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  1. #1
    Senior Member adam's Avatar
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    Kimmage doesn't hold back his feelings on the 'Second Coming'

    Wow, Paul. Tell us how you really feel.

  2. #2
    Senior Member jaxgtr's Avatar
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    Wow, anyone for a cup of bitter?
    Brian | 2013 Cannondale SuperSix 5 | 2014 Trek CrossRip Comp | 2003 Trek 7300
    Quote Originally Posted by AEO View Post
    you should learn to embrace change, and mock it's failings every step of the way.

  3. #3
    Large Member urodacus's Avatar
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    well said, paul.

    it's about the ego. unless he's pissed all his money against the wall chasing Olsen twins around.
    05 Giant TCR Composite; 83 Colnago Saronni: 81 San Rensho Katana Super Export track bike, #A116-56; 89 Zunow Pentaglia: SOLD; 85 Tommasini: SOLD; 83 Guerciotti: SOLD

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    it was on a newstalk (irish talk radio ) morning news program

    i pretty much agree with paul

    "a cancer to cycling"

    http://83.138.170.50/podcasts/audio/2509%20cycling.mp3

  5. #5
    Senior Member adam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ednwireland View Post
    it was on a newstalk (irish talk radio ) morning news program

    i pretty much agree with paul

    "a cancer to cycling"

    http://83.138.170.50/podcasts/audio/2509%20cycling.mp3
    Cheers for that - great find.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by adam View Post
    Cheers for that - great find.
    Certainly not for the industry. It's black & white.

  7. #7
    Senior Member gruffydd's Avatar
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    Question: I do not remember Emma O'Reilly implicating Hincapie in drug use. Was that in the book by David Walsh? If that was stated, I missed that part. This was written in the above piece by Kimmage.

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    i read kimmage's book: rough ride, and it was entertaining enough. he certainly was no winner, but a good whiner. none the less, a good read. as far as what he has to say about armstrong, gee, the word bitter comes to mind. as far as any of you guys that are bashing LA and his comeback, wtf would any of you know about his motivation? the guy certainly races well, and if he wnts to comeback to the sport, he has every right. be a lemming if you want, and sneer and ***** like lemmings do ( oh, and *******, the kind who suck at sports), not one of you would say word one to the guy's face, so really, shut the **** up, take some time, do some homework, and know you don't know ****. i don't either, believe me. i do know the guy raced at a higher level and was never proven dirty, and other than that, i could give a ****, certainly not about who he bangs cuz its not relevant to anything. i can't wait to watch him race again.

  9. #9
    Senior Member adam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    i read kimmage's book: rough ride, and it was entertaining enough. he certainly was no winner, but a good whiner. none the less, a good read. as far as what he has to say about armstrong, gee, the word bitter comes to mind. as far as any of you guys that are bashing LA and his comeback, wtf would any of you know about his motivation? the guy certainly races well, and if he wnts to comeback to the sport, he has every right. be a lemming if you want, and sneer and ***** like lemmings do ( oh, and *******, the kind who suck at sports), not one of you would say word one to the guy's face, so really, shut the **** up, take some time, do some homework, and know you don't know ****. i don't either, believe me. i do know the guy raced at a higher level and was never proven dirty, and other than that, i could give a ****, certainly not about who he bangs cuz its not relevant to anything. i can't wait to watch him race again.
    Wow, Chris. Tell us how you really feel.

  10. #10
    Seņor Member USAZorro's Avatar
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    Nothing any of us can do will change anything. I don't get people getting so worked up about Lance coming back. Anger just raises blood pressure and shortens life. Regardless of your point of view here, there's some element of entertainment to be had. I'm just going to watch what happens.
    The search for inner peace continues...

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    i read kimmage's book: rough ride, and it was entertaining enough. he certainly was no winner, but a good whiner..
    Why do you say he's a whiner? What he says has been borne out.

    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    none the less, a good read. as far as what he has to say about armstrong, gee, the word bitter comes to mind. ..
    Bitter? why? for telling the truth that Lance was doped up to his eyeballs. The Hgh, cortisone and steroids he admitted to taking probably caused his cancer in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    as far as any of you guys that are bashing LA and his comeback, wtf would any of you know about his motivation? ..
    He's motivated to not look like he's nuts like his mom with her 5 husbands.


