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  1. #26
    Senior Member Eclectus's Avatar
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    The whole UCI thing is dummkopf. Why not allow the lightest bikes to compete? On time-trial flats, why not allow recumbents?

    "We cannot allow this kind of thinking, because we'll we just can't. We aren't interested in seeing the best times possible, we're only interested in CONTROLLING PERFORMANCE TO WHAT IS BELOW WHAT IS POSSIBLE."

  2. #27
    Raising the Abyss celticfrost's Avatar
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    UCI:

    "EPO, Good"

    "sub 15lb bike, Bad"
    "...in Las Vegas where -the electric bills are staggering -the decor hog wild -and the entertainment saccharine -what a golden age -what a time of right and reason -the consumer's king -and unhappiness is treason..."

  3. #28
    RidingLikeCrazy! rangerdavid's Avatar
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    the EVO is an awesome bike..... really quite an inovation. It has received quite a bit of praise from lots of folks.
    *********************************

    Rangerdavid

    2009 Cannondale CAAD 9-6
    2005 Raleigh M40


    Riding the mountains of North Carolina

    I do today what you don't , so I can do tomorrow what you can't

    "Absolutely imbecilic. But typical." ..... pcad

  4. #29
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    The point is to standardize the bike so that the RIDERS are being judged, not the sponsors' pocketbooks or the latest MIT whizkid in their employ. Whether that leads to doping is up for debate.

  5. #30
    Peloton Dog patentcad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by celticfrost View Post
    I don't think that dementia is terminal, so there's hope for you yet.
    You are my BF Ray of Sunshine.

  6. #31
    Raising the Abyss celticfrost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
    You are my BF Ray of Sunshine.
    And you are my BF Wizard of Oz. Despite all your bellowing, we all know you're a softy.
    "...in Las Vegas where -the electric bills are staggering -the decor hog wild -and the entertainment saccharine -what a golden age -what a time of right and reason -the consumer's king -and unhappiness is treason..."

  7. #32
    Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by vespoli View Post
    The point is to standardize the bike so that the RIDERS are being judged, not the sponsors' pocketbooks or the latest MIT whizkid in their employ. Whether that leads to doping is up for debate.
    This.

    I'm hoping to see a racer win on a KHS or an open-mold frame. Otherwise, it'd just be Specialized or Cervelo or whoever has the most Dental Funding to blow on 1 pound plastic e-gruppo crap.

  8. #33
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbf73 View Post
    NOT ALL - the lighter riders likely are smaller/less frontal area/better aero.
    For climbing the aero factor is not important ... the weight and especially the power to weight ratio is.

  9. #34
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bratton View Post
    ^ pro troll
    It isn't because you fail to comprehend an argument that said argument automatically becomes a "troll".

  10. #35
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eclectus View Post
    why not allow recumbents?
    Why not allow knives in soccer?
    Why not allow small electric motors in cycling?
    Why not allow bionic replacement cyborg muscles?
    Why not allow rocket boosters?
    Why not allow dragcars in front of riders?
    Why not allow springs that tension themselves while going down and then release energy going up?
    etc...

    A sport is a sport and all sports have restrictions to keep them the sports they are.
    I like my bikes to remain bikes and applaud the UCI for outlawing anything that changes them too much.

  11. #36
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    For a mountain stage bike, there may be some advantage in using lighter wheels and transferring the weight to ballast on the frame.
    I am surprised that metal weights are added to the crankset: a rotating part, rather than, say the waterbottle holders.
    I appreciate the idea of lighter bikes for lighter riders. In pro racing this may not be do-able but for everyone else, it should be quite normal. I dont see why, as a 140lbs (64kg) lightweight, why should I have to buy bikes rated for 300lbs riders.

  12. #37
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    Does any form of racing that involves a vehicle not have a minimum weight for the vehicle. I'm not sure but I know most forms of motorcycle and auto racing have minimums etc... I know bicycle racing would be diffrent from the power plant point of view but it is still a race vehicle.

  13. #38
    Peloton Dog patentcad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    Why not allow knives in soccer?
    Firearms. The answer to eliminating soccer for good is allowing firearms in the sport.

  14. #39
    Has opinion, will express
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    At a certain level, and pros are definately there, you can not lose weight without sacrificing power.
    Pro athletes are basicly bones and muscles and you can't just "choose" your body type.
    Lighter riders have less power and so they carry relatively heavier bikes because all bikes weigh exactly the limit these days.
    It's unfair to guys like Pantani or Contador.
    Did you miss something in the history of cycling?

    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelW View Post
    For a mountain stage bike, there may be some advantage in using lighter wheels and transferring the weight to ballast on the frame.
    I am surprised that metal weights are added to the crankset: a rotating part, rather than, say the waterbottle holders.
    I appreciate the idea of lighter bikes for lighter riders. In pro racing this may not be do-able but for everyone else, it should be quite normal. I dont see why, as a 140lbs (64kg) lightweight, why should I have to buy bikes rated for 300lbs riders.
    Which Tour rider weighs in at 300lbs?
    Dream. Dare. Do.

  15. #40
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rowan View Post
    Did you miss something in the history of cycling?
    If you would look at the history of cycling, my dear fellow, you would come to the conclusion that very light riders, contrary to popular belief, actually are not good climbers in general.

    I'll give you the numbers:

    Pantani weighed only 55kg and had an aerobic power of 357W ... this gives him 6,5W/kg ... his power to frontal area was 1073W/mē

    Armstrong weighed 74kg and had an aerobic power of 481W ... this also gives him 6,5W/kg ... his power to frontal area was 1185W/mē

    If we count all the variables except the bike ... both riders will go up something like "Le Mont Ventoux" at the same speed except that Pantani has a smaller frontal area and so he should win.

    Now ... bear with me here.
    If we count in the weight of the bike at 6,5 kilograms and we calculate the theoretical times on the Ventoux ... we will see that Pantani will lose by about a minute and a half!

    Face it: the weight of the bike is unfair to lighter riders in climbs.

  16. #41
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NathanL View Post
    Does any form of racing that involves a vehicle not have a minimum weight for the vehicle. I'm not sure but I know most forms of motorcycle and auto racing have minimums etc... I know bicycle racing would be diffrent from the power plant point of view but it is still a race vehicle.
    This comparison is pointless since in auto racing all riders have the same engine specifications.

  17. #42
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
    Firearms. The answer to eliminating soccer for good is allowing firearms in the sport.
    That would make it too weird ... knives will be just fine and will make it more spectacular
    The goalkeeper could be allowed to carry an actual sword or spear maybe?

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    This comparison is pointless since in auto racing all riders have the same engine specifications.
    Not always. For those that don't they have a weight break system that regulates weight of car by displacement. I see your point but what other form of racing at all has no minimum weight on the vehicle? Most times it's to limit either how much technology can be introduced or to limit cost.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    If you would look at the history of cycling, my dear fellow, you would come to the conclusion that very light riders, contrary to popular belief, actually are not good climbers in general.

    I'll give you the numbers:

    Pantani weighed only 55kg and had an aerobic power of 357W ... this gives him 6,5W/kg ... his power to frontal area was 1073W/mē

    Armstrong weighed 74kg and had an aerobic power of 481W ... this also gives him 6,5W/kg ... his power to frontal area was 1185W/mē

    If we count all the variables except the bike ... both riders will go up something like "Le Mont Ventoux" at the same speed except that Pantani has a smaller frontal area and so he should win.

    Now ... bear with me here.
    If we count in the weight of the bike at 6,5 kilograms and we calculate the theoretical times on the Ventoux ... we will see that Pantani will lose by about a minute and a half!

    Face it: the weight of the bike is unfair to lighter riders in climbs.
    So you would be all up for a bike weighing 10% of the rider's weight? or a bike for everyone that weighs the same? a bike that is 10% of rider weight seems fair to me, since lighter riders dont have the weight to push down without pushing up their body(without a more concerted core effort to resist such motion)?

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    It isn't because you fail to comprehend an argument that said argument automatically becomes a "troll".
    Fail to comprehend? Hahaha. Allow me to modify my accusation: typical pretentious BF troll
    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
    There's really nothing that says "spirit of cycling" like killing everything in sight.

  21. #46
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    You mean, the bike still weight 14.99lbs minimum?

    Pretty funny how they could tell the 500gms, then they rig it for the guy with the same bikes, he was no dummy.

    Can I just suggest some diuretics instead of this bike weight nonsense?
    Last edited by zigmeister; 07-13-11 at 10:01 AM.
    HTFU

  22. #47
    CAADdict 2ndGen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bratton View Post
    Fail to comprehend? Hahaha. Allow me to modify my accusation: typical pretentious BF troll
    lmfao!

  23. #48
    Senior Member Fiery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    Face it: the weight of the bike is unfair to lighter riders in climbs.
    So that's why all the climbing specialists are big, strong guys!

  24. #49
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bratton View Post
    Fail to comprehend? Hahaha. Allow me to modify my accusation: typical pretentious BF troll
    Instead of making more silly attempts at mocking me it would suit you better to bring arguments to the table.
    In my post above I have come up with actual numbers proving my statement that the weight of the bike is unfair for lighter riders.
    This is not just a random thing I say but it is backed up by logic and physics.
    I might be wrong, but until proven wrong by logic I will assume I am right.
    I have yet to see you come up with anything even remotely resembling logic or numbers or even a statement other than "you are a troll".
    Maybe your childish behaviour is indeed "typical pretentious BF", I don't know.

  25. #50
    Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    They should make the rule so that the bike should weigh 10% of the rider.
    Only then will there be an equal competition between riders.
    Seems like your interpretation of "equal" is "handicapped".

    Under today's rules, all the bike riders have to ride a bike of the same minimum weight (among other restrictions) along the same course, regardless of their conditioning or body type. That sounds equal to me.

    Coming up with a system that attempts to handicap particular riders relative to others is not equal competition, it's an attempt to stack the deck against the most gifted.

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