Jarrett2

I can verify my red 56 build is 2+ lbs lighter than my daughter's 54 Cross Check with smaller tires on it. The Cross Check feels like it has lead in it compared to my BMC bikes.

FlashBazbo

My last set of canti's were on an '82 Diamondback mountain bike. They were only slightly less effective at stopping the bike than dragging my feet on the ground. They soured me for life.

I have to say that those who say they have canti's that actually slow the bike have piqued my curiosity.

mstateglfr 

1- you tried some brakes 35 years ago and swore that style off forever without trying other versions?
2- if cantilever brakes are set up poorly, they wont work well. Same with caliper brakes, disc brakes, and Vbrakes.
3- I am 230# and use cantilever brakes for my touring bike and gravel bike. They not only stop my heavy self when riding, they stop me when loaded down with 30# of gear too.

They arent for everyone, clearly, but I genuinely think that most who passionately hate cantilever brakes used some which werent properly set up.

ksryder

LOL same here. My gravel bike came with some horrible Tektro Oryx cantis that mostly suggested rather than stopped. I replaced with them with Tektro CR720s after reading lots of positive feedback on the stopping power of those cantis. The difference was almost nonexistent.

Finally installed a set of Tektro 926AL mini-vs. Damn near sent me over the handlebars the first time I tried them out.

Only advantage I can see these days of rim brakes vs. disc anymore is that used rim brake frames are dirt cheap. Which is why I still have rim brakes.

Loose Chain

Yes, of course I want disc brakes, I want to make my bike heavier, more complicated, more difficult to swap wheels, more expensive and even worse, weld all sorts of silly brackets all over to accommodate them gaining more weight to make it uglier.

chas58

oh, come on.

all brake types work well, if using a quality product set up properly. They will stop the bike fast and hard.

The real innovation is for hydralic disks. cable disks aren't light years ahead. hydralic disks stop as hard as any other brake, the difference is that they offer better modulation.

And sure, if you are getting muck on your rim, disks obviously have the advantage (well, except that they wear much faster when they get mucky).

Kopsis

+1

People get way to religious about this stuff. All the options have pros and cons and not every prioritizes the same so the idea of "one brake to rule them all" really doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Loose Chain

Yes, I agree except as noted in my previous post. And since you agree all types work well then it would follow that both styles are offered. However, suddenly for those like the OP, cantis are not offered. Thus the problem proffered by the OP. It would not be a problem if both types of brake systems were offered without compromising the other. Swiss Army style frames that can accept both are even uglier.

J

canklecat

Assuming proper setup, alignment, etc., pads make a big difference.

I use canti pads that are longer than the original Shimano types common a decade or more ago. On the back I have Kool Stop Eagle 2 salmon pads. They're pretty long compared with the original Shimano pads. The wedge shaped plow tip that makes first contact with the rim helps scrape off water and mud in bad conditions, and helps with alignment -- no need for toe-in tricks, it's self aligning.

Only gripes I had about the Kool Stop Eagle 2:

• A bit too wide for my old Araya rims, making alignment critical to avoid rubbing the tires, or uneven wear by placing the pads too far from the tire.
• Too thick, interfering with opening the front brakes enough to clear the fork and drop out/re-install a fully inflated front tire.

So I tried Jagwire black canti pads on the front rims. Perfect. They stop just as well as the Kool Stop salmon pads. They're even longer, so there's plenty of contact surface for positive braking. They're narrower, so there's no risk of tire rub or uneven wear. And they're thinner, so I can drop out the front wheel and reinstall a fully inflated tire. While the pads do contact the front fork they're thin enough to provide clearance.

Only minor drawback was I did need to use the toe-in tricks (shim, rubber band or nylon zip tie). Not a big deal.

But despite my most careful efforts to set up these 1990s Shimano Exage era canti brakes, it still demands three fingers on the levers for serious braking. There's a lot of spring resistance. I could reduce the spring pressure a bit by choosing a different return spring mounting hole in the post, but it might lead to less positive spring return. And there's some inefficiency inherent to the cantilever cable yoke design.

If you compare cantis with V-brakes, the linear pull design isn't that much different. It mostly substitutes longer rigid arms for the cable yoke. Less stretch, more positive feel. Combined with the lower spring tension on the arms you need only one finger on well adjusted V-brakes.

And V-brakes should be able to accommodate fenders or the widest tires suitable for a frame and fork. The inexpensive Tektro arms on my comfort hybrid brakes bow out slightly to accommodate even wider tires. But I'd need different rims to go wider than my current 700x42.

The cable yoke design on my mountain bike would limit fenders or wider tires. And the 700x42 tires I have on that bike now are uncomfortably close to the cable clamp bolt on the front derailer, so to install fatter tires I'd need different rims, a different front derailer (or run a single chain ring), and a close eye on the canti brake cable yoke to be sure it wouldn't snag the tire.

Another problem with canti brakes: If the main cable snaps or loosens from the yoke, the cable yoke can snag the tire with catastrophic results. The sudden stop of a cable yoke against a knobby front tire could lead to a potentially fatal over-the-bars crash. That's why bikes with canti brakes should be fitted with safety catch arms that usually double as reflector holders. The previous owner removed those from my bike and I really should replace those safety catch arms. However the previous owner had installed fenders, which served the same purpose. However I removed the fenders to accommodate wider, softer riding tires. I'm not running knobbies so I'm hoping it's less risky. But I really should either reinstall the safety catch arms, or wider fenders.

grolby

Fully endorsed.

Uhh. No thanks. If this is a concern (I've got cable yokes on my Ridley and don't lose sleep over it), the Shimano-style link wire is a much more elegant solution.

Incidentally, of course going over the bars CAN be fatal, but it usually isn't (ASK ME HOW I KNOW) and there are a lot of ways of doing it that are a hell of a lot more likely than a failed straddle cable (again, ask me how I know).

canklecat

Yep, my '92 mountain bike has the Shimano link wires. But just about every Shimano canti brake equipped mountain bike back then still included those safety catches. Probably mostly a liability concern.

I may be a bit gun shy after a crash a few weeks ago (not due to brake failure). Still nursing some busted up ribs, although now it hurts only when I sneeze or roll over the wrong way in bed.

FrankHudson

Hey, I've got that bike (or near enough to it)! When I bought it I was trading up from steel rim bikes. I was so impressed with the braking at the time. In my younger days I loved it on gravel fire roads and such, and maybe I was foolish, but it seemed to have enough brakes. Now it tends to get used in slower rides around the city with my son. I do dislike the long Diacomp arms on the cantis, makes it fiddly to fit panniers on the rack. On the other hand I suppose I could put orange flags on those long canti arms and use them as "leave clearance warnings" for cars in the city.

Jagwire pads on my DB Ridgerunner now. Stops, but yes I use three fingers. My current winter bike has mechanical discs. Needs less lever force and discs seem impervious to water, snow and slush.

beicster 

I have bikes with traditional canti's, v-brakes, centerpulls, side pull calipers and disc brakes. I like them all. However, when I first started riding in the early 90's, I hated canti's with a passion because I lacked the skill to set them up properly. I have never been known for having fine motor skills or finesse. I used crank them down as hard as I could and, inevitably, screw up the pad adjustment. Learning how to set them up and learning about salmon pads (as opposed to those bricks that used to come on Shimano canti's) has made a world of difference. Also, the canti's that use the bolt on pads make life a lot easier.

Cptimagine

Using these cantis with STI levers 20+ years . Until now they've never caused me to fall off .
IMG_3675.jpg
IMG_3673.jpg

dgodave

I've had some nice rims ruined by rim-brakes over the years. Seems discs wouldnt do that.

mstateglfr 

This is like saying youve had some nice handlebar tape ruined by your hands over the years.
Instead of ruined rims, you will have some nice discs ruined if you use those.

dgodave

I see discs as expendable or whatever the word is. Like chains. Not so with rims, for me.

gregf83 

Discs are stainless steel so presumably last longer than aluminum rims and are much simpler and inexpensive to replace.

mstateglfr 

For me, everything on a bike is eventually a consumable. No, rims shouldnt wear out as often as a chain, but rims wearing out after 10000mi or whatever means they lasted a lon damn time.

I just thought it was funny to see brake pads being blamed for rims wearing out as thats what they are supposed to do.

mstateglfr 

No disagreement that a disc is easier replace.

I just never knew so many found rims to be some big deal to replace. Rims last for thousands upon thlusands of miles and last many years even when used heavily. Heck, I have rims that are 30 years old which have been used moderately.

It is always nice to see other perspectives here as many are ones i would habe never considered, like rim use being something to worry about.

gregf83 

I ride thousands and thousands of miles. Rims last 2-3 yrs when riding regularly in the winter. I have to either buy new wheels or take in the wheels and have them rebuilt. Just a hassle I'd rather not deal with.

I agree with you on my summer bike which doesn't need disc brakes.

Cptimagine

I'll stay with cantis, and encourage any and all to upgrade to discs . As the disc revolution moves forward . The use of them, makes lotsa built "wheels", instantly obsolete . The falling price of which makes new/old wheels on craigslist a treat . My latest score, Camp Record clincher aero wheel set, as new, $100 with skewers and cassette .
"The other mans grass is always greener, both have to mow it however ."

dgodave

For sure.
For years I just assumed rim wear was just the-way-it-is. And I braked-through a number of rims that were otherwise fine on mtbs. (Hasnt been a problem on road tho.)

Then disc brakes came along and ended all that!

Ghazmh

Interesting points of view. I have mechanical disc, hydraulic disk, dual pivot, and V brake equipped bikes and agree that when properly set up and with good pads all meet my slow down and stopping needs. That includes my fully loaded non disc touring bike. The hydraulic brakes "feel" the most authoritative and give the best feedback and modulation IMHO. I am shopping for a cross 1x bike to be my winter road bike and am heavily leaning towards a canti equipped Trek. Good rim brake wheelsets are cheaper than good disc wheelsets. As a previous poster said, you can find replacement rim brake wheels on Craigslist pretty cheap.

fietsbob

there is,... because Maxway TW Ltd is who makes Richeys bikes, and, they also make Surly's 'fatties fit fine' Cross Checks,

It just wont say Richey on the frame..