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  1. #26
    Junk Mile Junkie Tulex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmgorman View Post
    Right, because thats the only worthy thing in the world. Do you donate your paycheck to cancer research?
    My guess is that DrPete's comment was pointed toward their statement.

    "Since last summer, his [non-profit] Livestrong foundation has a lucrative segment," said Ballester. "And when Armstrong receives 200,000 Euro to host a conference, he puts it into his pocket - unlike the leading cancer experts, who will donate the money."
    Why did you highlight my white text?

  2. #27
    Senior Member classic1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
    Unless they're givng the book proceeds to cancer research, they need to STFU.
    Why? Armstrong was rumoured to receive $2M Australian to ride the Tour Down Under. Not paid to his Cancer Foundation, paid to Armstrong directly as an appearance fee. It was never denied by Armstrong or the South Australian state government. LA supposedly received a similar start fee for the Giro. Is it really all about 'fighting cancer'?

    Walsh and Ballester aren't claiming to fight some terrible disease, and are asking reasonable questions IMO.
    Last edited by classic1; 06-04-09 at 08:02 AM.

  3. #28
    Up on the Down Side CyLowe97's Avatar
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    Perception is reality.

  4. #29
    Senior Member rsyb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wanders View Post
    And here I was thinking it was to pick up some more skinny blonde chicks.

    Silly me.
    +1 Who really needs the headaches of politics?!

  5. #30
    Dirt-riding heretic DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by classic1 View Post
    Why? Armstrong was rumoured to receive $2M Australian to ride the Tour Down Under. Not paid to his Cancer Foundation, paid to Armstrong directly as an appearance fee. It was never denied by Armstrong or the South Australian state government. LA supposedly received a similar start fee for the Giro. Is it really all about 'fighting cancer'?

    Walsh and Ballester aren't claiming to fight some terrible disease, and are asking reasonable questions IMO.
    I have no problem with LA getting appearance fees for racing his bike. Just because he has a foundation doesn't mean I or anyone else should expect him to forego personal income.

    Walsh and Ballester seem to assert that "personal gain" is somehow wrong in Lance's case, and I disagree.
    "Unless he was racing there was no way he could match my speed."

  6. #31
    Pretend Racer dcvelo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by classic1 View Post
    Armstrong was rumoured to receive $2M Australian to ride the Tour Down Under. Not paid to his Cancer Foundation, paid to Armstrong directly as an appearance fee.
    So if you start a charity you aren't allowed to still have any personal income?

    Quote Originally Posted by classic1 View Post
    Walsh and Ballester aren't claiming to fight some terrible disease, and are asking reasonable questions IMO.
    Actually I think they're jumping on their favorite hobby horse simply because the opportunity presented itself.

  7. #32
    . botto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by classic1 View Post
    Why? Armstrong was rumoured to receive $2M Australian to ride the Tour Down Under. Not paid to his Cancer Foundation, paid to Armstrong directly as an appearance fee. It was never denied by Armstrong or the South Australian state government. LA supposedly received a similar start fee for the Giro. Is it really all about 'fighting cancer'?

    Walsh and Ballester aren't claiming to fight some terrible disease, and are asking reasonable questions IMO.
    reputably more.

  8. #33
    Despite all my rage, I am rooftest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
    Unless they're givng the book proceeds to cancer research, they need to STFU.
    ... Just like Lance did. Oh, wait....

    (as others have already mentioned.)

  9. #34
    Dirt-riding heretic DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rooftest View Post
    ... Just like Lance did. Oh, wait....

    (as others have already mentioned.)
    Instead of being the 3rd person to think that they're cleverly refuting what I'm saying, please feel free to actually read what I wrote in subsequent posts. Thanks.
    "Unless he was racing there was no way he could match my speed."

  10. #35
    your nightmare gal chipcom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcvelo View Post
    So if you start a charity you aren't allowed to still have any personal income?
    apparently
    "Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey

  11. #36
    Dirt-riding heretic DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tulex View Post
    My guess is that DrPete's comment was pointed toward their statement.

