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Old 07-21-10, 09:51 AM   #1
Keith99
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Did I hear these right? If so why trust vrs?

Watching the evening coverage of vrs. I heard 2 things I could hardly believe I heard.

First Bob Roll says Lance is the most prolific stage winner in The Tour de France. Come on, he is not by any definition.

Then I see a repeat of a segment where they say Eric Heiden won the points competition in the Giro! Say what? I even was able to find his Palmares on hte memorie-du-cyclisme site and saw he doesn't have anything that could even be confused with the points competition win.

I had also caught some of the morning broadcast where they did a very good job of pointing out that Thor was hanging with the peloton and even discussed the chances of at least some riders ahead getting caught. Then I watch the evening coverage and Thor never gets mentioned until the final sprint! Whats with that? Then they wonder when was the last time a rider contending for Green picked up points in the mountians. They then said it must be way back. Sorry guys, it was during the Lance era. Zable did it more than once (I don't think on a stage with quite as much climbing as stage 16, but then there are rarely stages with that much climbing and such a long runout after the final climb).

Does anyone else remember these comments? Did I hear wrong?
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Old 07-21-10, 09:58 AM   #2
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Then they wonder when was the last time a rider contending for Green picked up points in the mountians.
Thor did it last year.
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Old 07-21-10, 10:01 AM   #3
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I heard the Heiden bit. I followed cycling back then and my thought was "I didn't know that"
apparently neither did whoever researched the story.

There's some reference to Heiden winning the InterGiro competition (not the points
classification) but I can't find anything on the intergiro prior to 1989
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Old 07-21-10, 11:38 AM   #4
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Always do your own fact checking. Small slips in commentary happen all the time. I still give those guys huge props for being able to talk, mostly, intelligently about cycling and the live events for hours every day and if their only goofs are things a cyclist would say about a fellow teammate then I can quickly forgive. Try talking in front of a camera and then a microphone for 4 hours recalling events that happened 25 years ago and see how you do then get back to us. Enjoy!
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Old 07-21-10, 11:45 AM   #5
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I heard the Heiden bit. I followed cycling back then and my thought was "I didn't know that"
apparently neither did whoever researched the story.

There's some reference to Heiden winning the InterGiro competition (not the points
classification) but I can't find anything on the intergiro prior to 1989
Nor can I. I did verify that Eric's only Giro entry was 1985 (the memorie site includes all Tour and Giro placings including DNF). I found several sites that report the intergiro was created in 1989. Memorie did not have anything other than his 131st finish for Erick in the Giro.

But I did find one link saying he won in 1985.

http://www.bobkestrut.com/2006/02/

Looks like Bob Roll's blog quoting Sherwin.
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Old 07-21-10, 11:51 AM   #6
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Paul Sherwin said Heiden won the Intergiro in a Pez Cycling interview.

http://pezcyclingnews.com/?pg=fullstory&id=3605

Given that Roll was on 7-11, and Sherwin raced against Heiden, I would tend to credit their recollection.
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Old 07-21-10, 01:35 PM   #7
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Paul Sherwin said Heiden won the Intergiro in a Pez Cycling interview.

http://pezcyclingnews.com/?pg=fullstory&id=3605

Given that Roll was on 7-11, and Sherwin raced against Heiden, I would tend to credit their recollection.
I would have been also. Except when Lotek searched he found no reference to the intergiro before 1989. I used the memorie site and was able to pull up palmares for Heiden and no mention of an intergiro win (This site is so complete under rider palmares that it includes all Giro and Tour placings, Heiden placed 131st. They even include DNFs, missing data for them is not giving the stage for a DNF). I found many references to the intergiro starting in 1989. I've found quite a few writeups of that time period, one included both U.S. stage wins in the Giro in 1985. I've found sites that have all the expected Jersey winners and all stage wins for 1985. I've found at least 2 that list all intergiro since 1989.

The only thing more I could hope to find is a site that has each years results where stepping through by year I see complete results for each year and can see the intergiro for 1989, but not for 1985. (Memorie will have this, but that level of Giro results is for paid subscribers only).

Everything points to their memory being faulty. Just as it was for previous points contenders picking up points in the mountian stages.
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Old 07-21-10, 02:40 PM   #8
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What's really confusing in all the digging around I did I read somewhere (damn I hate when I do that)
that the intergiro competition was stopped and then restarted. I can't find dates for that.

I found Pauls quote too, that lends some credence to what Bob said but the whole thing is rather
confusing.

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Old 07-21-10, 04:58 PM   #9
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What's really confusing in all the digging around I did I read somewhere (damn I hate when I do that)
that the intergiro competition was stopped and then restarted. I can't find dates for that.

I found Pauls quote too, that lends some credence to what Bob said but the whole thing is rather
confusing.

marty
I'm pretty sure the Giro 'points competition' line in the vrs. history of american cycling segment was not said by Bob. Bob was the one who said Lance was the most prolific stage winner in the TDF, something which could be a slip, he could have meant of active riders. But I'll bet they never say the same of any other active rider once Lance retires.

I've generally been pretty lucky in finding things that have gone and returned. (like the fact that Eddy won at least 4 White Jerseys! It was the combo jersey, which went away then returned as a patchwork jersey beign part yellow, part green and part polkadot, while white returned as Best young rider. Then combo went away again). Of course there is a lot more on the Tour available online.

It might be that there was a semi official intergiro. It has not been unknown in cycling. for at least a couple of years there was an unofficial season long competition.
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Old 07-21-10, 06:05 PM   #10
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I watched one of the innumerable reruns and it was Paul talking about riding against Eric and
regret that he (Eric) never finished the tour.
Bob was asked by Craig about the importance and that was when Bob made the comment about
Eric winning the points competition.
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Old 07-21-10, 06:12 PM   #11
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I watched one of the innumerable reruns and it was Paul talking about riding against Eric and
regret that he (Eric) never finished the tour.
Bob was asked by Craig about the importance and that was when Bob made the comment about
Eric winning the points competition.
He did say 'points competition' then? Things I saw made it clear this was about the Giro, is that what it seems like on the reruns you have seen?

At this point I'm considering this an interesting puzzle. I am assuming there is some basis (besides too much good French Brandy) for this and if we get lucky it might be somethign interesting.
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Old 07-21-10, 06:34 PM   #12
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I actually heard Paul Sherwin do a little portion of a show on Erik Heiden. I remember him actually saying the quote. I thought, "wow, I didn't know that about Heiden." The show, or segment, was about the 7-11 team and the impact in American cycling. It might have been a filler for in between VS reruns of a stage later on in the day. Or it was something they had on right before the start of the tour a couple of weeks ago. Look for it on VS in between the stage reruns or on Saturday. It might have even been a segment of a pre-tour build up show.
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Old 07-21-10, 10:54 PM   #13
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Thor did it last year.
Freire 2 years ago.
Vino in '05.
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Old 07-21-10, 11:31 PM   #14
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But I did find one link saying he won in 1985.

http://www.bobkestrut.com/2006/02/

Looks like Bob Roll's blog quoting Sherwin.
Bobke strut is not written by Bob Roll. I thought it was for a long time, but someone else writes it. It's on the home page. I wish he would write more.
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