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Old 08-31-07, 01:55 PM   #1
sector99
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FL's Positive Result: "Splashed On?"

There are numerous ways to deliver hormones to the bloodstream and hence, the urine ... to be later detected by laboratory tests.

One way is to maliciously mix the banned isotope or other substance with water and "Splash" it on the rider as he or she passes close to "Spectators" (Well meaning tour followers often attempt to aid riders in many ways). Skin absorbtion does the rest and the urine sample will test positive as the test sensitivity is extremely high.

I'm surprised this fact hasn't been raised. It's important becuase Landis can never prove a negative (That he didn't take drugs).

All he can do is (1) establish doubt that he intentionally administered the drugs that were found or (2) that the tests or testers were in error and there were no drugs present.
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Old 08-31-07, 02:04 PM   #2
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^^True dat

was he "spashed on" during 17? I seem to recall that he was alone with a car for most of the ride.
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Old 08-31-07, 03:56 PM   #3
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There are numerous ways to deliver hormones to the bloodstream and hence, the urine ... to be later detected by laboratory tests.

One way is to maliciously mix the banned isotope or other substance with water and "Splash" it on the rider as he or she passes close to "Spectators" (Well meaning tour followers often attempt to aid riders in many ways). Skin absorbtion does the rest and the urine sample will test positive as the test sensitivity is extremely high.

I'm surprised this fact hasn't been raised. It's important becuase Landis can never prove a negative (That he didn't take drugs).

All he can do is (1) establish doubt that he intentionally administered the drugs that were found or (2) that the tests or testers were in error and there were no drugs present.
Utter Cr@p. Both the original Testosterone to Epitestosterone and the Isotope test are ratio tests and NOT extremley sensitive. Simply put neither one is a is it here or not test. No way either comes back positive through the means you postulate.
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Old 09-01-07, 04:50 AM   #4
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Can you define, for the uninitiated, what a "ratio test" is?
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Old 09-01-07, 07:51 AM   #5
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No way osmosis absorbtion could lead to a positive test.
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Old 09-01-07, 11:04 AM   #6
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This is clutching at straws now!
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Old 09-03-07, 03:46 PM   #7
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But what if an unborn twin brother splashed the drugs that were actually meant for his dog, originating from something a relative brought back from South America? (Thanks Hamilton, Vandenbroucke, and Simoni.)
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Old 09-03-07, 04:08 PM   #8
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Can you define, for the uninitiated, what a "ratio test" is?
The test determines the ratio of two things. In this cas eptestrone to Testrosterstone (forgive spelling please) It is an easire cheaper test that measuring the desired element directly. When FL's ratio was deemed off (the results varied with numbers in bounds and out) then another test was done. This test seemed to show that the testosterone was low. (what would the advantage of that be?).

If you go on line and look at the hearing you get the idea that not only was the ratio somewhat subjective, but so was the second test of the "A" sample and the same test done on the "B" sample.was questioonable. If they were sure that he was guilty the whole mess would have been over a year ago.

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Old 09-03-07, 05:15 PM   #9
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There are numerous ways to deliver hormones to the bloodstream and hence, the urine ... to be later detected by laboratory tests.
Since you're following this so closely, you must know that Landis's T:E ratio was high because of a lack of epitestosterone, not an excess of testosterone, which was normal. So tell us, what is the magic compound that erases epitestosterone in the sysetem when applied to the skin?
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Old 09-04-07, 09:21 PM   #10
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The addition of testosterone will change the ratio...cutaneous administration is sufficient to do this.
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Old 09-04-07, 11:53 PM   #11
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If you go on line and look at the hearing you get the idea that not only was the ratio somewhat subjective, but so was the second test of the "A" sample and the same test done on the "B" sample.was questioonable. If they were sure that he was guilty the whole mess would have been over a year ago.
Word. I love the "the machine gave bad numbers so I used my own" testimony.
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Old 09-05-07, 01:06 PM   #12
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Can you define, for the uninitiated, what a "ratio test" is?
It is a test where the ratio of 2 different things gives the final number. In this case it is testosterone to epitestosterone. Both are produced naturally in the body and they are produced by interrelated processes.This means that if their ratio is outside of a given range something is wrong. For athletes if the ratio is high the logical conclusion is that they took testosterone.

A related kind of test is a concentration/level test. Blood Alcohol level is a well known one. Too high and you are in trouble. Again alcohol is a naturally occuring substance and some should be expected in the blood.
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Old 09-05-07, 09:03 PM   #13
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So someone splashed water on him every day he was sampled during the tour? They all came back with synthetic testosterone.

I know there are a lot of Floyd apologists on this board, but this is a little out there as a conspiracy theory.
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Old 09-05-07, 09:15 PM   #14
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Considering that it takes concentrated testosterone being applied in a patch right on the balls for hours to absorb any significant amount of test, it seems unlikely that enough could be splashed on a rider, and stay there long enough to trip the test.

You are also assuming someone had the motivation, means, and foresight to be waiting on the side of a hill for him. This is bike racing.

The only sabotage theory I find plausible is that a lab worker broke protocol, matched his vials, and put a drop of roids in before it was tested. But this is even too far out there for Landis' defense team. Considering the stuff they have come up with, thats saying something.
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Old 09-07-07, 03:50 AM   #15
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Considering that it takes concentrated testosterone being applied in a patch right on the balls for hours to absorb any significant amount of test, it seems unlikely that enough could be splashed on a rider, and stay there long enough to trip the test.

You are also assuming someone had the motivation, means, and foresight to be waiting on the side of a hill for him. This is bike racing.

The only sabotage theory I find plausible is that a lab worker broke protocol, matched his vials, and put a drop of roids in before it was tested. But this is even too far out there for Landis' defense team. Considering the stuff they have come up with, thats saying something.
Was that application point specified because it is where it is most effective or simply where it is least conspicuous?
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Old 09-07-07, 07:27 AM   #16
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I've heard its the most effective, but I'm no doctor.
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Old 09-09-07, 12:28 AM   #17
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But what if an unborn twin brother splashed the drugs that were actually meant for his dog, originating from something a relative brought back from South America? (Thanks Hamilton, Vandenbroucke, and Simoni.)
ROTFLMAO - thanks for this post.
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Old 09-17-07, 05:57 PM   #18
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But what if an unborn twin brother splashed the drugs that were actually meant for his dog, originating from something a relative brought back from South America? (Thanks Hamilton, Vandenbroucke, and Simoni.)


What if an unborn twin brother splashed the drugs that were actually meant for his dog, originating from something a relative brought back from South America, while he missed a test because he was in Mexico (actually in Italy), had extra blood with a different blood type due to recovering from a leg injury, and transformed his body to be a climber due to cancer recovery?
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