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Old 05-22-11, 07:13 PM   #26
ls01
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Merlin's right, we should never believe anyone. be suspicious at all times, From now on when anyone does anything exceptional we should throw used blood bags at them and scream Doper!

So what. He doped. we all kind of knew it. It takes some of the shine off of it, but in the end what difference does it make. There is too much money involved to believe that the participants would not seek out any advantage that they could, legal or otherwise.
To be honest I was a big 'ole fan boy myself for a long time. Lance doped? no friggin way! Now.....meh If he did, so what. H e will have to give back a lot of cash and do a lot of explaining to his children.
The bigger question is how did he get away with it for so long? The testing labs had to be in on it,. What about the gov. body's? specimen collectors?
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Old 05-22-11, 07:14 PM   #27
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I thought Hamilton appeared to struggle during that interview, and that it added to his credibility.
And how.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:14 PM   #28
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Oh! How the mighty have fallen
I have plenty of company in cycling these days.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:26 PM   #29
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Tyler who?
Exactly! Even assuming, arguendo, that Lance doped - so what?

What Lance has done for cancer survivors (like my wife) is beyond inspirational.

What has Tyler done for anyone?

Nada, nothing, zilch, zero!

I am sick and tired of people in the US Dept. of Justice trying to make a name for themselves on the backs of sports heroes (and yes Lance is a hero).

Why doesn't the Justice Department go after all the Wall Street dirt bags who have raped, and continue to economically ****, our country including people like us? Could it be because the Wall Street fat cats have our country's politicians in their back pocket? Hmmmmmmmmm!!!!

Ask any cancer survivor, who has been impacted one way or the other by Lance's example and his foundation, what he/she thinks about this latest government witch hunt. You will be sur eto get an ear full!
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Old 05-22-11, 07:31 PM   #30
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Exactly! Even assuming, arguendo, that Lance doped - so what?

What Lance has done for cancer survivors (like my wife) is beyond inspirational.

What has Tyler done for anyone?

Nada, nothing, zilch, zero!

I am sick and tired of people in the US Dept. of Justice trying to make a name for themselves on the backs of sports heroes (and yes Lance is a hero).

Why doesn't the Justice Department go after all the Wall Street dirt bags who have raped, and continue to economically ****, our country including people like us? Could it be because the Wall Street fat cats have our country's politicians in their back pocket? Hmmmmmmmmm!!!!

Ask any cancer survivor, who has been impacted one way or the other by Lance's example and his foundation, what he/she thinks about this latest government witch hunt. You will be sur eto get an ear full!
It's an odd kind of logic that excuses past crimes for unrelated altruism.

The question before the grand jury is not "Is Lance a good person?"
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Old 05-22-11, 07:35 PM   #31
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Exactly! Even assuming, arguendo, that Lance doped - so what?

What Lance has done for cancer survivors (like my wife) is beyond inspirational.

What has Tyler done for anyone?

Nada, nothing, zilch, zero!

I am sick and tired of people in the US Dept. of Justice trying to make a name for themselves on the backs of sports heroes (and yes Lance is a hero).

Why doesn't the Justice Department go after all the Wall Street dirt bags who have raped, and continue to economically ****, our country including people like us? Could it be because the Wall Street fat cats have our country's politicians in their back pocket? Hmmmmmmmmm!!!!

Ask any cancer survivor, who has been impacted one way or the other by Lance's example and his foundation, what he/she thinks about this latest government witch hunt. You will be sur eto get an ear full!
Right! Lance should be able to anything he wants because he has done some good. Like a drug/mob boss who builds a church for his mother to go to, he should get a pass too.
Relax, his foundation and his profesional cycling problems are 2 seperate things. While I wont dispute that LS has done some good for cancer victims, should he get to hide behind that particular shield?
The end justifies the means?
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Old 05-22-11, 07:36 PM   #32
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It's an odd kind of logic that excuses past crimes for unrelated altruism.

The question before the grand jury is not "Is Lance a good person?"
I hear DSK was a pretty good economist.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:37 PM   #33
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Tyler could have been more convincing with his body language and the way he kept looking around seemed a bit odd.

