Advertise on Bikeforums.net



User Tag List

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 26 to 48 of 48
  1. #26
    tcs
    tcs is offline
    Palmer tcs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Parts unknown
    Posts
    4,146
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by JanMM View Post
    A motorized trike is a wheelchair?
    Of course not.
    "When man first set woman on two wheels with a pair of pedals, did he know, I wonder, that he had rent the veil of the harem in twain? A woman on a bicycle has all the world before her where to choose; she can go where she will, no man hindering." The Typewriter Girl, 1899.

    "Every so often a bird gets up and flies some place it's drawn to. I don't suppose it could tell you why, but it does it anyway." Ian Hibell, 1934-2008

  2. #27
    Roadmaster Snobbery Club bhtooefr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Newark, Ohio
    My Bikes
    2002 Dahon Boardwalk 1, 2011 TerraTrike Path 8
    Posts
    754
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Most jurisdictions define a bicycle as a human powered vehicle with 2 or 3 wheels.

    However, there are sometimes some loopholes. Sometimes there's a wheel size requirement - usually larger than 16" - to qualify as a vehicle (so that children can ride their bicycle on a sidewalk, but hey, Greenspeed does 16" all around trikes).

    That said, it's certainly not a good idea to ride a trike on the sidewalk if bicycles can't safely ride there as well.
    2011 TerraTrike Path 8
    2002 Dahon Boardwalk 1 (with 1976 F&S R 2110 2-speed kickback hub)

  3. #28
    Senior Member 009jim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Australia
    My Bikes
    Giant CRX3, Trek 7100
    Posts
    1,287
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by PaPa View Post
    For about $10 at your local secondhand, few would question the 'legalities'....



    It's even more convincing when you have electric assist
    That is exactly what I can see myself on! What an awesome rig.

  4. #29
    Senior Member 009jim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Australia
    My Bikes
    Giant CRX3, Trek 7100
    Posts
    1,287
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by bhtooefr View Post
    Most jurisdictions define a bicycle as a human powered vehicle with 2 or 3 wheels.

    However, there are sometimes some loopholes. Sometimes there's a wheel size requirement - usually larger than 16" - to qualify as a vehicle (so that children can ride their bicycle on a sidewalk, but hey, Greenspeed does 16" all around trikes).

    That said, it's certainly not a good idea to ride a trike on the sidewalk if bicycles can't safely ride there as well.
    Can you please state your reasoning to support this? If a wheelchair is OK, why then is a trike not OK?

  5. #30
    Senior Member PaPa's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    496
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by JanMM View Post
    A motorized trike is a wheelchair?
    Depends on the State's definition(s), and how it's applied (speed being the main criteria) For example...

    Idaho Statutes 49-114 (15) "Motorized wheelchair" means a motor vehicle with a speed not in excess of eight (8) miles per hour, designed for and used by a person with a disability.

    I built this for my father in Idaho 5 years ago - he's never been challenged or accosted anywhere, whether on sidewalks or inside businesses.


  6. #31
    The Recumbent Quant cplager's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Norwalk, CT
    My Bikes
    2012 Cruzbike Sofrider, 2013 Cruzigami Mantis
    Posts
    2,811
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by 009jim View Post
    Can you please state your reasoning to support this? If a wheelchair is OK, why then is a trike not OK?
    These devices are designed with different uses in mind. I can see somebody using a trike as one would use a wheelchair, but that would be the exception. Different states and municipalities have different rules and regulations and see no reason to expect that all should treat a trike like a wheel chair.
    http://Charles.Plager.net
    http://RecumbentQuant.blogspot.com

  7. #32
    rebmeM roineS JanMM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Indiana
    My Bikes
    RANS V3, RANS V-Rex, RANS Screamer
    Posts
    11,565
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by PaPa View Post
    Depends on the State's definition(s), and how it's applied (speed being the main criteria) For example...

    Idaho Statutes 49-114 (15) "Motorized wheelchair" means a motor vehicle with a speed not in excess of eight (8) miles per hour, designed for and used by a person with a disability.

    I built this for my father in Idaho 5 years ago - he's never been challenged or accosted anywhere, whether on sidewalks or inside businesses.
    Unlike the previous trike you posted, (which appears not to have been designed for a person with disabilities), this is not pedal driven ---> Neither a (pedal powered) bike nor trike. And not a wheelchair, even tho it may sorta meet local definition of motorized wheelchair. Glad your father hasn't been accosted.
    Last edited by JanMM; 02-16-14 at 08:20 PM.
    RANS V3 (steel), RANS V-Rex, RANS Screamer

  8. #33
    Senior Member PaPa's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    496
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by JanMM View Post
    Unlike the previous trike you posted, (which appears not to have been designed for a person with disabilities), this is not pedal driven ---> Neither a (pedal powered) bike nor trike. And not a wheelchair, even tho it may sorta meet local definition of motorized wheelchair. Glad your father hasn't been accosted.
    The absents or presents of pedals, nor your restricted, visual interpretation of a 'wheel chair', automatically excludes it from the State's definition of "wheel chair" (which I previously quoted). If the rider is legally disabled, and rides it 8 mph or less, then it clearly abides by the State law.

  9. #34
    rebmeM roineS JanMM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Indiana
    My Bikes
    RANS V3, RANS V-Rex, RANS Screamer
    Posts
    11,565
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    My restricted mind can see that this thread, which started out in an ill-defined area, is getting farther and farther away from bicycling.........................
    RANS V3 (steel), RANS V-Rex, RANS Screamer

  10. #35
    Roadmaster Snobbery Club bhtooefr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Newark, Ohio
    My Bikes
    2002 Dahon Boardwalk 1, 2011 TerraTrike Path 8
    Posts
    754
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by 009jim View Post
    Can you please state your reasoning to support this? If a wheelchair is OK, why then is a trike not OK?
    Higher speed capability (although you don't actually have to use it)
    Width (IIRC trikes are usually a bit wider than the average wheelchair)
    Length (trikes are much longer)
    Manueverability (this ties into the length, but also how a wheelchair's propulsion and steering work - a wheelchair can manuever in much tighter spaces than any recumbent trike can)
    Crash safety for pedestrians (this is mainly a problem with tadpoles, not deltas, but with a tadpole, it's a good way for pedestrians to get a leg full of chainring)
    2011 TerraTrike Path 8
    2002 Dahon Boardwalk 1 (with 1976 F&S R 2110 2-speed kickback hub)

  11. #36
    Senior Member Retro Grouch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    St Peters, Missouri
    My Bikes
    Rans Enduro Sport, Hase Kettweisel Tandem, Merin Bear Valley beater bike
    Posts
    23,786
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    A fairly busy road near my condo has, what look to me, like identical sidewalks on each side. Legally I read some place that one is a sidewalk, the other a trail. I assume that means I'm supposed to only ride my bike (or trike) on the trail but I don't know which one that is.

    In actual practice, nobody cares because there are few pedestrians using either one. When I ride my bike up to the convenience store on the corner, my normal practice is to ride on the sidewalk (or trail) going up to the store and ride in the street coming home. That way I don't have to cross the road like I would if I were to ride in the street going both ways.
    My greatest fear is all of my kids standing around my coffin and talking about "how sensible" dad was.

  12. #37
    Senior Member BlazingPedals's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Middle of da Mitten
    My Bikes
    Trek 7500, RANS V-Rex, Optima Baron, Velokraft NoCom, M-5 Carbon Highracer, homebuilt recumbent
    Posts
    7,116
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by PaPa View Post
    The absents or presents of pedals, nor your restricted, visual interpretation of a 'wheel chair', automatically excludes it from the State's definition of "wheel chair" (which I previously quoted). If the rider is legally disabled, and rides it 8 mph or less, then it clearly abides by the State law.
    Arguing here is pointless. The true test will be if you take it into a department store or a grocery store, and you brush your chain up against another customer's clothing.

  13. #38
    Senior Member Retro Grouch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    St Peters, Missouri
    My Bikes
    Rans Enduro Sport, Hase Kettweisel Tandem, Merin Bear Valley beater bike
    Posts
    23,786
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by BlazingPedals View Post
    Arguing here is pointless. The true test will be if you take it into a department store or a grocery store, and you brush your chain up against another customer's clothing.
    That's what I think too. I'd be careful about riding a trike with the chainring sticking out front if you live in a "Stand your ground state."
    My greatest fear is all of my kids standing around my coffin and talking about "how sensible" dad was.

  14. #39
    Senior Member PaPa's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    496
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by BlazingPedals View Post
    The true test will be if you take it into a department store or a grocery store, and you brush your chain up against another customer's clothing.
    An issue you 'tadpole' owners need to consider... not me.. and my 'safely-tucked-away' chainrings on my delta's.:

  15. #40
    The Site Administrator: Currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes,please contact my assistnt admins for forum issues Tom Stormcrowe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    South Florida
    My Bikes
    Techna Wheelchair and a Sun EZ 3 Recumbent Trike
    Posts
    16,014
    Mentioned
    10 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by 009jim View Post
    Riding home from work Friday I found myself pondering the definition of a wheel-chair vs the definition of a recumbent three-wheeler. As I'm getting on a bit and thinking about transportation in my later years, I wondered if a recumbent bike would/could be classed as a wheel-chair and therefore you are allowed to ride it on the sidewalk and inside the galleria for example.

    As I see it this would have many advantages. Whilst I might be able to walk ok in my 60s or 70s, I might not be able to walk the huge distances one has to cover just gaining entry to the mall and getting to the appropriate shops. A wheel-chair could likewise be prohibitive as the arms would be too weary. However, the recumbent 3 wheel bike sounds perfect.

    Anyone got idea on the legalities?

    A doctors statement that it is assistive technology compensating for a reduced ability to walk would make it compliant under the ADA. You would likely have to put something on it identifying it as assistive, though, for the "unwashed".
    on light duty due to illness; please contact my assistants for forum issues. They are Siu Blue Wind, or CbadRider or the other 3 star folk. I am currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes. I am making good progress, happily.


    . “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche

    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant

  16. #41
    tcs
    tcs is offline
    Palmer tcs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Parts unknown
    Posts
    4,146
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Stormcrowe View Post
    A doctors statement that it is assistive technology compensating for a reduced ability to walk would make it compliant under the ADA.
    I linked the ADA definition of 'wheelchair' in post 22. A recumbent trike arguably fails the definition because it may or may not be 'manually powered', depending on the legal definition of 'manual' ('muscle' or 'by hand'). A recumbent trike would definitely fail ADA's definition of wheelchair because it is not 'designed primarily for use by an individual with a mobility disability'.

    Again, the issue wouldn't be the man hassling you. It would be rolling down the concourse on your recumbent trike and hitting a five year old, knocking her to the ground and breaking her arm. Hope you've got a good umbrella policy!


    PS - And once again, the ADA does not apply to the OP in Australia.
    Last edited by tcs; 02-26-14 at 01:54 PM.
    "When man first set woman on two wheels with a pair of pedals, did he know, I wonder, that he had rent the veil of the harem in twain? A woman on a bicycle has all the world before her where to choose; she can go where she will, no man hindering." The Typewriter Girl, 1899.

    "Every so often a bird gets up and flies some place it's drawn to. I don't suppose it could tell you why, but it does it anyway." Ian Hibell, 1934-2008

  17. #42
    Senior Member 009jim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Australia
    My Bikes
    Giant CRX3, Trek 7100
    Posts
    1,287
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by JanMM View Post
    My restricted mind can see that this thread, which started out in an ill-defined area, is getting farther and farther away from bicycling.........................
    I think this is my fault in part. I am the O.P. but I've now come to the realisation that a trike is not necessarily a recumbent. Recumbents tend to be quite a long structure. They have to be, because you are "recumbent". A lot of the replies have come from folks who don't like the idea of such a long piece of kit being in the galleria obstructing things. However, a trike can be quite short. In actual fact a trike can be shorter than a normal bicycle, because the cranks can be between the back wheels. A trike might be longer than a basic wheel-chair, but will not be longer than the new electric wheel-chairs with baskets and so forth on them.

    Undoubtedly the laws in various places can be so nebulous that police or business owners can object on some grounds. That's why laws to protect people in wheel-chairs were necessary.

    I saw the same chap referred to in my O.P. on friday evening. This time he was a lot further from the mall and obviously making his way home. He has a granny gear on his trike and potters along obviously enjoying himself. He looked healthy too. Just after that I saw a lady on a motorised scooter and she did not look happy or healthy.

  18. #43
    Senior Member 009jim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Australia
    My Bikes
    Giant CRX3, Trek 7100
    Posts
    1,287
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Retro Grouch View Post
    That's what I think too. I'd be careful about riding a trike with the chainring sticking out front if you live in a "Stand your ground state."
    LOL........I can just imagine the news headlines!!

  19. #44
    ♋ ☮♂ ☭ ☯ -=(8)=-'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    40205 'ViLLeBiLLie
    My Bikes
    Sngl Spd's, 70's- 80's vintage, D-tube Folder
    Posts
    7,787
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    When I lived in the Stand your Ground state, there were these gorgeous, w - i - d - e mup type sidewalks that went on for miles because no one walks in FL.
    There are parts that would be a trike riders dream.

  20. #45
    benter
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Los Gatos, CA
    My Bikes
    Bacchetta Giro 20
    Posts
    56
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    In the ADA definition, "manually" doesn't refer to hands/arms, but is used in contrast with powered.

    A mobility disability doesn't mean the legs can't move. A balance problem (e.g. Sheldon Brown w/ multiple sclerosis) can prevent walking while still allowing a person to pedal a trike.

    Some tadpole trike manufacturers (e.g. ICE) make chain ring guards.

  21. #46
    Senior Member rydabent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Lincoln Ne
    My Bikes
    RANS Stratus TerraTrike Cruiser
    Posts
    3,836
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    pa pa

    Great point. What cop wants to be seen in public giving a "handicapped" person grief?? Especially one with a crutch on his "wheelchair".

    Another question comes to mind. Is there any specific law that states what the spec of a wheelchair is?

    If ticketed, I still think my idea of showing up in court with a walker is a great idea!!! Just tell the judge you have a balance problem, and the trike is much faster than your walker.

  22. #47
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Hampton, IA
    My Bikes
    Since I went to the darkside with my ActionBent Roadrunner, I sold off my other two bikes because I never ride them anymore.
    Posts
    82
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Just remember that you may have to swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
    No bike does everything perfectly. In fact, no bike does anything until SOMEONE gets on it and rides.

  23. #48
    Senior Member rydabent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Lincoln Ne
    My Bikes
    RANS Stratus TerraTrike Cruiser
    Posts
    3,836
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    These days it is truth as you see it.

    Besides in a public area, what is the difference between a wheel chair, and a trike ridden around slowly?

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •