Advertise on Bikeforums.net



User Tag List

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 47
  1. #1
    Banned.
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    86
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    TDF pros not very good later in life ?

    Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like none of the TDF riders are the best riders when they hit their 40's and 50's.

    Do they stop racing ? Are they just worn out ?

  2. #2
    Super Moderator no1mad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    NE OK
    My Bikes
    '06 Kona Smoke
    Posts
    8,032
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Moved from General Cycling.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyril View Post
    Ride what and in what manner pleases you. Those that mind don't matter, and those that matter don't mind. srsly.
    Community guidelines

  3. #3
    Senior Member THSdrummer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Missouri
    My Bikes
    '12 CAAD10 3, '88 Raleigh Talon
    Posts
    658
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Think about how much of their lives are dedicated to cycling during their pro years. Every calorie and pedal stroke is calculated to improve performance. Replicating that level of precision training during retirement would be crazy, they might as well continue being a pro. This just being one of the multitude of reasons I see pros getting slower later in life.

    I also read that performing at a high level early in life usually means their body peaks and then breaks down around 27 years of age in men. Beginning training around this time provides better longevity and faster performances in older men (50, 60, 70, etc.) since the body isn't broken down and their training peak doesn't coincide with their physical peak.
    -THSdrummer
    Saving for: -
    Current Rides: 2012 Cannondale CAAD10 3
    1988 Raleigh Talon (my dad's)
    Cycling Fan - NCAA DII Runner - Looking to finally join the cycling community

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Escondido, CA
    Posts
    2,126
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by THSdrummer View Post
    Replicating that level of precision training during retirement would be crazy, they might as well continue being a pro.
    They physically can't continue being pros. Human bodies experience a slow decline in power and strength after mid-30's. It's pretty small (Chris Horner at 40 would still confidently kick asses of all 25-year-old Cat 1/2/3's in this country) but enough that the person would stop winning. Once you stop winning stages, it's time to retire. That's why racing organizations like USA Cycling have separate classes for under-35 and over-35 ("masters") with further age-based subclasses within masters.

    Pro racers might still be racing when they are 50, they just can't get into the same high-profile competitions like TDF, and there's probably much less (if any) money in it for them.

  5. #5
    pan y agua merlinextraligh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Jacksonville
    My Bikes
    Wilier Zero 7; Merlin Extralight; Co-Motion Robusta; Schwinn Paramount; Motobecane Phantom Cross; Cervelo P2; Motebecane Ti Fly 29er
    Posts
    27,397
    Mentioned
    10 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Like any former pro athletes, some of them get fat and lazy. Others stay in pretty good shape.

    A number of ex pros have done very well in L'Etape de Tour, which is not riding the actual TDF, but still takes pretty good shape to be at the pointy end.

    It's an incredibly demanding lifestyle to race at the Pro Tour level. It's unreasonable to expect anyone to stay at that level of fitness when their careers are over. That said, most old pros could still drop most of all of us at will.


    I don't think anybody here wants a sprint against Cippolini, even at his advanced age.

    http://cyclingperspective.com/mario-...pollini-bikes/
    Last edited by merlinextraligh; 02-25-14 at 01:29 PM.
    You could fall off a cliff and die.
    You could get lost and die.
    You could hit a tree and die.
    OR YOU COULD STAY HOME AND FALL OFF THE COUCH AND DIE.

  6. #6
    Senior Member SpeshulEd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Peoria, AZ
    Posts
    3,471
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Go tell that to Jensie!
    Hey guys, lets go play bikes!

    Strava

  7. #7
    pan y agua merlinextraligh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Jacksonville
    My Bikes
    Wilier Zero 7; Merlin Extralight; Co-Motion Robusta; Schwinn Paramount; Motobecane Phantom Cross; Cervelo P2; Motebecane Ti Fly 29er
    Posts
    27,397
    Mentioned
    10 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by hamster View Post

    Pro racers might still be racing when they are 50, they just can't get into the same high-profile competitions like TDF, and there's probably much less (if any) money in it for them.
    There are definitely guys racing 50+ in the U.S. that are ex pros. (which kinda sucks for us Cat 3's). For the most part though, its relatively low level former domestic pros.
    You could fall off a cliff and die.
    You could get lost and die.
    You could hit a tree and die.
    OR YOU COULD STAY HOME AND FALL OFF THE COUCH AND DIE.

