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Old 07-09-10, 10:43 AM   #1
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Vino

Ok, I realize many people hate the guy and will dog pile on him at the first opportunity. For those of YOU, who love to hate Vino, please dog pile in moderation in this thread.

So...It's only a few days into the race but he seems to be hanging in with AC. Do we think he's capable of hanging with AC throughout the entire race? Is he that good?

And I am not one of the folks here who thinks he'll stick it to AC at the first chance, I'm just curious to know if he's good enough to hang with AC and end up in, say, the overall top 5.
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Old 07-09-10, 10:44 AM   #2
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I love him.

He makes the race interesting.

And yes, i think he will be AC's right hand man when it gets steep.
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Old 07-09-10, 10:54 AM   #3
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It would be ironic if he loses a bit of time (enough for people to overlook his chances at GC) on Sunday and Tuesday and then goes off on Stage 10 where the finish is a descent into Gap...
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Old 07-09-10, 10:56 AM   #4
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I think Vino is not getting the respect he deserves. I'm not saying he is a favorite, but especially considering his current placing he is more deserving of being considered a contender than some others.

Will he end on the podium? Likely not. But I'd be thrilled if he and AC try to work as a team and try to (as a duo) echo stage 17 of 1969 on stage 16 this year.
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Old 07-09-10, 11:01 AM   #5
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Do we think he's capable of hanging with AC throughout the entire race? Is he that good?
Not unless he jumped into the magic potion cauldron since the Giro.
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Old 07-09-10, 11:58 AM   #6
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Vino is pretty good when on form, but I suspect he's subject to Hinault Disease. This could be fun.
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Old 07-09-10, 12:10 PM   #7
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With Alberto reportedly close to an extension deal with Astana, I don't think Vino would do anything stupid to endanger it.
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Old 07-09-10, 01:55 PM   #8
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I dont think Vino will backstab Contador. If he wanted to be the Astana GC contender, Astana (which is basically Vino) would have let Contador walk at the end of last season, not try so hard to retain him then... or sign an extension with him now.

V.
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Old 07-09-10, 02:07 PM   #9
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Yeah I think Vina has much to gain by supporting AC, and supporting him well, and much to lose by looking like he's out for himself. Plus he's overcoming a dope conviction so riding clean and looking like a dedicated team player will help polish his image.

I just don't see Vino going Hinault on AC anytime soon.
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Old 07-09-10, 02:54 PM   #10
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Vino worked hard and helped Contador quite a bit in Stage 3 -- so far he seems to be behaving.

But he's so much more fun to watch when he misbehaves.
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Old 07-09-10, 07:41 PM   #11
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I think all of the concern about how Vino will behave is overblown. He could pose to be valuable asset to AC. Vino loves to attack. He could lead a charge up the mountain followed by AC that could literally decimate the GC contenders. Vino's problem has been that he can't sustain the attack to the top of mountain finishes. But it might be what AC needs to launch and dump AS, Cadel, Menchov, Basso, and others.
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Old 07-09-10, 08:13 PM   #12
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I dont think Vino will backstab Contador. If he wanted to be the Astana GC contender, Astana (which is basically Vino) would have let Contador walk at the end of last season, not try so hard to retain him then... or sign an extension with him now.

V.
he already has. or did you miss the stage when AC was dropped by vino? vino is a snake; he'll only respect you if you crush him.

he is the first rider that i've seen who has come back from a two-year ban with the same form. so you're saying a guy that almost ruined astana by doping wouldn't betray contador if he had a chance?

vino = same as he ever was.

ed rader
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Old 07-09-10, 09:04 PM   #13
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I dont agree with ed, in the cobblestones stage contador had a darn flat and when you are leading a small group in which AC is in the back there is no way for him to know what was going on, specially if it happened maybe 500 meters before finish line. The support cars are way gone at that point so contador had to figure it out himself, Vino didn't have to wait for him at that point specially when the guy it suppose to be at the last position in that group. Looks like you didnt pay attention to the videos, AC did not help that much at the front either, Vino did all the effort to hunt the 1st group with cadel and Cancelara. In a matter of fact if you look even better you can see that AC was hanging from his buggers at the end of the group, Vino was really inspired in that stage. He worked for him and for AC and it paid off big time.

My opinion as many is that AC and Vino will be long gone in the mountains. Vino probably will do his famous attaches, everybody will stay with AC, AC will attach and will catch vino, and then AC will trail Vino up to the finish. Astana will try to get a Duet again in the podium for sure.