    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    the guy certainly races well, and if he wnts to comeback to the sport, he has every right...
    It's very stupid for him to comeback because with his hct not jacked up to the mid 50's to 60 he'll be a shell of what he was...I wonder if he'll get to his magic number of 6.7 watts per kg for this TdF.

    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    be a lemming if you want,...
    Who's being the lemming with their delusional belief here.


    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    and sneer ...
    I don't know about sneering, but I am laughing at LA and his followers.

    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    and ***** like lemmings do ( oh, and *******, the kind who suck at sports), not one of you would say word one to the guy's face,...
    So what you're saying is that you have huge props for LeMond because he's going out of his way to get in LA's face.

    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    so really, shut the **** up, take some time, do some homework, and know you don't know ****
    LeMond got behind Walsh's book 100%. Is he one of those disparaging labels you're tossing around. Frankie Andreu just about ruined his career by telling the truth about Lance. Stephen Swart, what does he have to gain?

    Quote Originally Posted by chris175 View Post
    . i don't either, believe me. i do know the guy raced at a higher level and was never proven dirty, and other than that, i could give a ****, certainly not about who he bangs cuz its not relevant to anything. i can't wait to watch him race again.
    Chris, Chris, take a quaalude, a xanax or a valium, a deep breath maybe, something..

    Peace.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAZorro View Post
    Nothing any of us can do will change anything. I don't get people getting so worked up about Lance coming back. Anger just raises blood pressure and shortens life. Regardless of your point of view here, there's some element of entertainment to be had. I'm just going to watch what happens.
    +100.........I dont expect Lance to win but why all the haters??????????????

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reid Rothchild View Post
    Why do you say he's a whiner? What he says has been borne out.



    Bitter? why? for telling the truth that Lance was doped up to his eyeballs. The Hgh, cortisone and steroids he admitted to taking probably caused his cancer in the first place.



    He's motivated to not look like he's nuts like his mom with her 5 husbands.




    It's very stupid for him to comeback because with his hct not jacked up to the mid 50's to 60 he'll be a shell of what he was...I wonder if he'll get to his magic number of 6.7 watts per kg for this TdF.



    Who's being the lemming with their delusional belief here.




    I don't know about sneering, but I am laughing at LA and his followers.



    So what you're saying is that you have huge props for LeMond because he's going out of his way to get in LA's face.



    LeMond got behind Walsh's book 100%. Is he one of those disparaging labels you're tossing around. Frankie Andreu just about ruined his career by telling the truth about Lance. Stephen Swart, what does he have to gain?



    Chris, Chris, take a quaalude, a xanax or a valium, a deep breath maybe, something..

    Peace.
    did you read rough ride? all the guy did was abandon race after race and whine about it. have some guts, try to be stoic, respect the sport. yeah, i can appreciate that lemond spoke his mind to LA's face, i really can. point is, there is a lot of ****slinging going on, by people who have no clue. and i consider paul kimmage one of them. he is bombastic and empassioned, but christ is he unimformed. and walsh's book (s)? come on, not a single piece of legally/medically recognized substantiation. i could give a rat's ass if LA doped, or any rider, i loved the sport before i knew it was full of drugs, and i loved it after, and i love it now. what i don't love is a bunch of people who know nothing, because really, how could you? just talking ****. speculate all you want, but just remember you don't know jack about the guy, or his motivations, or his medical history. what is known, undeniably, is that he kicked some serious ass when he raced his bike. he showed class IN the sport. the rest doesn't matter, its utterly meaningless. yeah, i'll take a qualuude sunshine, as soon as you take some time and try to figure out wtf you think you know and how on earth you could possibly come to KNOW something about someone other than yourself, or have something to say, about a great sportsman and a fierce competitor. its bike racing after all, the rest is just chatter...

  14. #14
    Perineal Pressurized dobber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by urodacus View Post
    well said, paul.

    it's about the ego. unless he's pissed all his money against the wall chasing Olsen twins around.
    Isn't everything in life about ego?

    And if Lance is indeed tapping the twins, good for him.
    This is Africa, 1943. War spits out its violence overhead and the sandy graveyard swallows it up. Her name is King Nine, B-25, medium bomber, Twelfth Air Force. On a hot, still morning she took off from Tunisia to bomb the southern tip of Italy. An errant piece of flak tore a hole in a wing tank and, like a wounded bird, this is where she landed, not to return on this day, or any other day.

  15. #15
    bac
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    Quote Originally Posted by urodacus View Post
    unless he's pissed all his money against the wall chasing Olsen twins around.
    Ah .... he's racing sans a salary.

    And for the fools that think cycling is somehow clean now .... that it's just those dopers from the past that can now screw up the sport .... well, you boys really need to get a grip. Doping is alive and well in cycling and alway will be - that's just a byproduct of the sport and human nature.

    BTW, I'm not a huge fan of Armstrong, and I DO think he doped. I don't know how that has anything to do with this comeback for cancer. It seem like pure win for everyone involved.

    ... Brad

  16. #16
    Senior Member jaxgtr's Avatar
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    Gents, lets try and not let anything get heated about a situation you can do nothing about on this forum. It's not worth it.
    Brian | 2013 Cannondale SuperSix 5 | 2014 Trek CrossRip Comp | 2003 Trek 7300
    Quote Originally Posted by AEO View Post
    you should learn to embrace change, and mock it's failings every step of the way.

  17. #17
    Road Nazi Hunter Donegal's Avatar
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    One more self-proclaimed genius that I wouldn't let deliver newspapers. If he followed the 1999 L'Equipe ragsheet expose', you would follow it through the facts and find out that EPO, if it ever existed in LA's samples, it would have been totally obliterated by their freezing and the time period. So said the individual who invented the drug in the first place. But what would he know?

    Instead, believe the newspaper who seems to have facts never scientifically verified. Landis, Mayo, ???? I have seen so many misadventures with AFLD, L'Equipe' and the lab in France, that I think that a dartboard is used to determine whose careers we will destroy next.

    If I played with these idiots, there would allways be two samples, one that I kept under proper lock and key to prove their idiocy.
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  18. #18
    Large Member urodacus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bac View Post
    Ah .... he's racing sans a salary.
    endorsements? store publicity? book sales? more money by far than a salary.
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  19. #19
    I am the Eggman Mooo's Avatar
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    Motivation shmotivation. When he retired it was to "spend more time with his kids." By which he apparently meant "date a series of thin blonds." I lost huge amounts of respect for him over this apparent bit of double speak.

    LeMonde talked of LA and of doping; LA seems to have pulled strings at Trek to get the LeMonde line dropped. Trek road sales took a hit. On the face of it, the comeback could be a repayment to Trek for the dropping LeMonde.

    As for Greg, well, a conscience is never a convenient thing to have. Particularly a strong conscience.

    I used to want to believe the LA story, but the endless succession of former teammates busted for doping, (is the list of busted longer or shorter than the list of not-yet-busted?), the list of former rivals who've been busted for doping turned me. Throw his phalanx of lawyers into the mix and I cannot in good conscience wish him success.

    His first book was "It's not about the bike."
    A properly titled book about the return might be "It's not about the foundation."

  20. #20
    Road Nazi Hunter Donegal's Avatar
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    Of course Greg Lemond can't handle lance coming back. He is nothing but a washed up has-been crying in his beer since Lance stole his thunder in the U.S. Lemond has done nothing but badmouth Armstrong since his first win. Jealousy is an ugly thing, especially when you get quoted internationally.

    I could care less about Lemond's opinion about Lance, doping, etc. He was probably so juiced when he rode that he can't remember how many times he won the Tour. No testing, no foul. If I listened to that fool, all riders were clean before Lance.

    The Tour has a long and ridiculous history of doping from the very early years. Who is to say this is right, wrong, etc. What is needed is just an even playing field for all. I love everything about the sport, except the Bull*&#t politics played with the Tour.

    With the latest revelations, it is obvious that the sensationalism that that was created by L'Equipe about doping is killing the Tour, maybe ASO should get the message. It's a race, I want to follow a race, not a giant story about doping which is all they seem to care about. This holier than thou crap is getting very very old. I was reading a story about FDJ the other day and of course the team was noted as riding clean because it was a French team. How is that relevant?? Just means they're slower, not necessary clean.
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  21. #21
    raodmaster shaman
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAZorro View Post
    Nothing any of us can do will change anything. I don't get people getting so worked up about Lance coming back. Anger just raises blood pressure and shortens life. Regardless of your point of view here, there's some element of entertainment to be had. I'm just going to watch what happens.
    You're right. All we can do is hop that lance gets popped this time. Wouldn't that be sweet. OJ finally got his comeuppance. Lance's "I'm beyond criticism 'cuase I beat cancer" shtick may once and for all be revealed for the farce it is.

  22. #22
    bac
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    Quote Originally Posted by adam View Post
    Wow, Paul. Tell us how you really feel.
    How incredibly naive.

    ... Brad

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mooo View Post
    Motivation shmotivation. When he retired it was to "spend more time with his kids." By which he apparently meant "date a series of thin blonds." I lost huge amounts of respect for him over this apparent bit of double speak.
    The thing you have to remember is that a lot of guys honestly retire from sports, or high octane professions, only to find their life is missing something. Until/unless they adjust to that, a lot of times they wind up falling into other pursuits that can fill some of that void. That's why street drugs are high on the list of mistakes people make after their careers. Lances divorce, I admittedly don't know much about, but will say, he could be doing a lot worse things in terms of his image, and for the future of his children than dating a series of thin blonds.

    Regardless of how you feel about the guy, whether you believe he doped or not, as long as his name is in the public eye in a positive light, that just means that much more money for cancer research. Whether it's about his legacy, his ego, whatever, the cancer research money is still a good thing.

  24. #24
    I am the Eggman Mooo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechKnowGN View Post
    The thing you have to remember is that a lot of guys honestly retire from sports, or high octane professions, only to find their life is missing something. Until/unless they adjust to that, a lot of times they wind up falling into other pursuits that can fill some of that void. That's why street drugs are high on the list of mistakes people make after their careers. Lances divorce, I admittedly don't know much about, but will say, he could be doing a lot worse things in terms of his image, and for the future of his children than dating a series of thin blonds.

    Regardless of how you feel about the guy, whether you believe he doped or not, as long as his name is in the public eye in a positive light, that just means that much more money for cancer research. Whether it's about his legacy, his ego, whatever, the cancer research money is still a good thing.
    Maybe, maybe not. Every other story is going to have the second headline "drugs?" or "DRUGS!"
    My mom's first question when she heard about his comeback was "did he get a better doctor?"

    If he wins the Giro, other people will be asking that. If he abandons (because that's been his style with races that have gone badly) people will use that to say he was doping back in the day.

    A man many claim is dirty on a team many think is dirty... There must be better ways to support cancer research than that.

  25. #25
    Senior Member adam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mooo View Post
    Maybe, maybe not. Every other story is going to have the second headline "drugs?" or "DRUGS!"
    My mom's first question when she heard about his comeback was "did he get a better doctor?"

    If he wins the Giro, other people will be asking that. If he abandons (because that's been his style with races that have gone badly) people will use that to say he was doping back in the day.

    A man many claim is dirty on a team many think is dirty... There must be better ways to support cancer research than that.
    Bonnie Ford thinks so too:

    Q: Being an elite bike rider is something that takes a lot of time every day. You're a member of a team and that takes a certain amount of time. There's physical risk involved in racing. Your comeback has stirred up a lot of old stuff in the public and media that could be distracting. Why is it better for you to be on the bike to promote your cause than off the bike where -- as has been chronicled -- you have access to anyone you want, practically, in the world and --

    A: Because it's an international initiative. If it was a domestic one or a Texas one, we've done that. We continue to maintain those initiatives. But it was our view that we would be more effective if I were on the bike, racing internationally.

    Q: The time you devote to being an athlete is time you can't spend lobbying.

    A: No, but it doesn't always have to be me. [The foundation] is an organization of 70 people, and 10 working on the international plan. That, in and of itself, is a big team. It's not just me. I have great support, a great team, great visionaries and great people working for me. I feel confident we'll be effective.

    This has always been more than the cancer cause for Lance.

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