  8. #8
    Senior Member MinnMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minneapolis
    My Bikes
    2011 Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220, 1991 Bianchi Osprey
    Posts
    1,645
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Jennie Longo

  9. #9
    Senior Member Worknomore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    SE Michigan
    My Bikes
    Serotta CRL, Litespeed Blue Ridge, Bacchetta Ti Aero, Cannondale delta V
    Posts
    282
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    They discover beer
    Litespeed Blue Ridge, Serotta Colorado CRL, Cannondale Delta-V, Bacchetta Ti-Aero

  10. #10
    Senior Member Jakedatc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Lil Rhody
    Posts
    2,129
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    most pro's in any sport are done by age 35 with a few exceptions.
    2007 CSK
    199? Trek 1420 ** 15% Off Hammer Nutrition Referral Code **

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Haunchyville
    Posts
    6,333
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Worknomore View Post
    They discover beer

  12. #12
    Senior Member MinnMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minneapolis
    My Bikes
    2011 Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220, 1991 Bianchi Osprey
    Posts
    1,645
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Jakedatc View Post
    most pro's in any sport are done by age 35 with a few exceptions.
    Cadel Evans is 37. Maybe he's not going to win the TdF again, but he's not getting dropped by the peloton AFAIK.
    And then there's Horner and Voigt.

  13. #13
    Senior Member MinnMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minneapolis
    My Bikes
    2011 Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220, 1991 Bianchi Osprey
    Posts
    1,645
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    OTOH, Greg Lemond doesn't look like he can be very fast at this weight:

    http://www.wired.com/geekdad/wp-cont.../01/LeMond.jpg

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Haunchyville
    Posts
    6,333
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
    Cadel Evans is 37. Maybe he's not going to win the TdF again, but he's not getting dropped by the peloton AFAIK.
    And then there's Horner and Voigt.
    There are always going to be a few. Notice Jakedatc said 'most'.

    It counters those that don't make it to 30.

  15. #15
    Senior Member MinnMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minneapolis
    My Bikes
    2011 Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220, 1991 Bianchi Osprey
    Posts
    1,645
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by canam73 View Post
    There are always going to be a few. Notice Jakedatc said 'most'.

    It counters those that don't make it to 30.
    I did notice the word "most", which means >50%, but combined with the word "done", I disagree. Perhaps there are different definitions of "done" There are plenty of good riders in their early-mid-30s - Wiggins is 33, Cancellara is 32 and about to go for the hour record. Maybe they won't be the best in the world 2-3 years, but I doubt that they will be anything other than first-class riders. Is that "done"?

  16. #16
    Senior Member MinnMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minneapolis
    My Bikes
    2011 Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220, 1991 Bianchi Osprey
    Posts
    1,645
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Actually, Cancellara will be 33 in 3 weeks

  17. #17
    Senior Member Jakedatc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Lil Rhody
    Posts
    2,129
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
    I did notice the word "most", which means >50%, but combined with the word "done", I disagree. Perhaps there are different definitions of "done" There are plenty of good riders in their early-mid-30s - Wiggins is 33, Cancellara is 32 and about to go for the hour record. Maybe they won't be the best in the world 2-3 years, but I doubt that they will be anything other than first-class riders. Is that "done"?
    Most... as in Most.. you named 3-4 more out of 150-200 pro tour riders? name me 60 others and you might be getting somewhere.
    2007 CSK
    199? Trek 1420 ** 15% Off Hammer Nutrition Referral Code **

  18. #18
    Senior Member MinnMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minneapolis
    My Bikes
    2011 Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220, 1991 Bianchi Osprey
    Posts
    1,645
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Jakedatc View Post
    Most... as in Most.. you named 3-4 more out of 150-200 pro tour riders? name me 60 others and you might be getting somewhere.
    If your definition of "done" is no longer in the pro tour at 35, I'm sure that's true. But there are different definitions of done. As in, they would still kick the butts of most everybody else in the world except for the top ~0.01%.

  19. #19
    Senior Member Jakedatc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Lil Rhody
    Posts
    2,129
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    The OP was talking about being in the tour de france. i'll even concede all pro tour events and spring classics.

    yes the retired pros would still dominate a weekend group ride and be competitive in non pro races.
    2007 CSK
    199? Trek 1420 ** 15% Off Hammer Nutrition Referral Code **

  20. #20
    Senior Member MinnMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minneapolis
    My Bikes
    2011 Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220, 1991 Bianchi Osprey
    Posts
    1,645
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    well, maybe the OP will come back and clarify what he meant, but he said that they're not the best riders when they are in their 40s and 50s. Unless the aging process is total news to him, I didn't take that to mean competition at the TdF level.

    BTW, there were, by my count, 13 riders 35+ in last year's TdF. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...Tour_de_France

  21. #21
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    St Paul, MN
    Posts
    47
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Maybe, because they no longer have access (or can not afford buy) the good drugs that had been used by so many in the past.

  22. #22
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Haunchyville
    Posts
    6,333
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by MinnMan View Post
    well, maybe the OP will come back and clarify what he meant, but he said that they're not the best riders when they are in their 40s and 50s. Unless the aging process is total news to him, I didn't take that to mean competition at the TdF level.

    BTW, there were, by my count, 13 riders 35+ in last year's TdF. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...Tour_de_France
    Sure. But it's more or less the same 13 as last year. But every year there are at least that many who ride the only TdF of their career. And many others who do 2-5 and are gone. That is the case for more than 50%.

  23. #23
    Senior Member downtube42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Columbus, Indiana
    My Bikes
    too many/not enough
    Posts
    1,546
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Motivation is such a huge factor in approaching your potential, at any age or ability level. Most people are not going to have that drive when the results are no linger possible. Some ex pros do find other avenues.
    What is bicycle touring?
    "So I kept looking and eventually found that a spark plug had same threads. So I cycled next two days until I got to Jackson, MS with a spark plug instead of right pedal." - mev

  24. #24
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Escondido, CA
    Posts
    2,126
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    The problem with TDF participation is that there are many factors influencing it. Aside from aging, you have burnout, retirement due to injuries, etc. Most pro cyclists are already competing professionally by age 25. Wiggins was representing the UK at the Olympics at 20, Cancellara was signed up by his first pro team at 19. Not everyone has stamina and motivation to keep going for 15+ years. The oldest active cyclists tend to be "late bloomers", relatively speaking. For example, Jens Voigt is still active at 41, but he didn't turn pro till about 25 because he spent 4 years in the German Army.

    And results at TDF poorly correlate with performance because group dynamics plays a large role.

    To get an idea how aging affects athletic performance, here's a plot estimating how fast it would take a hypothetical world-best male runner to run a marathon at different ages (for men, the specific distance does not seem to matter much, the curve would be pretty much the same for 5 km and for a marathon, just the overall scale would change):



    As an interesting side note, actual average times at large marathons rise much slower with age. An average 30 year old male runs an average marathon in about 4:15. This chart would suggest that an average 40 year old would be slower by about 6 minutes (2.5%) and an average 50 year old would be slower by 30 minutes (10%). In the real world, 40 year olds are about as fast as 30 year olds, and 50 year olds are only slower by about 10 minutes. The reason is that older recreational runners are more experienced and they are closer to their own peak potential. (This only works for regular guys, but not for pros.)

  25. #25
    Senior Member MinnMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minneapolis
    My Bikes
    2011 Felt F3 Ltd, 2010 Trek 2.1, 2009 KHS Flite 220, 1991 Bianchi Osprey
    Posts
    1,645
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    That's a very interesting graph, but research shows that cycling and running are not necessarily the same in this respect. Diminished race speed may be more gradual for cyclists.

    See for example

    www.ajol.info/index.php/sasma/article/download/31858/23635‎

    If the link gives you trouble, the first sentence of the conclusion is,
    "In conclusion, this study established a trend that age-related decrements in performance occur at an earlier age in running compared with cycling in the specific races used in this study."

    St. Clair et al. 2004 "Age-related decrements in cycling and running performance" Sports Medicine v. 16 pp 8-11.

    Caveat: Perhaps the specific races that they examined are not representative. Or perhaps race speed is less dependent on ability in cycling, where drafting and group dynamics apply.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •