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  1. #1
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    CX bike choices.. help

    1) 2010 Fuji Cross Pro Bike with SRAM Rival..
    2) Motobecane Fantom Cross Outlaw with BB5 disc brakes (I am very interested in the disc brakes)
    3) Giant TCX 1 with SRAM Rival. Or TCX 0 with Ultegra (cost too much, though) Should be around 18-19lbs from my research, it's got a very good aluminum frame.
    4) Motobecane Titanium Cross.. I was told this was 19 lbs on a 56cm frame, so I am not sure if the weight was worth the money. But it is Disc brake ready

    I fell in love with the Fuji, however Performance just raised the price these couple days by $200, so it's is off the selection now.. the Moto cross Pro is also almost the same bike with a slightly older frame for $999.

    I am not a racer but will be using it on road riding 40 miles+ and trail sometimes, and commute

  2. #2
    Team Water Andy_K's Avatar
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    I've been coveting that Giant TCX. It's a very nice bike, probably better as a race/trail bike than as a commuter (no eyelets, rack braze-ons?). The Motobecanes are probably the best value, but let me say that you'd probably be disappointed with the BB5's. It is, however, an easy and not terribly expensive process to upgrade to the much nicer BB7s. Have you tried telling the manager at Performance that you took the Fuji off your list because of the price hike? I understand they have some flexibility.

    Don't underestimate the value of a test ride.

  3. #3
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    I think PB is pushing their road bikes or something, they raised ALL their CX bikes like 20% across the board.
    There is one with a bit of assembly problem at my local PB. It needs quite a bit of work.

    if I get the Fantom outlaw I would swap in the BB7 when assembling. The BB5 rotors look heavy also. I rather have disc brakes over the nicer drivetrain.

    I read something the TCX medium size is sub 20lbs, I don't even think the Fuji is. The frame looks nice.
    Is it worth getting the TCX 0 which cost quite alot more (Ultegra) over TCX 1 (Rival), probably street price is less than $2000, does anyone know the street price for 2010? MSRP is like $2400, yikes.

    As for the rack mount it's good to have, I would like to add fender, does a fender use the same mount, or can use a clip on one on the seatpost?

  4. #4
    Ths Hipstr Kills Masheenz cc700's Avatar
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    the price hike is due to it being in season.

    unless you're used to extremely nice race grade stuff, rival is going to be awesome and ultegra is not worth the jump in price.

    fenders that clip to the bike are never as effective as full fenders. if you are going to commute, look into the kona jake and jake the snake. they come disc ready and make great commuter/race bikes.

  5. #5
    Team Water Andy_K's Avatar
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    I'm not even sure everyone would agree that Ultegra is an upgrade over Rival. The TCX0 does come with nicer wheels and brakes. I'm not sure that justifies the price difference.

    I've been a huge fan of the Kona Jake (I have a 2008) for a couple of years, but it looks to me like they've changed the direction for it, nudging it more in the race direction. I think that's a mistake for this bike. The 2011 model comes with an aluminum fork and seems to have lost its rack mounts. Since 2008, the crank spec has slid from FSA Gossamer to Shimano Sora. Also, I would say it's not disc-ready, unless you count the option of swapping out the front fork.

    A 2010 Jake would be a good option if you can find one locally.

    The Outlaw looks like a great commuting bike, especially if you replace the brakes with BB7, but it will be distinctly heavier than the others you're considering.

  6. #6
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    Does the 2009 regular Jake have disc tabs on the frame
    Also I prefer not to buy another set of wheels

  7. #7
    Team Water Andy_K's Avatar
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    I'm not aware of any Jake that has disc tabs.

  8. #8
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    It may be limiting to rule out any bike that doesn't have the rack mounts..

    The outlaw in brushed looks nice, you say it's heavier because of the lesser components?

    All the fantom cross shares the same frame which is seems to be same as the previous fuji frame, the current fuji has a diamond shape downtube for a while now.

