Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Recreational Cyclocross and Gravelbiking This has to be the most physically intense sport ever invented. It's high speed bicycle racing on a short off road course or riding the off pavement rides on gravel like :The Dirty Kanza". We also have a dedicated Racing forum for the Cyclocross Hard Core Racers.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-09-16, 06:28 PM   #1
poprad 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
poprad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: In transit
Bikes: 07 Vanilla, 98 IRD road frame built up with 25th Ann DA, Surly cross check with 105 comp, 78 Raleigh Comp GS, 85 Centurionelli
Posts: 1,577
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Jamis Renegade Exploit

Hey all,
I usually post over in the C&V area, but working in a bike shop has enabled my addiction and directed me towards something made this decade. I rode this bike once (have been test riding bikes every weekend I work there for over a year) and could not let it go out the door to someone else. Jamis really spec'ed the hell out of this, for 2k you get full 105 and HYRD cable actuated discs. Pretty damn sweet, and rides awesome.

No, I don't work for Jamis and only spend time in the shop as recreation from my day job. I just had to share what an incredible bike they have put out, and one that could easily get overlooked with its less-flashy looks.


No good without pics, right?



If you like the ride of steel you could do a lot worse...
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20160206_122320.jpg (98.9 KB, 92 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_20160206_122349.jpg (98.7 KB, 67 views)
__________________
I live in search of finest examples of the 3 B's: Bikes, Beans (coffee), and Beer
poprad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-16, 07:33 PM   #2
Andy_K 
Senior Member
 
Andy_K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Beaverton, OR
Bikes: 2013 Kona Jake, 2015 Kona Jake the Snake, 2008 Kona Major Jake, 2013 Kona Jake the Snake, 2006 Kona Kula, 2012 Ridley Excalibur, 2001 LeMond Buenos Aires, 1984 Pinarello Gran Turismo, 1982 Trek 614, 1978 Austro-Daimler, 1987 Pinarello Montello
Posts: 8,936
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 221 Post(s)
That is a good looking bike. I've been planning a new gravel grinder build, and that is one of the bikes I was looking at.
__________________
My Bikes
Andy_K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-16, 08:33 PM   #3
GeoKrpan
George Krpan
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Westlake Village, California
Bikes:
Posts: 1,689
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Nice bike, Jamis makes good bikes.
GeoKrpan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-16, 08:53 PM   #4
poprad 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
poprad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: In transit
Bikes: 07 Vanilla, 98 IRD road frame built up with 25th Ann DA, Surly cross check with 105 comp, 78 Raleigh Comp GS, 85 Centurionelli
Posts: 1,577
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Thanks, it really rides well too. I'm pretty discerning about the feel of a bike, and won't add to my ridiculously large stable (to me anyway, at 11 bikes) unless it's something special. Frankly the aesthetics with the slopey top tube, huge head tube, and putty-gray paint are definitely not my usual look, but the ride sold me. Completely. I normally use a '78 Colnago Super for gravel (and it handles it with aplomb with modern rims and 28mm ties) and that silk-smooth ride is my yardstick. This bike is the first I've tried from our shop that measured up, and that includes Jamis' $4k carbon model and Bianchi's as well.
__________________
I live in search of finest examples of the 3 B's: Bikes, Beans (coffee), and Beer
poprad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-16, 10:39 AM   #5
b0rderline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Bikes:
Posts: 76
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by poprad View Post
Thanks, it really rides well too. I'm pretty discerning about the feel of a bike, and won't add to my ridiculously large stable (to me anyway, at 11 bikes) unless it's something special. Frankly the aesthetics with the slopey top tube, huge head tube, and putty-gray paint are definitely not my usual look, but the ride sold me. Completely. I normally use a '78 Colnago Super for gravel (and it handles it with aplomb with modern rims and 28mm ties) and that silk-smooth ride is my yardstick. This bike is the first I've tried from our shop that measured up, and that includes Jamis' $4k carbon model and Bianchi's as well.
What size have You tried and how tall are You? the reason I am asking is that Renegade, and the same goes with GT Grade seems to be bigger than it should when You look at frame size only. This creates a lot of problems for guy like me, who ends exactly in between sizes M and L.

The other question is obviously about the weight. It is heavy bike but is that a big problem? How fast it accelerates and how stiff is the frame in terms of power transfer?
b0rderline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-16, 02:57 PM   #6
Andy_K 
Senior Member
 
Andy_K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Beaverton, OR
Bikes: 2013 Kona Jake, 2015 Kona Jake the Snake, 2008 Kona Major Jake, 2013 Kona Jake the Snake, 2006 Kona Kula, 2012 Ridley Excalibur, 2001 LeMond Buenos Aires, 1984 Pinarello Gran Turismo, 1982 Trek 614, 1978 Austro-Daimler, 1987 Pinarello Montello
Posts: 8,936
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 221 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rderline View Post
What size have You tried and how tall are You? the reason I am asking is that Renegade, and the same goes with GT Grade seems to be bigger than it should when You look at frame size only. This creates a lot of problems for guy like me, who ends exactly in between sizes M and L.
I'm not sure what you mean by "seems bigger than it should" but if you find yourself exactly between two sizes it means one of two things: (1) either size will work for you, or (2) neither size will work for you.

Bike fit mostly boils down to stack and reach. The labels attached to a size (even when that label is a number) don't really tell you anything that translates across bikes except in the most general way but stack and reach are consistent pieces of data. For instance, my ideal fit on a 2008 Kona Jake was the 54 size. On a 2013 Jake it was a 53. On a 2016 Jake it would be a 51. These three bikes are all effectively the same size, even though Kona labeled them differently (because of changes in seat tube length which has virtually no impact on fit). Anyway, my point is that fit is based on stack and reach and in most cases you can translate the stack and reach from one size to the next by changing the stem to move the bars 10mm or so closer or further away and 10mm or so higher or lower.

I mention the second possibility (being "between two sizes" meaning that neither size will work) because some bikes just don't have the kind of geometry you want. For instance, I like my handlebars about level with my saddle. When I bought a Cross Check I thought I was between the 52 and the 54. The 52 had the reach I wanted, but the bars were too low. The 54 raised the bars (still not as much as I would have liked) but the reach was too much. Ultimately I was able to make the 52 work with a really steep stem angle (an uncut fork with a lot of spacers would have done it too). After riding the bike for a couple of years I decided that I just wanted a bike with different geometry. If you find yourself between two sizes, this may be the issue.
__________________
My Bikes
Andy_K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-16, 03:31 PM   #7
09box
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Bikes:
Posts: 624
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
I think that Jamis make good solid bikes and usually don't get mentioned along the other top tier brands..
09box is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-16, 04:54 PM   #8
poprad 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
poprad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: In transit
Bikes: 07 Vanilla, 98 IRD road frame built up with 25th Ann DA, Surly cross check with 105 comp, 78 Raleigh Comp GS, 85 Centurionelli
Posts: 1,577
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rderline View Post
What size have You tried and how tall are You? the reason I am asking is that Renegade, and the same goes with GT Grade seems to be bigger than it should when You look at frame size only. This creates a lot of problems for guy like me, who ends exactly in between sizes M and L.

The other question is obviously about the weight. It is heavy bike but is that a big problem? How fast it accelerates and how stiff is the frame in terms of power transfer?
Going last to first: I've never been a weight weenie, esp on durable bikes with long-lasting running gear like the Exploit. If you're not coming to the table with $3k or more don't even think about weight. Upgrade your wheels down the road if it's an issue for you, that's the weight you sense when pedaling anyway.

Fit is very, very individual, but FWIW I'm 6 foot and have a 34 inseam, and fit the 58 on this model. I normally ride anything from 59 to 62. As stated above, every brand sizing is different, and even year to year with some manufacturers can be different. I prefer a shorter reach than some, so will be converting to a zero setback seatpost (Thomson Master) to get my saddle further forward than possible with the stock setup. Be ready to change seatpost and stem to customize fit.

The biggest thing that irritates me is the modern trend to ship forks pre-cut. They should ship any bike over $1k with an uncut steerer. The shop should then work with you to develop the perfect stem height for your body, but that's just not reality today. Shame, really, as it would really improve most customer's fit immensely (provided the shop had the knowledge and patience).
__________________
I live in search of finest examples of the 3 B's: Bikes, Beans (coffee), and Beer
poprad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-16, 04:57 PM   #9
poprad 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
poprad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: In transit
Bikes: 07 Vanilla, 98 IRD road frame built up with 25th Ann DA, Surly cross check with 105 comp, 78 Raleigh Comp GS, 85 Centurionelli
Posts: 1,577
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 09box View Post
I think that Jamis make good solid bikes and usually don't get mentioned along the other top tier brands..
Absolutely. I'd never heard of them before I started temping at the shop, and now am very impressed with their quality, esp their spec of parts at a given price point. That, and their bikes ride very nice, just good quality builds overall. I'm happy to have stumbled into them.
__________________
I live in search of finest examples of the 3 B's: Bikes, Beans (coffee), and Beer
poprad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-16, 09:27 AM   #10
b0rderline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Bikes:
Posts: 76
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
I mention the second possibility (being "between two sizes" meaning that neither size will work) because some bikes just don't have the kind of geometry you want. For instance, I like my handlebars about level with my saddle. When I bought a Cross Check I thought I was between the 52 and the 54. The 52 had the reach I wanted, but the bars were too low. The 54 raised the bars (still not as much as I would have liked) but the reach was too much.
This is exactly why I have not bought GT Grade eventually. L sized was simply too big for me and I did not want to have stem 8 cm long. The M size on other hand had too big sandle to handlebar drop which I could not compensade enough by adding more spacers.

I am afraid that the same goes with Exploit which has a long top tube and short stem as a standard (9 cm in a L size frame).

So, to be honest, stack and reach does not tell the whole story. Top tube length and saddle to handlebar drop is also very important. Only when all of this will match Your needs, You can say that You have a proper sized bike. And for me, this is not an easy task...
b0rderline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-16, 10:51 AM   #11
Andy_K 
Senior Member
 
Andy_K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Beaverton, OR
Bikes: 2013 Kona Jake, 2015 Kona Jake the Snake, 2008 Kona Major Jake, 2013 Kona Jake the Snake, 2006 Kona Kula, 2012 Ridley Excalibur, 2001 LeMond Buenos Aires, 1984 Pinarello Gran Turismo, 1982 Trek 614, 1978 Austro-Daimler, 1987 Pinarello Montello
Posts: 8,936
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 221 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rderline View Post
So, to be honest, stack and reach does not tell the whole story. Top tube length and saddle to handlebar drop is also very important. Only when all of this will match Your needs, You can say that You have a proper sized bike. And for me, this is not an easy task...
Not to nitpick, but this is the point of stack and reach. The theory is that you will adjust you saddle to maintain the same position of your saddle relative to the bottom bracket (which effectively adjusts the top tube length for seat tube angle). Given this starting position, stack and reach tell you where the bars will be before stem adjustments. Reach is a more or less function of top tube length adjusted for seat tube angle and stack is more or less a function of fork and head tube length adjusted for head tube angle and bottom bracket drop.
__________________
My Bikes
Andy_K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-16, 11:12 AM   #12
b0rderline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Bikes:
Posts: 76
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
Not to nitpick, but this is the point of stack and reach. The theory is that you will adjust you saddle to maintain the same position of your saddle relative to the bottom bracket (which effectively adjusts the top tube length for seat tube angle). Given this starting position, stack and reach tell you where the bars will be before stem adjustments. Reach is a more or less function of top tube length adjusted for seat tube angle and stack is more or less a function of fork and head tube length adjusted for head tube angle and bottom bracket drop.
OK, I did't now that. It makes sense but I think there is one more thing to consider when buying a bike - how many spacers can You put to increase the handlebar height. In case of GT Grade You are limited to 15 mm. Salsa Warbird can take at least twice as that. So even when saddle to handlebar will be the same initially, You can change this easily without the need of using high rising stem (which changes also the reach and can have more bad influence on bike's handling).
b0rderline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-16, 03:13 PM   #13
Andy_K 
Senior Member
 
Andy_K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Beaverton, OR
Bikes: 2013 Kona Jake, 2015 Kona Jake the Snake, 2008 Kona Major Jake, 2013 Kona Jake the Snake, 2006 Kona Kula, 2012 Ridley Excalibur, 2001 LeMond Buenos Aires, 1984 Pinarello Gran Turismo, 1982 Trek 614, 1978 Austro-Daimler, 1987 Pinarello Montello
Posts: 8,936
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 221 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by b0rderline View Post
OK, I did't now that. It makes sense but I think there is one more thing to consider when buying a bike - how many spacers can You put to increase the handlebar height. In case of GT Grade You are limited to 15 mm. Salsa Warbird can take at least twice as that. So even when saddle to handlebar will be the same initially, You can change this easily without the need of using high rising stem (which changes also the reach and can have more bad influence on bike's handling).
That's true. Forks with a carbon steerer typically limit you to 10-20mm of spacers, depending on the fork manufacturer, so even if you bought a frameset with an uncut fork there would be that functional limit. With a steel fork you could, in theory, have a huge stack (as seen on many Long Haul Truckers) but as poprad observes most manufacturers pre-cut the fork these days. You can still raise the bars with a steeply angled stem, but it limits you and many people don't like the way it looks.
__________________
My Bikes
Andy_K is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:31 PM.