 AM

Let's make sure we know why this happened. He was paying back Moreau. They attacked while Moreau was getting medical attention. The break went when Moreau was at the medical car being seen by a doctor (something akin to attacking from the feed zone or while people are taking a natural break). Understand what really happened. I expect they, Astana, will get paid back by a number of teams that got caught out.

It's nice and all, but he's over 8 minutes down. Therefore he has nothing to lose. So what if his team p!$$ed off half the peloton for attacking when they did? Same as how Moreau attacked Vino that day he got hurt.

But this was not some epic ride that will go down in the history books...

Another awesome day for the wild card Barloworld and Cannondale. Two stage wins and the Giro. Another stage win for Liquigas. Pretty good couple of months...

bdcheung 07-20-07 04:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadwarrior (Post 4891764)
He was paying back Moreau.

That's right. And in Moreau's own words, the move was legit:

"What Vino did was not unfair," conceded Moreau. "Settling scores is part of the sport. When I attacked [in the Alps] he was not well. Today I was the one who was not that well."

patentcad 07-20-07 05:12 AM

If there is Peloton Justice Moreau and his team will attack Vino while he is peeing at some point today. That should piss off that little khazako whacko. At which point the rest of the Tour would be in Big Trouble.

El Diablo Rojo 07-20-07 05:46 AM

Great Vino got revenge. How much energy did Astana blow to soothe Vino's ego? How much will that hurt Kloden's chances? Christophe didn't have a chance in hell of winning the Tour but Kloden sure did, now his team has to dig deep over the next couple of days and my not have anything left to give. It was good theater but bad tactics in the big picture. Say what you want about the "Lance years" but one thing that LA and his boys always did was keep their eye on the prize.

branman1986 07-20-07 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by botto (Post 4891872)
I doubt those were "Moreau's own words".

His own words probably went more like this:

Quel Vino n'était pas injuste. L'arrangement des points fait partie du sport. Quand j'ai attaqué [ dans les Alpes ] il n'était pas bon. Aujourd'hui j'étais celui qui n'était pas celui bien.

Nobody else thought that was hilarious?:roflmao:

BlessedHellride 07-20-07 06:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by branman1986 (Post 4892072)
Nobody else thought that was hilarious?:roflmao:

It made me laugh.

roadwarrior 07-20-07 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo (Post 4891995)
Great Vino got revenge. How much energy did Astana blow to soothe Vino's ego? How much will that hurt Kloden's chances? Christophe didn't have a chance in hell of winning the Tour but Kloden sure did, now his team has to dig deep over the next couple of days and my not have anything left to give. It was good theater but bad tactics in the big picture. Say what you want about the "Lance years" but one thing that LA and his boys always did was keep their eye on the prize.

And everyone was so afraid of them and how they handled justice that they didn't do things like this.

Nobody's nearly that good or strong today.

The whole thing made me chuckle.

Teams that are going for wins don't do things like this. It doesn't work.

roadwarrior 07-20-07 06:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bdcheung (Post 4891848)
That's right. And in Moreau's own words, the move was legit:

"What Vino did was not unfair," conceded Moreau. "Settling scores is part of the sport. When I attacked [in the Alps] he was not well. Today I was the one who was not that well."

No, he said it was not unfair (ie he was extracting some payback for the Alps)...this was between them. Pure and simple. What I think Astana lost sight of was all the other teams and riders that this impacted. All of whom may now want to get some revenge. Like not working. Running down their breaks. Stuff like that. Plus they used up a lot of energy pulling that stunt.

The peloton is like a large neighborhood. If you are a bad actor, when you need something your neighbors tell you to p!$$ off...you have to get along and be good enough to win.

smoke 07-20-07 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo (Post 4891995)
Great Vino got revenge. How much energy did Astana blow to soothe Vino's ego? How much will that hurt Kloden's chances? Christophe didn't have a chance in hell of winning the Tour but Kloden sure did, now his team has to dig deep over the next couple of days and my not have anything left to give. It was good theater but bad tactics in the big picture. Say what you want about the "Lance years" but one thing that LA and his boys always did was keep their eye on the prize.

my thoughts exactly. it was fun to watch, but we'll see if it burned up astana enough that they are no help to kloden in the mountains. they might have hurt the chances of their own g.c. man

gcl8a 07-20-07 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by botto (Post 4891872)
I doubt those were "Moreau's own words".

His own words probably went more like this:

Quel Vino n'était pas injuste. L'arrangement des points fait partie du sport. Quand j'ai attaqué [ dans les Alpes ] il n'était pas bon. Aujourd'hui j'étais celui qui n'était pas celui bien.

But then the English translation would have read:

Which Wine was not unjust, arrangement of the points forms part of the sport. When I attacked [ in the Alps ] it was not good. Today I was that which was not that well.

El Diablo Rojo 07-20-07 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gcl8a (Post 4892186)
But then the English translation would have read:

Which Wine was not unjust, arrangement of the points forms part of the sport. When I attacked [ in the Alps ] it was not good. Today I was that which was not that well.

I like this quote better ;)

ElJamoquio 07-20-07 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gcl8a (Post 4892186)
Today I was that which was not that well.

...Especially this part of said quote.

Vinokurtov 07-20-07 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by branman1986 (Post 4892072)
Nobody else thought that was hilarious?:roflmao:

It would have been even funnier if he had thrown in a Gallic shrug at the end.

With one flat stage to sit in and recover before the TT, where his workers can mail it home, the move to get rid of Moreau may not turn out to be all that bad. Frenchy showed a lot of strength in the mountains, and put time into many of the main contenders in stage 8. Now they can just let him go.

The move by Kloden to try to bring Vino back up the other day may turn out to be far more costly.

I just loved the OTF move at the end in any case.

smoke 07-20-07 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vinokurtov (Post 4892602)
The move by Kloden to try to bring Vino back up the other day may turn out to be far more costly.

i think they may both turn out to be very costly. if you're kloden, you've gotta be starting to get pretty fed up with this. i understand pulling vino back the other day; the attack yesterday even makes some sense. but it's all hurting kloden, and he's both stronger and better positioned than vino. he's gotta be screaming at his DS to let him go

SunSwingsLow 07-20-07 11:26 AM

Yet again Vino's crazy ego and tactics hurt his teams chances. Fun to watch, maybe. Smart race tactics, hardly.

godspiral 07-20-07 12:16 PM

I'm not sure a 30 foot breakaway that's pulled back within 10 seconds qualifies for any military medals.

Also, afaik, Moreau attacked in the alps 2-3 days after vino was hurt. Not the day he fell. Theoretically, he might have been more worried about Rasmussen (5 minutes ahead at the time) than whether vino might not approve of his riding habits.

SunSwingsLow 07-20-07 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by godspiral (Post 4894555)
Also, afaik, Moreau attacked in the alps 2-3 days after vino was hurt. Not the day he fell. Theoretically, he might have been more worried about Rasmussen (5 minutes ahead at the time) than whether vino might not approve of his riding habits.

Exactly...Whats he supposed to do. Take the Alps off because Vino got a boo boo on his knee?

DocRay 07-20-07 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by godspiral (Post 4894555)
I'm not sure a 30 foot breakaway that's pulled back within 10 seconds qualifies for any military medals.

with 20-30 stitches after 160km it does.

roadgator 07-20-07 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoke (Post 4892176)
my thoughts exactly. it was fun to watch, but we'll see if it burned up astana enough that they are no help to kloden in the mountains. they might have hurt the chances of their own g.c. man

Yesterday just showed that astana is willing to go down in flames with Vino in spite of the GC potential of Kashechkin and Kloden. In both burning out the team and pissing of the rest of the peloton, this wil only make things harder for them.

I'd be pissed if i were Kloden, he either has no gumption to assume the leadership him self, or the Kazakhs have shut him out.

40 Cent 07-20-07 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by branman1986 (Post 4892072)
Nobody else thought that was hilarious?:roflmao:

Hilarious in the sense that the French is incorrect and unless Moreau was born in Moravia instead of France, he wouldn't have said it exactly like that?

gcl8a 07-21-07 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 40 Cent (Post 4895517)
Hilarious in the sense that the French is incorrect and unless Moreau was born in Moravia instead of France, he wouldn't have said it exactly like that?

Or Babel.


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