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Old 10-22-09, 02:55 PM   #1
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ToC Route Announced..No Sierra's

CLICKY

So no Sierra climbs, Big Bear is the Queen stage..better hope the wind is blowing the right way or the smog levels will be kill them all. I'm guessing outside of the 'Shack' we won't be seeing any big ProTour names in peleton.
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Old 10-22-09, 03:16 PM   #2
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They wanted to go through Yosemite but the park service said no. Apparently the stage from Visalia to Bakersfield will go through Sequoia National Forest, but I have no idea of the route. I can't imagine it being a particularly selective day.
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Old 10-22-09, 03:25 PM   #3
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They're going through the Santa Monicas! I didn't think that would ever happen because of the Malibu politics involved.
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Old 10-22-09, 04:15 PM   #4
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They wanted to go through Yosemite but the park service said no. Apparently the stage from Visalia to Bakersfield will go through Sequoia National Forest, but I have no idea of the route. I can't imagine it being a particularly selective day.
I can see why - Yosemite is already way overcrowded during the summer, and add a stage of the ToC? It'd be chaos. But it would be fantastic.

There are plenty of climbs in the Sierras outside of Yosemite, though.
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Old 10-22-09, 05:08 PM   #5
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They wanted to go through Yosemite but the park service said no. Apparently the stage from Visalia to Bakersfield will go through Sequoia National Forest, but I have no idea of the route. I can't imagine it being a particularly selective day.
There's one road through there and its a decent climb, should be an entertaining stage if its true.

I'm psyched about Big Bear, its right next to me.
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Old 10-22-09, 05:18 PM   #6
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There's one road through there and its a decent climb, should be an entertaining stage if its true.

I'm psyched about Big Bear, its right next to me.
Easy for the first few miles... then it gets curvy. Can't wait to watch the descent, assuming that's in there.
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Old 10-22-09, 05:56 PM   #7
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I'm still working on the interview with Andy Messick. Give me time. He's busy.

And I look forward to TWO nights in L.A. with the race entourage. That's going to be a blast!
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Old 10-22-09, 07:19 PM   #8
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I can see why - Yosemite is already way overcrowded during the summer, and add a stage of the ToC? It'd be chaos. But it would be fantastic.

There are plenty of climbs in the Sierras outside of Yosemite, though.
they always manage to pull off rolling through national parks in the giro, vuelta & le tour.
the race could avoid the valley where 90% of the visitors head anyway. methinks the real
reason is that none of the east side sierra towns-save mammoth or maybe bishop-would
be willing to pony up the bucks for a drive-by or stage finish.
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Old 10-22-09, 07:23 PM   #9
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they always manage to pull off rolling through national parks in the giro, vuelta & le tour.
the race could avoid the valley where 90% of the visitors head anyway. methinks the real
reason is that none of the east side sierra towns-save mammoth or maybe bishop-would
be willing to pony up the bucks for a drive-by or stage finish.
I very seriously doubt bishop has any money.
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Old 10-22-09, 07:36 PM   #10
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I was in Big Bear for Oktoberfest. I felt the altitude just brushing my teeth in the AM.
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Old 10-22-09, 09:02 PM   #11
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I very seriously doubt bishop has any money.
ha, ha. me too. mammoth (or tahoe) is the best bet. since the sale of the ski resort and its various holdings a while back,
there has been talk of expanding the airport down the mountain and (fbow) "aspenizing" mammoth. i expect the new
owners to carry out their plans, presuming they still own it when the economy recovers.
a stage finish just might be the right type of advertising for the resort.
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Old 10-22-09, 09:23 PM   #12
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Bummed San Diego is out. Had fun in the Amgen tent last year. Was amazing watching them sprint for the finish. Guess I'll have to watch online. Hopefully they'll get the GPS fixed.
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Old 10-22-09, 09:36 PM   #13
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they always manage to pull off rolling through national parks in the giro, vuelta & le tour.
France's national first national park was created in 1963... some 60 years after the first Tour.

The US's first national park was created in 1872. So they kind of have seniority.

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the race could avoid the valley where 90% of the visitors head anyway. methinks the real
reason is that none of the east side sierra towns-save mammoth or maybe bishop-would
be willing to pony up the bucks for a drive-by or stage finish.
The climbs outside Bishop are awesome and I would be interested and humbled to know how much faster than me the pros can climb to Mosquito Flat.

But there would not be anyone there to watch if both cycling fans in Bishop are busy that day.
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Old 10-22-09, 10:18 PM   #14
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France's national first national park was created in 1963... some 60 years after the first Tour.
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The US's first national park was created in 1872. So they kind of have seniority.

true that+++le tour is a slightly more revered event than the toc...have never seen any figures
or estimates on how much money flows into/is spent in a tdf town or area-say alpe d'huez, briancon,
pau, mont ventoux area. just curious about the $ boost to the local economy.

The climbs outside Bishop are awesome and I would be interested and humbled to know how much faster than me the pros can climb to Mosquito Flat.

But there would not be anyone there to watch if both cycling fans in Bishop are busy that day.


just a couple bewildered hikers & fisherman. wonder how many cycling clubs & enthusiasts would
road trip from la, sd ,sj, sacto, fresno, sf, vegas it if there were a stage finishing at say horseshoe meadows
or mosquito flat? maybe a fifth of what we'll see at big bear this coming year?
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Old 10-22-09, 11:16 PM   #15
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But there would not be anyone there to watch if both cycling fans in Bishop are busy that day.
BS

You wouldn't be able to get a hotel room or a campsite in Bishop that day.

So that's at least five people.
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Old 10-23-09, 07:17 AM   #16
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when does this open on bikereg? I cant decide whether to do the 35+ or the 1/2. although the dates conflict with the turkey hill road race in PA, which is within driving distance from me and free ice cream from the turkey hill dairy, so I'll probably just do it instead.
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Old 10-23-09, 07:39 AM   #17
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The route certainly looks tougher than last year's route, but to me it doesn't live up to the hype of why they say they're moving from February to May.

Check out this VeloNews article: http://velonews.com/article/99515/th...lain-the-races

Look at this quote, in particular.

"'In February, there is a lot of terrain that’s inaccessible due to snow and cold,' Messick said. 'Shifting to May will open up the Sierras, mountain top finishes and areas like Lake Tahoe. To showcase the California that we know and love — blue skies, warm weather — we need to be in the spring. We think the racing will be better, and the competition will be better.'"

Well, they got the blue skies and warm weather, but what about the Sierras and areas like Lake Tahoe? Quick, name a California climb off the top of your head. Is it included in the ToC route? Climbs like Monitor and Ebbetts seem perfect to include, so why aren't they there? I don't mean to knock the Big Bear stage. It looks difficult and should make for an exciting stage, but it alone doesn't justify the move to May. It seems like the organizers were one additional climbing stage away from actually turning the race into what they wanted it to be.

"'We aspire to be an important part of the cycling calendar,' said Andrew Messick, AEG Sports president. 'We felt as though being a February race we were, I don’t want to say pre-season, but we weren’t a race that most riders were really targeting.'"

Well, I'm not sure trying to be the American Dauphine Libere is a huge step up, but look at its 2009 route: 2 TTs and 2 mountain finishes. That's the kind of route the ToC needed to present to even have a chance to compete with the European races riders use to prepare for the Tour, and even then there would be the problem of whether or not riders would want to travel so far at such a critical point of the season.

The ToC had its niche as an early-season race that big-name riders wanted to be a part of, and if it had embraced that niche it was on the road to becoming a very successful race. Instead, it's trying to become something bigger and the 2010 route doesn't live up to the hype. With LA riding it seems like if they wanted to do an epic route and really show their vision, this would have been the year.

If the Yosemite story is true it illustrates why a huge race can't happen in America. People just don't care enough about cycling to basically shut down major areas for a mere bike race.
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Old 10-23-09, 09:26 AM   #18
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Don't forget about the final stage into Thousand Oaks. It's not a hill top finish but it's still going to be very difficult. I'd argue that that stage is as hard as anything they've ever done in this race before. Plus it comes stacked after the Big Bear Stage and the TT. The leader coming into the last stage is still going to have some serious work to do.
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Old 10-23-09, 09:40 AM   #19
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when does this open on bikereg? I cant decide whether to do the 35+ or the 1/2. although the dates conflict with the turkey hill road race in PA, which is within driving distance from me and free ice cream from the turkey hill dairy, so I'll probably just do it instead.
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Old 10-23-09, 10:09 AM   #20
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They're not famous beyond NorCal, but there are plenty of locally infamous legburners available on the Nevada City -- Sacramento stage. The problem is that I doubt they'd want to include them on the first stage.

Also, it's a shame they bagged the Prologue this year. It was a lot of fun and really attractive to non-hardcore cycling fans to have the start and finish in the same 10 block area and to see the TT machines.

The Sac Bee must have used the descriptor "NASCAR-style racing" about a dozen times.
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Old 10-23-09, 10:11 AM   #21
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I'm still working on the interview with Andy Messick. Give me time. He's busy.

And I look forward to TWO nights in L.A. with the race entourage. That's going to be a blast!
Will you be in the front car again doing the announcing? What will the car be, another Volvo?
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Old 10-23-09, 10:39 AM   #22
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Moving to Pro Cycling
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Old 10-23-09, 11:44 AM   #23
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Moving to Pro Cycling
Why? Isn't this the discription of the Racing Forum?

Discuss pro racing, the big races, and even the small backyard races. Don't forget to update all the members with your own race results.


Is this not a discussion of Pro Racing?
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Old 10-23-09, 12:56 PM   #24
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I dont know what route people were thinking of in the Sierras or Yosemite but Tioga Pass regularly doesnt even open up and clear of snow until mid June.
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Old 10-23-09, 08:10 PM   #25
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Doesn't go through Yosemite, CatSkratch
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