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  1. #1
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    About Rear Derailleur - Casette compatibility...

    Hi everyone, i just got the tip about this site from a friend and i bought a cyclocross bike earlier this week and i have lots of questions troubling my mind, so i wanted to ask you guys to figure a way out.
    Allright so, i bought a Scott Cx Comp 2011, which has a shimano 105 rear derailleur, Shimano CS-HG 50-9 / 12-25 casette,Shimano CN-HG 53 chain,shimano 4500 tiagra shifters,and 36-46 fsa gossamer chainset, 2x9 system.
    And since the cassette is 12-25, i m having a hard time riding through roads that has high shape percentages,so i want to get an at least 11-32 or 11-34 cassette.
    But since the 105 derailleur i got only supports till 28, i need to change them both.
    And i want to know which derailleur's are compatible with the equipment i got on my bike. Are Deore XT cassette and Deore Xt derailleur compatible with it ?
    And the bike shop i got my bike from said that if i buy a shimano 105 with a longer leg it is compatible with 11-32,and any cassette that is compatible with 9v and is in the range of 11-32 would be compatible. Is it true ?
    If both things i said is wrong, what should i do to get a cassette that is at least 11-32 to run on my bike without any problems , what upgrades do i need ?
    I appreciate every person that will try to help from now , thanks.

  2. #2
    Bicycle Repair Man !!! Sixty Fiver's Avatar
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    As far as I know, the long cage 105 has a 28 tooth maximum but I am using older specs... although it looks like it should handle a 32 the geometry of the long cage Shimano road derailleurs differs from an mtb derailleur and the guide pulley sits higher which limits it's maximum cog. This because it was designed to handle an 11-27 with a road triple which does not have the same chain wrap requirements of a mountain bike or touring bike and improves it's performance.

    Any 9 speed Shimano mtb derailleur will work... the new 10 speed stuff has a different actuation ratio so will not play well with others.

    We have used the Ultegra long cage with 11-32 cassettes with no issue but part of that is because it was used on a custom frame with a longer hangar which will expand the range of a long cage derailleur.

    The numbers to consider are the maximum cog size, chain wrap limit, and the hangar length on the bike when you are selecting a derailleur, they come with all this tech info when you buy them.

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    So long story short, i can use any mtb derailleurs that is compatible with 9 speed ? thats great. Thanks.

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    Bicycle Repair Man !!! Sixty Fiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozan Guner View Post
    So long story short, i can use any mtb derailleurs that is compatible with 9 speed ? thats great. Thanks.
    Yep.

    Just make sure it says Shimano... only because SRAM components don't play with Shimano indexed components.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver View Post
    Yep.

    Just make sure it says Shimano... only because SRAM components don't play with Shimano indexed components.
    Allright, thanks a lot

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    The 'speeds' are the Lever and the Cassette cog count.. the RD only responds to the command from the lever.

    as if to respond, " yes, Sir!, how high shall I jump? "..

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    Quote Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
    The 'speeds' are the Lever and the Cassette cog count.. the RD only responds to the command from the lever.

    as if to respond, " yes, Sir!, how high shall I jump? "..
    So does it mean shifters are irrelevant, only thing that matters is rd and cassette to be compatible with each other?

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    Bicycle Repair Man !!! Sixty Fiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozan Guner View Post
    So does it mean shifters are irrelevant, only thing that matters is rd and cassette to be compatible with each other?
    The shifter is most relevant as it tells the derailleur how far to move.

    The rd has to be able to handle the cog range and chain wrap for a specific drive set up and the cassette and shifter need to match up in regard to speeds.

    You can usually swap derailleurs without issue... with SRAM and Shimano they have different geometry and spring rates that are optimized to work best with their matching shifters... the new 10 speed Shimano XT has a shifter with a different actuation rate than all other Shimano mtb parts.

    Your solution is pretty simple... almost any long cage Shimano mtb derailleur will solve your issues and let you use a wider cassette, you will of course need to run a new chain that will be longer to handle the increased capacity and mate up nicely with the new cassette.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver View Post
    The shifter is most relevant as it tells the derailleur how far to move.

    The rd has to be able to handle the cog range and chain wrap for a specific drive set up and the cassette and shifter need to match up in regard to speeds.

    You can usually swap derailleurs without issue... with SRAM and Shimano they have different geometry and spring rates that are optimized to work best with their matching shifters... the new 10 speed Shimano XT has a shifter with a different actuation rate than all other Shimano mtb parts.

    Your solution is pretty simple... almost any long cage Shimano mtb derailleur will solve your issues and let you use a wider cassette, you will of course need to run a new chain that will be longer to handle the increased capacity and mate up nicely with the new cassette.
    My chain is Shimano CN HG53 which is compatible with deore derailleurs, why should i change it ? it is both compatible with the system i use and deore too. I'm thinking of getting a Shimano LX derailleur which has a 11-34 range, and get a sram pg 950 11-34 cassette.

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    Bicycle Repair Man !!! Sixty Fiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozan Guner View Post
    My chain is Shimano CN HG53 which is compatible with deore derailleurs, why should i change it ? it is both compatible with the system i use and deore too. I'm thinking of getting a Shimano LX derailleur which has a 11-34 range, and get a sram pg 950 11-34 cassette.
    When you change the cassette to the 11-34 you will need a longer chain to handle the larger cogs... the existing chain will be too short if it has been measured correctly for your current drive set up.

    Measuring a new chain:

    Wrap the chain around the largest chainring and the largest cog in the rear without running the chain through the rear derailleur, bring the ends of the chain together and from this point increase this by a pair of links to give you enough chain to handle the big / big combination.

    The LX will handle the new drivetrain well and you cannot go wrong with the SRAM PG950 cassette.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver View Post
    When you change the cassette to the 11-34 you will need a longer chain to handle the larger cogs... the existing chain will be too short if it has been measured correctly for your current drive set up.

    Measuring a new chain:

    Wrap the chain around the largest chainring and the largest cog in the rear without running the chain through the rear derailleur, bring the ends of the chain together and from this point increase this by a pair of links to give you enough chain to handle the big / big combination.

    The LX will handle the new drivetrain well and you cannot go wrong with the SRAM PG950 cassette.
    I'll try this chain first and if it doesnt work, i'll order LX chain which should be compatible with LX derallieur since they both carry the same name.You think the component i choosed is good ? Any other suggestions around the same price area?

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    Bicycle Repair Man !!! Sixty Fiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozan Guner View Post
    I'll try this chain first and if it doesnt work, i'll order LX chain which should be compatible with LX derallieur since they both carry the same name.You think the component i choosed is good ? Any other suggestions around the same price area?
    Component choice is great... the chain that fit the 11-25 simply will not work with the 11-34.

    I prefer KMC and SRAM chain over Shimano as they come with a re-useable quick link and not the annoying single pin that Shimano uses.

  13. #13
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    Nothing wrong with Shimano chains, and no reason why you can't just fit a SRAM or KMC missing link, as you normally have to shorten a chain to fit a bike.

  14. #14
    Bicycle Repair Man !!! Sixty Fiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimc101 View Post
    Nothing wrong with Shimano chains, and no reason why you can't just fit a SRAM or KMC missing link, as you normally have to shorten a chain to fit a bike.
    Shimano chains are fine... save for the need to pick up that extra missing link to make them work just like SRAM and KMC chain and that adds a few dollars to the cost.



    KMC has been my preferred chain for a long time, the price is very reasonable (and even more so when you get it at cost), it runs smoothly and has a good working life.

    SRAM chain was originally made by Sedis (which SRAM acquired) and Sedis are the folks who invented modern bushingless chain... it is great.

    In the end it is all good... I can say I have never broken a KMC chain, had one SRAM chain come apart back when they were having some issues with their missing links, and have only avoided Shimano chain because their connection system ticks me off. Many years ago I found that I was killing Shimano chains (they have improved greatly) and switched to SRAM for higher performance applications (like the 9 speed on my mtb) and use KMC for general purpose applications.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver View Post
    Component choice is great... the chain that fit the 11-25 simply will not work with the 11-34.

    I prefer KMC and SRAM chain over Shimano as they come with a re-useable quick link and not the annoying single pin that Shimano uses.
    Sram Chain Pc-951 9S

    How about this one, is it long enough for the components i bought?
    Last edited by Ozan Guner; 04-07-13 at 02:10 PM.

  16. #16
    Bicycle Repair Man !!! Sixty Fiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozan Guner View Post
    Sram Chain Pc-951 9V

    How about this one, is it long enough for the components i bought?

    Yes... but it will need to be measured and shortened as all multi-speed chains come with more links than they need and if you installed it straight out of the box it would probably be too long.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver View Post
    Yes... but it will need to be measured and shortened as all multi-speed chains come with more links than they need and if you installed it straight out of the box it would probably be too long.
    I'll take it to a bike shop and get those installed there,since i know nothing about maintenance or installing anything though i want to know-learn everything i can and want to take care of my bike by myself.
    Thanks for all your help i appreciate it.

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