As for LA, he doesnt look right this year but knowing him who knows. At least he has a better team than anybody else the problem is that how the season is coming who knows what it will happen this year in the tour. Anybody can win this thing, previous years it was a thing of logic but this year will be a roulette. My Fav is Vino.. hope he wins.
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Old 07-09-10, 09:13 PM   #14
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I dont agree with ed, in the cobblestones stage contador had a darn flat and when you are leading a small group in which AC is in the back there is no way for him to know what was going on, specially if it happened maybe 500 meters before finish line. The support cars are way gone at that point so contador had to figure it out himself, Vino didn't have to wait for him at that point specially when the guy it suppose to be at the last position in that group. Looks like you didnt pay attention to the videos, AC did not help that much at the front either, Vino did all the effort to hunt the 1st group with cadel and Cancelara. In a matter of fact if you look even better you can see that AC was hanging from his buggers at the end of the group, Vino was really inspired in that stage. He worked for him and for AC and it paid off big time...
Almost exactly correct. Alberto's problem was a broken spoke that had his wheel rubbing the brake.
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Old 07-09-10, 09:32 PM   #15
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he already has. or did you miss the stage when AC was dropped by vino? vino is a snake; he'll only respect you if you crush him.

he is the first rider that i've seen who has come back from a two-year ban with the same form. so you're saying a guy that almost ruined astana by doping wouldn't betray contador if he had a chance?

vino = same as he ever was.

ed rader
Wrong. This is what happens when you watch the Versus coverage and take Paul Sherwen's call as gospel. Even Phil said, as Contador crossed the line, that there might have been something wrong with AC's bike, possibly a flat.

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I dont agree with ed, in the cobblestones stage contador had a darn flat and when you are leading a small group in which AC is in the back there is no way for him to know what was going on, specially if it happened maybe 500 meters before finish line. The support cars are way gone at that point so contador had to figure it out himself, Vino didn't have to wait for him at that point specially when the guy it suppose to be at the last position in that group. Looks like you didnt pay attention to the videos, AC did not help that much at the front either, Vino did all the effort to hunt the 1st group with cadel and Cancelara. In a matter of fact if you look even better you can see that AC was hanging from his buggers at the end of the group, Vino was really inspired in that stage. He worked for him and for AC and it paid off big time.

My opinion as many is that AC and Vino will be long gone in the mountains. Vino probably will do his famous attaches, everybody will stay with AC, AC will attach and will catch vino, and then AC will trail Vino up to the finish. Astana will try to get a Duet again in the podium for sure.

As for LA, he doesnt look right this year but knowing him who knows. At least he has a better team than anybody else the problem is that how the season is coming who knows what it will happen this year in the tour. Anybody can win this thing, previous years it was a thing of logic but this year will be a roulette. My Fav is Vino.. hope he wins.
I agree with that assessment.

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Almost exactly correct. Alberto's problem was a broken spoke that had his wheel rubbing the brake.

As the others pointed out, Vino didn't "drop" Contador. Vino, and everyone else in the group, probably had no idea AC had gone off the back with mechanical trouble. At that point, finish line in sight, there really wasn't anything Vino could have done. AC's only real option was to just nurse it across the line. Vino stopping his pull wouldn't have slowed down the other riders. It would only have hurt Vino, who would have lost time to other GC contenders. It had no effect on AC because there was nothing that could have been done so close to the line.

Its one thing to dislike a rider, but at least have the facts straight.
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Old 07-09-10, 09:47 PM   #16
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While it's true that there was little Vino could have done in the last meters, other than wait for him; it is also true that Vino did end up putting a little time into AC.
I foresee Vino doing similar things in the coming days.
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Old 07-09-10, 10:16 PM   #17
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Rumpled at that point of the race there is nothing else to do. I been in those situations looking for a sucker that should have been there and he wasn't... you just have to go specially when you are too close. If Vino took time great but the race is just starting, the problem with vino is that he is the underdog, an underdog that is pretty consistent as a racer, and thats the reason he is my fav. I believe more in Vino's heart than in AC legs.

Frankly, tomorrow will be a super interesting stage because the GCs that are like 3 minutes behind, tomorrow might lost even more time. In a matter of fact I see Cadel in Yellow tomorrow.
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Old 07-10-10, 12:00 AM   #18
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While it's true that there was little Vino could have done in the last meters, other than wait for him; it is also true that Vino did end up putting a little time into AC.
I foresee Vino doing similar things in the coming days.
This doesn't make sense. If there was nothing Vino could have done, what is it that you foresee Vino doing in the coming days? What similar things? Vino helped AC by leading the charge and gaining time on rivals. Vino gaining time was no fault of Vino's. AC said it himself. Sheesh.
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Old 07-10-10, 12:06 AM   #19
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Well this early in the tour Vino has done 100% more for Contador than Lance did all of last year. Please show some footage from last year's tour with Lance pulling at the front of a group to help AC. I would still be cautious with Vino though he is half baked.

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Old 07-10-10, 12:55 AM   #20
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I wonder how the rest of the Astana boys are at climbing - anyone know?

If both AC and Vino get some good support from them, it will make for some very interesting mountain stages!
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