That said, the mounting evidence against him and the fact that he didn't appear on the show to rebut the charges sure doesn't look good for Lance.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:38 PM   #34
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I hear DSK was a pretty good economist.
Did alot of good for Greece and Portugal they say.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:40 PM   #35
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I believed a lot of what Tyler said, but if I was on the jury, I'd vote not guilty--if only to demonstrate to the government that they need to spend our tax dollars with more care.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:40 PM   #36
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Yes, Lance is a cancer survivor. No one can take that away from him. And yes, he has inspired a lot of other survivors. But would all of those survivors still look up to him if he was just a domestique in the TdF, and not a champion? Would he have been able to establish a world-class cancer research foundation (Livestrong) as just another cog in the peloton? His hero status was built with a house of cards. He is just following standard protocol when allegations (that are true) start flying: Deny everything, and make them prove it. That protocol buys the accused a lot of time. I think his time is about to run out. Just MHO.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:42 PM   #37
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but if I was on the jury, I'd vote not guilty--if only to demonstrate to the government that they need to spend our tax dollars with more care.
That's not for the jury to decide.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:45 PM   #38
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I thought Hamilton appeared to struggle during that interview, and that it added to his credibility.
ditto, it looked like he was about to cry after he said "i saw him inject it more than once". homie would much rather be riding than doing high pressure interviews and having someone check his spelling for books.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:47 PM   #39
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I believed a lot of what Tyler said, but if I was on the jury, I'd vote not guilty--if only to demonstrate to the government that they need to spend our tax dollars with more care.
Your logic needs work. So you would also waste the money spent on this investigation even if it proved he did it?

Actually you are in the right place welcome to BF.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:49 PM   #40
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That said, the mounting evidence against him and the fact that he didn't appear on the show to rebut the charges sure doesn't look good for Lance.
No way Armstrong appears on 60 minutes, or any other show now.

Everyone snared by the Balco investigation, got if for lying. Armstrong just needs to lay low, not comment, repeat his party line (most tested...) and let the lawyers handle it.

As much as the evidence that he used PEDS looks bad for him, if he doesn't stumble into a perjury, lying to a Federal official, or obstruction of justice charge, its still going to be difficult for the feds to prove a crime was committed, and that it was commtited within the Statue of Limitations.

Armstrong keeps his mouth shut, and the Feds case is much more difficult than it was against Bonds or Jones.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:52 PM   #41
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So, they subpoena Armstrong next. He then has three choices: plead the 5th, lie, or tell the truth. All three options will turn out badly for him.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:52 PM   #42
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That's not for the jury to decide.
It is and it isn't.

If we get there, the Jury gets charged on the elements of the crime, and they determine the facts, and apply it to the law as it is given to them.

However, they have it in their power to " nullify" the law. No one tells them they can do so, but there's no remedy if they do so.

So they can decide that the Feds shouldn't have wasted the effort and acquit on those grounds, and Armstrong walks.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:53 PM   #43
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So, they subpoena Armstrong next. He then has three choices: plead the 5th, lie, or tell the truth.
I know the answer to this one.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:53 PM   #44
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Yes, Lance is a cancer survivor. No one can take that away from him. And yes, he has inspired a lot of other survivors. But would all of those survivors still look up to him if he was just a domestique in the TdF, and not a champion? Would he have been able to establish a world-class cancer research foundation (Livestrong) as just another cog in the peloton? His hero status was built with a house of cards. He is just following standard protocol when allegations (that are true) start flying: Deny everything, and make them prove it. That protocol buys the accused a lot of time. I think his time is about to run out. Just MHO.
If the whole Peloton was clean wouldn't LA have won anyway?
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Old 05-22-11, 07:54 PM   #45
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Which is the bigger fish: Armstrong and his legacy, or the big prize (UCI and WADA)? Maybe he cuts a deal so they can go after the big one.
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Old 05-22-11, 07:56 PM   #46
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What could the feds do to UCI or WADA?
Their only reason for going after LA it the USPS funding.
I'm curious what they could do to these orgs.
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Old 05-22-11, 08:00 PM   #47
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Right! Lance should be able to anything he wants because he has done some good. Like a drug/mob boss who builds a church for his mother to go to, he should get a pass too.
Relax, his foundation and his profesional cycling problems are 2 seperate things. While I wont dispute that LS has done some good for cancer victims, should he get to hide behind that particular shield?
The end justifies the means?
If worse comes to worse, I hope Lance is able to distance himself from the Livestrong foundation. Unfortunately, I don't think this will be possible. I see Lance as the sole driver/fundraiser for Livestrong. If the grand jury charges him, I think his image will be so tarnished that Livestrong will be unable to survive. This is very sad because the foundation has done a lot of good. That said, it still does not give Lance a "get out of jail free" card.
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Old 05-22-11, 08:01 PM   #48
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I'm sure the Postmaster General of the USPS was implicit in this conspiracy of lies (kenji says in a sarcastic tone).
Are they going to prove that the PG knowingly used federal funds to purchase illegal drugs for its cycling team? Come on. They can't even get a letter to the right mailbox.
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Old 05-22-11, 08:03 PM   #49
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Old 05-22-11, 08:06 PM   #50
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i really hate i missed that interview! i wonder if/when they will air it again? i cought a clip on their website but it only showed parts and a post interview interview.
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