  9. #9
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    The main reason I say the Outlaw will be heavier is because disc brakes make a bike heavier. The hubs are heavier, there's more weight from the brakes and in general the frame and fork need to be a bit beefier to handle the strain of the extra braking power. That said, I was just looking at the Outlaw frameset on eBay and they claim the frame, fork and headset weigh about 5.5 pounds. That's not bad at all, if accurate. Still, I would expect the complete bike to weigh at least 23 pounds, which is good for a commuter and not terrible for a road bike. The weight difference of Tiagra components vs. Rival/Ultegra is nearly negligible -- I'd guess less than half a pound total.

  10. #10
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    I wonder how does the Giant TCX get it so light then..? can the alloy be that much better?

    Here is one post that says medium is 19.5 lbs about half way down.

    http://weightweenies.starbike.com/fo...hp?f=5&t=64691

  11. #11
    Team Water Andy_K's Avatar
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    The shape and butting of the tubing can make a big difference. Carbon forks vary by nearly a pound from the heaviest to the lightest on the market. I'm just speculating on the total weight of the Outlaw, but just the brakes weigh nearly two pounds, counting the rotors, whereas the brakes on the TCX0 come in around 200 grams. The wheels on the TCX0 are probably significantly lighter too.

  12. #12
    Ths Hipstr Kills Masheenz cc700's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy_K View Post
    I'm not aware of any Jake that has disc tabs.
    there definitely are a few. the original major jake had them, a JTS from a while ago had them, and i thought the new JTS had them. i could be wrong about the 2011 though. i followed a JTS with blue main triangle that had them at a cross practice last night, so i got a good look at them.

  13. #13
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    So no inputs on the moto titanium? which is disc ready.

    Are they just a commodity metal and not actually as light as I thought, there is another member on here he e-mailed me and said his 56cm is 19lbs.
    The weight could be wheels or sometimes generic stem and seatpost that they come with though.

    I don't mean to sound like a weight weenie but if I am paying close to $2k I kind of want to pick a lightest one.

  14. #14
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    I am able to get 10% off MSRP off any of the Giant 2011 TCX.. tax included do you think that's a good deal?

  15. #15
    Hills hurt.. Couches kill RacerOne's Avatar
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    I just picked up a used Moto Fantom Outlaw, size 58, 23lbs 7 ounces on my scale. It's my first cross bike.. seems nice so far.

  16. #16
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    What about this?
    Chromoly frame and fork, disc brakes, tripple gear,
    sounds like a nice bike that I can take everywhere.. but I can't find any reviews on one. But since I plan to commute in the rain maybe it's not a good idea


    http://bicyclespleasanton.com/produc...ic-58710-1.htm
    Last edited by PoorBiker; 10-09-10 at 09:07 AM.

  17. #17
    Senior Member meanwhile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jho View Post
    What about this?
    Chromoly frame and fork, disc brakes, tripple gear,
    sounds like a nice bike that I can take everywhere.. but I can't find any reviews on one. But since I plan to commute in the rain maybe it's not a good idea


    http://bicyclespleasanton.com/produc...ic-58710-1.htm
    Cromolly bikes survive for decades in even the UK's climate as long as you're not stupid with them. If you want to be really careful, pull the equipment off and spray the inside of the frame with Frame Saver.

  18. #18
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    Does chromoly rust as much as mild steel does? Do I have to dry my bike after riding in the rain?

  19. #19
    Team Water Andy_K's Avatar
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    I use a steel bike for riding in the rain here in Oregon, where it rains nearly every day from September to June. I didn't apply Frame Saver. I don't dry it off. I leave it out in the rain for 8+ hours while I'm at work. I wipe it clean once every other week or so. I do keep the chain oiled. As it heads into it's third winter, I haven't seen any rust on it. It's probably got some surface rust inside the tubes, but the fact is that surface rust protects steel from additional corrosion.

    I've got another steel bike, a '77 Gitane, that was left neglected in a barn for 30 years. The chain was so rusty I was able to break it with my hands. The wheels were covered in rust and useless. The aluminum stem was bonded to the steerer tube. But the frame itself only had a few spots of surface rust where the paint had scratched off and a small amount of rust inside the bottom bracket. Pictures will show this better than words:









    This last picture is what it looked like after I removed all the rusted components and rebuilt it with new parts. The only thing I did to the frame was sand off a few spots of rust and slap some mis-matched touch-up paint over any bare spots.

    So that's what you can expect from chromoly.

  20. #20
    experience over lungs
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    Quote Originally Posted by jho View Post
    I wonder how does the Giant TCX get it so light then..? can the alloy be that much better?

    Here is one post that says medium is 19.5 lbs about half way down.

    http://weightweenies.starbike.com/fo...hp?f=5&t=64691
    My Marin Cortina, while pretty different geometry, is otherwise quite similar and just tips the scales at 19 lbs in a 52.

  21. #21
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    Hi, I came across a few bikes with Shimano 105.. is it any good ? Just for everyday use and commuting, the 105 is a good workhorse shifting system right?

    while Rival is supposed to be a better group, I don't really like the Rival shifting action

    also, some bikes have carbon seatstays, that should be good to absorb vibration, do you think it compromise the lifetime of the frame?
    it doesn't have the rack mount but I think something like one single eyelet in the rear, does that mean I could probably still add fender to it.
    Last edited by PoorBiker; 10-10-10 at 09:41 PM.

  22. #22
    Team Water Andy_K's Avatar
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    105 is great stuff. I think it works as well as Ultegra.

    Carbon seatstays probably don't compromise the lifetime of the frame by themselves, but if you try attaching a rack to them they could, but even then only if you had a heavy load on rough terrain.

  23. #23
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    so I found a NOS 2009 Jamis Nova Pro -- possible purchase..
    Specs as follows. (just a hint over 21 lbs)

    http://www.jamisbikes.com/usa/thebik...apro_spec.html

    I think it is exactly the same as 2010.. The 2011 comes with SRAM Apex.
    I previous tested a 105 road bike and liked how it shifted over the Rival.

    The color is not my taste.. I suspect that's why it's still around

    Components comparable to Fuji Cross Comp which is 23lbs but this bike is lighter 21 lbs has carbon seatstays which I am interested in, flat bottom top tube,
    clearance price $999 and MSRP was $1550.
    The wheels have alot of spokes however that maybe a good thing to get some durability with it.
    I read the Tektro Oryx brake that come with it are not that good so maybe I may decide swap in Shimano BR-R550 ($70)

    Anything you see good or bad with the components?
    After tax about $1100 out the door, but the spouse is happy about less than $1k before tax.

    I did pre-negotiated a special order on 2011 TCX 1 with my Giant dealer for $1500 out the door. But then it's a Rival which the front derailleur kind of bothers me even when properly setup.

    I am not sure the fender mount situation but I think it has one bolt on the seat clamp or something. The TCX's certainly don't come with any.

  24. #24
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    Tested out the Jamis and didn't really like it, but the carbon seatstay seems to be a good feature.
    I am considering this bike now from Rocky Mountain Top model ($1680) supposed to be made in Canada and sub 20lbs,

    http://www.bikes.com/DATA/BIKE/850_en.pdf

    all the parts seems very good.. wheels, saddles, carbon stem, carbon seatstay frame.

    does it look like the rear take fenders?

    and I am concerned about the gear ratio, 46x38T. Is that going to be slow for road biking, I prefer something like 50x36 but it is expensive to change out being a full rival crank.


    I found myself to be cross shopping for a carbon road bike now. But with no fenders mean I could not ride in the rain, and I look strange commuting in one.

  25. #25
    Team Water Andy_K's Avatar
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    I've heard nothing but good things about Rocky Mountain bikes. I see fender eyelets on the rear, but I can't see them on the front.

    It looks like you're getting more comfortable with a higher budget. At that price point, there are a lot of choices and nearly all of them are good. You just need to decide how you want to prioritize commuting vs. road riding vs. CX racing. Any CX bike can do those all, but any CX bike will be better for one than another. For instance, carbon seat stays will be really nice for road riding, but they're a minus for commuting (not a deal breaker, but a minus).

    It seems like you've got a good handle on this. Just trust yourself, and buy the bike that gives you the best ride. (Notice the importance of the test ride! There was nothing wrong with the Jamis that you could find on a spec sheet, but since you didn't like the feel of it you're right to keep looking.)

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