    "Since last summer, his [non-profit] Livestrong foundation has a lucrative segment," said Ballester. "And when Armstrong receives 200,000 Euro to host a conference, he puts it into his pocket - unlike the leading cancer experts, who will donate the money."
    And you would be correct! Woohoo! Someone actually got what I was saying!
    "Unless he was racing there was no way he could match my speed."

  12. #37
    Senior Member classic1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
    I have no problem with LA getting appearance fees for racing his bike. Just because he has a foundation doesn't mean I or anyone else should expect him to forego personal income.

    Walsh and Ballester seem to assert that "personal gain" is somehow wrong in Lance's case, and I disagree.
    Quote Originally Posted by dcvelo
    So if you start a charity you aren't allowed to still have any personal income?
    I have no problem with him receiving appearance fees either, but he isn't up front about it. The PR about him racing 'for free' and his comeback being purely for altruistic reasons is demonstrably nonsense, there is ambiguity (deliberate IMO) about whether the start money is for him or his foundation and the secrecy surrounding the expenditure of tax payers money on his TDU appearance from both the SA govt and the LA camp annoys me.

    South Australia is well known for its God botherers, rabid parochialism, lack of potable water, its suitability as a nuclear test site, weird serial killers and now for questionable expenditure of tax payers money. Fortunately I don't have to live in South Australia, don't pay tax there and don't contribute to funding their early season training race, so maybe I should STFU about my whinging.

  13. #38
    Seņor Member kimconyc's Avatar
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    I tend to agree with what the authors are stipulating; however, I also argue that, on balance, Lance has also done more positive than negative--bringing a global awareness for the need to find the cure for cancer, increasing global interest in cycling (there is no argument that he is the most recognizable cyclist of all time; notice, I didn't say "best").

    Now, whether or not Lance is really a stooge for the multinational pharma companies, really just wants to hook up with another blond bimbo, etc. is really conspiracy theory foo.

    But what sort of value have the authors provided? It would appear that they are profiting at the expense of someone's reputation without hard facts--this is not cool IMO.

    edit: I disagree /w the authors that making bucks, fame, power etc. are mutually exclusive from also promoting a foundation or charitable cause. One can do both at the same time. Better than being a hack writer and player-hater.
    Last edited by kimconyc; 06-04-09 at 08:37 AM.

  14. #39
    Dirt-riding heretic DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by classic1 View Post
    I have no problem with him receiving appearance fees either, but he isn't up front about it. The PR about him racing 'for free' and his comeback being purely for altruistic reasons is demonstrably nonsense, there is ambiguity (deliberate IMO) about whether the start money is for him or his foundation and the secrecy surrounding the expenditure of tax payers money on his TDU appearance from both the SA govt and the LA camp annoys me.

    South Australia is well known for its God botherers, rabid parochialism, lack of potable water, its suitability as a nuclear test site, weird serial killers and now for questionable expenditure of tax payers money. Fortunately I don't have to live in South Australia, don't pay tax there and don't contribute to funding their early season training race, so maybe I should STFU about my whinging.
    Tiger Woods makes no salary. His income comes from prize money and endorsements. If he went all season out of the money, technically he'd be playing "for free" too.

    Plenty of examples of this in the real world. LA may not make a salary to race, but it doesn't change the fact that his name and face are worth a lot of money to race organizers who want to raise the profile of their event.
    "Unless he was racing there was no way he could match my speed."

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
    I have no problem with LA getting appearance fees for racing his bike. Just because he has a foundation doesn't mean I or anyone else should expect him to forego personal income.

    Walsh and Ballester seem to assert that "personal gain" is somehow wrong in Lance's case, and I disagree.
    +1. Well said.

  16. #41
    Senior Member classic1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
    Tiger Woods makes no salary. His income comes from prize money, appearance fees and endorsements. If he went all season out of the money, technically he'd be playing "for free" too.

    Plenty of examples of this in the real world. LA may not make a salary to race, but it doesn't change the fact that his name and face are worth a lot of money to race organizers who want to raise the profile of their event.
    Fixed that for you Pete.

  17. #42
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    It rubs me the wrong way because Lance has this enormous press conference to start the year, discussing how he's doing it solely to raise cancer awareness, won't be taking a salary from the team, etc. etc. And Lance gets a lot of (deservedly so at the time) positive press about riding because he wants to further the awareness of cancer research.

    Then he goes out and take multi-million personal appearance fees for races that hardly need to raise their profile. (Honestly, where does the Giro go from where it is now? Bigger than the Tour?)
    I don't mind him racing for personal gain, and selling the need for cancer research on the coattails along the way, but he hasn't exactly been transparent about it.
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  18. #43
    Seņor Member kimconyc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashUNC View Post
    It rubs me the wrong way because Lance has this enormous press conference to start the year, discussing how he's doing it solely to raise cancer awareness, won't be taking a salary from the team, etc. etc. And Lance gets a lot of (deservedly so at the time) positive press about riding because he wants to further the awareness of cancer research.

    Then he goes out and take multi-million personal appearance fees for races that hardly need to raise their profile. (Honestly, where does the Giro go from where it is now? Bigger than the Tour?)
    I don't mind him racing for personal gain, and selling the need for cancer research on the coattails along the way, but he hasn't exactly been transparent about it.
    He's not mother Teresa. He's a friggin cyclist for crying out loud. Why is this so hard to understand for so many people?

    Think of it like the WWE but on bikes; it's just a big show with real-live suffering and soul crushing.

  19. #44
    antiquarian
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
    I have no problem with LA getting appearance fees for racing his bike. Just because he has a foundation doesn't mean I or anyone else should expect him to forego personal income.

    Walsh and Ballester seem to assert that "personal gain" is somehow wrong in Lance's case, and I disagree.
    Gotcha.
    is bikesnob really paying for advertising? wtf?

  20. #45
    meow bostongarden's Avatar
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    Um, Money and Power...isn't that part of human nature?

  21. #46
    #5639 robertkat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
    I have no problem with LA getting appearance fees for racing his bike. Just because he has a foundation doesn't mean I or anyone else should expect him to forego personal income.

    Walsh and Ballester seem to assert that "personal gain" is somehow wrong in Lance's case, and I disagree.
    Yet LA himself claimed in the beginning that a large part of his comeback was to raise awareness and money for his foundation, that he would not be taking a salary and most prize monies, etc would go to the LAF.

    Regardless, nothing the man does will surprise me. He's kind of a DBag and I honestly think he got sad that he was slipping out of the limelight. It's the Lance Armstrong look at me comeback special.
    Last edited by robertkat; 06-04-09 at 09:04 AM.

  22. #47
    Seņor Member kimconyc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bostongarden View Post
    Um, Money and Power...isn't that part of human nature?
    Apparently, not for some high and mighty, former French "journalists".

  23. #48
    your nightmare gal chipcom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robertkat View Post
    Yet LA himself claimed in the beginning that a large part of his comeback was to raise awareness and money for his foundation, that he would not be taking a salary and most prize monies, etc would go to the LAF.
    Riding in these events is what is raising awareness. He's not taking a salary and I don't know that he's not donated any prize money he may have received to date, if any. Where did he say he wouldn't take any money from any source?
    "Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey

  24. #49
    Senior Member UGASkiDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kimconyc View Post
    He's not mother Teresa. He's a friggin cyclist for crying out loud. Why is this so hard to understand for so many people?

    Think of it like the WWE but on bikes; it's just a big show with real-live suffering and soul crushing.
    Sweet now I finally have a worthy quote for my sig....Thanks
    Quote Originally Posted by kimconyc View Post
    He's not mother Teresa. He's a friggin cyclist for crying out loud. Why is this so hard to understand for so many people?

    Think of it like the WWE but on bikes; it's just a big show with real-live suffering and soul crushing.

  25. #50
    Senior Member Matteye's Avatar
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    Who cares? Sounds like a good business plan to me. Stop whining....
    I loved that bicycle like it was a bicycle

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