TTON

Are there any cyclecross bikes that allow you to put tires that would be in the monstercross range? I was thinking of getting a MTB and adding drops to it but after reading a few posts on this it sounds like the geometry of most MTBs would prohibit riding comfortably on drops without having a long torso. I then stumbled upon the monstercross category of bikes but it appears most of these bikes are 29ers. Can anyone please guide to some entry level CX bikes that allow you to put wider tires on it?? Thanks.

J e e p s

Singular Peregrine

Spld cyclist

Try to the Gravity Zilla Monster Cross here: https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/cross_bikes.htm

There was a recent thread on this one....

pyze-guy

Depends what you define monstercross as. Some feel anything over 35mm tires make it montercx, others say 45mm+.

Off hand, the origin8 cx700 takes 2.1 29er tire. My planet x fits a 42 in the back, upto a 2.3 29er infront (ritchey wsc carbon fork). Crosscheck takes 45mm i believe.

For tons of bike/pics search monstercross on mtbr.

fietsbob

a 29er, with a drop bar conversion.. pretty much.. , right?

actual sanctioned Cross races have max tire width, those won't pass.

I you dont have to jump off the bike, and leap barriers every lap, it aint cyclocross.



and if you don't have to carry the bike up a hill, running,

then it doesn't even have to be that light.

... back to the 'I got this', pictures..

BluesDawg

Black Mountain Cycles Monster Cross. I ran Vee Rubber V12s with plenty of room. 1.95" nominal, but measured 48mm mounted on Velocity A23 rims.


Vee Rubber 12 - 1.95 by BluesDawg, on Flickr


bartram fr qtr by BluesDawg, on Flickr

flargle

UCI is the only sanctioning body, that I am aware of, that enforces a maximum tire width rule.

Barrettscv 

Most standard Cyclocross bikes will fit a 700x35 or 700x38, but no more. Any drop-bar bike that can take a 700x40 with plenty of room is a candidate as a Monstercross build.

Several drop-bar bikes will take a 700x40 to 700x45, a few will take 700x50 to 700x55+

The Salsa Fargo is sold with a 700x55 Conti Race King: https://www.salsacycles.com/bikes/fargo/

The Origin 8 CX700 can take a 700x52, I'm using a 700x50 with fenders: https://www.origin-8.com/?page_id=91&...26+ACCESSORIES

The Vassago Fisticuffs can take a 700x45: https://www.vassagocycles.com/fisticuff/

The Salsa Vaya is sold with a 700x35 Clement USH, but can fit 700x43: https://salsacycles.com/bikes/vaya

The Surly Cross Check can fit 700x40 or larger: https://surlybikes.com/bikes/cross_check

stevage

I believe the Specialized Tricross takes up to a 45mm tyre. I run 35mm and there's a looot of clearance.

Speaking of which: what 45mm tyre would people recommend for my Specialized Tricross? Mostly for bikepacking, on terrain including large loose stones and sandy, loose gravel roads. (Which the 35mm are struggling on...)

Barrettscv 

Here are some tires in the 40 to 45 size range worth considering;

700x43 Bruce Gordon Rock-n-Road: https://www.bgcycles.com/rock-n-road-tire.html

700x40 Clement X'PLOR MSO: https://clementcycling.com/xplor-mso

700x40 Kendra Happy Medium: https://www.kendausa.com/en/home/bicy...py-medium.aspx

700x40 or 28x1.75 Schwalbe Marathon Mondial: https://www.schwalbetires.com/bike_ti...rathon_mondial

Bekologist

I bought the Origin8 CX700 monstercross frame because it's a bargain monstercross frame designed more along the lines of traditional CX geometry, rather than 29er style, and with rim brake capability.

I would have liked the previous model run of this bike with the more elegant fork, but am very happy on first build and brief around town test rides on it this winter (trails a little bit snowed under right now).



I've used a surly crosscheck and long haul trucker bikes for quite a bit of rough riding on 35c tires, but have never tried stuffing the max tire size under the ganks. i always felt the frames would be too limiting in max tire size and clearances. Here's a cross bike on yesterday's ride, the first road ride of the year, but i don't consider the Surly CrossCheck platform in the 'monstercross' category.

Maybe I'm wrong about this, but I'd call 700x52 (29x2.0) the break. An awful lot of 'monstercross' build photos i see show excessively tight tire clearances.

Hoping the manufacturers step up the clearance.

DVC45

That.

bgcycles 

We make bikes too! Have been making "Gravel Grinders" for 25 years - https://brucegordoncycles.blogspot.com/
Regards,
Bruce Gordon

Erik_A

I would look for a used 2007 or 2008 LeMond Poprad Disc:

https://www.bikeradar.com/gallery/art...eview-12823/6/
https://www.commutebybike.com/2007/05...d-poprad-disc/
https://www.commutebybike.com/2007/07...d-poprad-disc/
https://www.roadbikereview.com/cat/la...9_5670crx.aspx

The frame is made of True Temper OX Platinum steel ( https://www.henryjames.com/oxplat.html ). and way nicer triple butting than any 4130 "monstercross" bike that I have seen; however 40c are the largest size tires that will fit in the rear. I don't see that as a problem though; I do single track on it very effectively.

Bekologist

some of us would say its' not monstercross, just a cross bike. monstercross builds should be a bit more than just stuffing the biggest tires that can fit into a normal configured cross bike. otherwise, everyone's already riding a monstercross bike, just without large enough tires.

Barrettscv 

There is no uniform definition of Monstercross.

Monstercross is more than fat tires. The goal is to be able to ride the kind of terrain that a rigid mountain bike would ride. That implies larger tires at low pressure. How large a tire and how low the pressure depends on how much weight is on the bike and rider preference.

For most conditions, a 700x40 tire like the Clement X'plor MSO will out-perform a larger tire on a mixture of gravel roads and trails that a Monstercross bike will travel.

If a cyclocross bike has a tire smaller than 700x40, this is clearly a regular Cyclocross bike. I find the 700x40 tire size or larger as a useful definition.

Bekologist

I guess the defining question is, barretscv, is 'what is monstercross?'


if it's simply a tire any cross bike will fit, it's perhaps more a state of mind than a frame dimension. just stuff some bigger tires on your crosscheck and shazam! it's now monstercross?

maybe monstercross should be defined as greater than UCI-legal - that way even a surly Pacer can become monstercross.

i think the difference is in greater than the tire but of a frame dimension that sets a bike apart and in a different class that a typical cyclecross bike.

For the definition of a new category of bike that is separate from cyclocross dimensions, a monstercross bike is a bike that readily accepts a large variety of 29er tires.

Monstercross = a cross between 29er tires and cyclocross style.

Otherwise, any old cross bike is monstercross, and that's not a distinct difference, just putting a big tire on a cross bike.

I do like Bruce Gordons' tires though, and the bikes, those should be enough of a gravel grinder for just about anyone. i'm trying monstercross to deal with excessively sandy & loose conditions that stretch for tens to hundreds of miles from where i live.

But i still think monstercross is defined as a frame that readily takes a 29'er dimension tire, not simply a large diameter tire stuffed into a cross frame.

Barrettscv 

You have a tendency for ignoring clearly stated meaning and incorrectly paraphrasing, those rhetorical gimmicks make an intelligent discussion of semantics impossible.

The 40mm width is useful since this size exceeds the size capacity of almost all conventional cyclocross bikes. Most Cyclocross bikes have a chain-stay length of 425mm, a few have 430mm chainstays. This alone limits the tire size to 700x38 if the bike has vertical drop-outs. A bike with horizontal drop-outs has a variable chain-stay length and can fit larger tires.

Several excellent Monstercross frame builders target the 700x47 tire size and don't try to fit larger tires. A framebuilder can build a frame that will accept a cyclocross crankset if the tire is less than 700x50 by using a chain-stay that is longer than 425mm. Once you try to fit a 700x50, a MTB crankset is required for the crankarm to clear the chainstay and for the chain to clear the tire.

Most Monstercross bikes will not use a 700x50 or larger tire. It won't make the bike more useful. If you need a 700x50 tire or larger to float in soft soil or sand, you need to reduce the weight of rider on the front wheel. A flat bar mountain bike is the best tool for those conditions.

Bekologist

Oh, it's a fine line, but this is all quite new, Barrett. Not a lot of firm rules in this new category of bicycle.

Since it's so new and undefined especially by the industry, i'd think it premature to simply accept a defintion that building up a cross bike with a fat tire turns it into a monstercross frame.

Simply because a surly cross check will fit a bruce gordon rock and road tire doesn't make it a monstercross frame. ( do think the bruce gordon rock and road looks like a fantastic bike, and his tires as well.)


do you see the distinction i'm hinting at? A monstercross frame has to have some defining difference from what a Surly CrossCheck - the industry standard cross frame - can be built as. And i'd say that defining difference is in accepting a 29er dimension tire.

The salsa fargo is a monstercross bike. the black mountain cyclery cross is monster cross. the origin 8 700cx is monstercross. A crosscheck isn't monstercross.

This is certainly open to debate, but the definition 'it takes a 29er tire' most accurately depicts what is a 'monstercross' frameset.

Barrettscv 

Is it a fine line, or a distinction without a difference?

If someone wants to put a 700x42 tire on a Cross Check and use it off-road like a mountain bike, he can call it a Monstercross bike and I won't lose any sleep.

What about a Salsa Vaya with the same 700x42 tire, Is that a Monstercross bike or a Cyclocross bike?

What if someone installs a 700x40 tire, like the Clement X'PLOR MSO on a Salsa fargo? If I was touring on a mixture of pavement and gravel, a 700x40 tire would perform better than a 700x55.

Bekologist

if your bike won't accept a 29er tire, i'd say that's a distinct difference, Barretscv!

i'm not losing any sleep, but that still won't make the cross check a monstercross dimensioned frameset.


you'd be a: riding a disc brake touring bike with a modestly fat tire and extremely marginal tire clearance; and

b: riding a monstercross frameset with modestly sized tires.

Barrettscv 

Vague answers lacking logical definitions.

A 29inch tire would be larger that a 700x52. By this definition, only a Salsa Fargo meets your definition as a Monstercross bike, Bekologist!

Bekologist

This one goes bigger. so does the origin8 700cx.

QUOTE=BluesDawg;15367612]Black Mountain Cycles Monster Cross


Vee Rubber 12 - 1.95 by BluesDawg, on Flickr

[/QUOTE]

I'm not sure the bicycle industry will settle on a definition that any old cross bike is actually a monstercross frame. Maybe we should accept barretscv's definition that a cross or touring bike at the very edge of its tire clearance is actually a monstercross frameset.

Barrettscv 

BTW, a Origin 8 CX700 will not fit a 700x53 or larger tire, the Black Mountain Monstercross tops-out at 700x50. Neither of these bikes meet your definition as a Monstercross bike. You not only can't understand a clearly stated definition provided by others, you can't use your own statements with any consistency.

Bekologist

plenty of 29x1.9 and 29x20.0 tires out there.

the reality is there are very few monstercross frames out there, even fewer ones without suspension corrected geometry. Man, the VanDessel WTF was about the swankiest monstercross frame i've seen. Wish the Gary Fisher Sawyer stuck around for more than one year. jeesh. and it was a total winner too.


i'm not sure how it is the cx700 in my garage has 2.1's on it, and that black mountain bike looks like it'll take another few mms under the ganks.

this is all perhaps too nuanced for you, but it's a clear distinction that needs to be made.

A cross frame - of which a surly cross check defines the category -pushed to the very edge of its tire clearance, isn't a monster cross frame.