Jinx5000

Let's say I go with the small (as it had a better feel to the ride and climbing compared to the medium which fell sluggish) if I needed too, couldn't I just get a 7-10 degrees stem and flip it up to achieve the same bar height as my current setup? I'd eventually be in a position to flip it down and still be comfortable, correct?

Jinx5000

That's part of my train of thought too. Would would I need to "make it work" in your opinion? Possibly a longer stem and possibly with a greater angle? Possibly flipping the stem up to be more upright until I can lower it as my fitness improves?

lechat

Don't worry about stack and reach, those can be adjusted. The main consideration is the relationship between the saddle and pedals. If you have a 0 setback post and the saddle is all the way forward, but your weight still isn't positioned on your sitbones, you'll never be comfortable. I'd opt for the smaller frame.

macca33

The small is probably closer to your Orbea, but as you point out, you'll need a few headset spacers to get your stack up to where it now is. Being REALISTIC, can you improve your flexibility, or is there an underlying issue with flexibility or a back injury? If there is, I reckon the small may not be for you. If not and you can improve your flexibility, the small frame should work.

cheers

Jinx5000

I am a very active and athletic individual and consider myself to be fairly flexible. I can wrap my hands around my toes while standing and can almost get both palms on the floor keeping my knees straight. So there is nothing medically or injury related keeping me from a more aggressive position.

I feel my perceived lack of flexibility comes with how long Ive been riding (Under 1 year) and the frequency in which I ride (Average 1x a week). I am looking to get more involved in my community with cycling, group rides, and with friends which will give me more time on the bike which I fell will get me more used to the position while on the bike abad improve my cycling flexibility.

So in that sense, I feel I can fit on the small frame and get to the point where I am comfortable in the aero position but I just may need to give my body some time to get used to it and cycle more. Does that make sense? And is that a thing - getting more comfortable with a position on the bike the more you ride assuming it may feel uncomfortable at the start but slowly work my way into a lower position by flipping the stem/ removing spacers?

Jinx5000

Can you expand upon this a little bit? If I go in for a fit at my LBS on the small frame, what should I be looking for interns of saddle position, knee position, arm position...?

Thanks!

chaadster

Stems offer a wide range of adjustment through angle and extension, can be flipped or replaced quickly and easily, and are inexpensive. You can even get an articulated adjustable stem to play with angle until you figure out what works, at which point you can move to a more stylish fixed stem of the desired angle.

Because of the variety and ease of stem adjustments, as Lechat said, stack and reach should be the last thing you worry about in frame sizing. People have a lot of preoccupation with spacers and angle, but it is all purely based on aesthetics. In practical terms, there is no reason not to use the stem to get the fit you want.

Handlebars also offer adjustents to reach and drop, and though they are mor expensive to replace, the right bars are amazing tools in "getting it right."

Big picture, I'm also in the "smaller over larger" camp for performance riding; I don't believe there are any advantages derived from being on a larger frame, but that there are for smaller frames, from handling to weight savings, to fit options, to comfort (via seatpost extension). FOR PERFORMANCE RIDING. If you're not an aggressive, performance-minded cyclist, you can ride anything you can throw leg over. For general rec riding, frame size hardly matters.

Jinx5000

Thanks for explaining that and going a bit further.

At this point I feel I'd be happier with the Small with a few adjustments. I'll make one more trip to the LBS, get a proper fit, and take it out for one more spin before making my final decision!

ColaJacket

Just out of curiosity. What is wrong with the Orca, that you feel you need a new bike?

This may also help people decide whether you need the smaller or larger size.

GH

ColaJacket

Then with climbing and wanting a less sluggish bike, I'd say go for the smaller bike. It may be a little lighter, and, from what you said earlier, it's more responsive.

GH

Jinx5000

Thanks for the input. I think that's what I'll do.

I'm going in to the LBS tomorrow to get a proper fit on the small and take it out one last time before I make the final decision. And who knows, I may not need a longer stem since my Orca has a 90mm on it now and the BH comes with a 100mm.

lechat

The only way to be sure is to ride the bike. Maybe both sizes. You'll know if you weight is balanced on your ass and not your groin.

BoSoxYacht

after reading this post, it sounds like you really don't have any idea what you are talking about.

Good luck.

Jinx5000

Hahahaha thanks,

As I've mentioned several times I'm not the most knowledgeable when it comes to cycling, hence me coming to a forum seeking the input and opinions of those with hopefully more knowledge and experience than myself.

I tend to overanalyze everything and focus on things that probably don't really matter. The biggest thing Im taking away is that I need to ride the bike and make my decision then. Which is what I'm going to do tomorrow.

Jinx5000

Do you mind me asking which BH and which Orbea, and what type of riding you prefer one over the other?

Long Tom

Well played.

Let your over-analyzer do it's thing but in the end, trust a different organ: your heart. If it feels good, it is good.

link0

Always go with smaller.

cwar

My Orbea is the Avant, which is their endurance model so quite a bit different than the Orca. I have the Avant outfitted with fenders and disc brakes. It's my commuter, but I also use it for longer distances (centuries) when it's wet out. The Orbea is a very comfortable bike and the disc brakes are so great in the wet weather.

My BH is the RC1 which is basically a G5, but with less expensive carbon. I use that for nicer weather and primarily for longer rides, especially when climbing is involved. The BH is such a great climbing bike.

PepeM

For that kind of money I think I would go to a more helpful store. Can't you get a fit for a few hundred so that you are sure you are getting the best option? Or just go smaller.

Then again, I can't imagine wanting to replace a bicycle that expensive within a year. Just buy both.

Jinx5000

And that's what I've noticed when I gave the Ultralight a test ride. It climbs great and the bike just seems to float out in front of me.

After I got back from riding the BH at my LBS today I rode my Orca and I could really feel the difference in the weight between the two bikes both in the flats and while climbing.

I wish there was an easy way to sell my Orca. Looks like I'll be placing it on Craigslist tonight!

Thanks for your input

Shuffleman

I am in the minority here as I am a usually between sizes but prefer to go with the larger one. With that being said, you are talking about a $3000 difference.!!
the price that you are paying for a bike is high so I would test ride the heck out of them and hope the less expensive one fit better.

Jinx5000

Hahahah yeah, I've gone on 3 test rides now, it seems the guys at my LBS are getting annoyed, but to hell with 'em. Its my money and I damn well wanna be sure I'm buying the right one.

It turns out that the small frame fits better anyways once I'm dialed in and fit properly.

cwar

My wife has an Orca Dama and it is a really nice bike. It seems to be a good balance between race and comfort. It doesn't climb like my BH though. I'm a small guy so climbing is where I excel and for that reason I really love my BH. Similar to what you said, when I put power to the pedals on a climb it's like the BH wants to shoot out in front of me. I feel like there is less power loss and flex from the BH. Plus, when standing on a climb and rocking the bike back and forth, the fact it's lightweight makes it "seem" less fatiguing.

At the end of the day I think the most important measure of a bike is how big of a smile it puts on your face. At this level, they are mostly all good bikes, so it comes down to the smile factor.

Jinx5000

I love my Orca and it makes me smile every time I go out for a ride; however, deep down there's a feeling that I'd be happier with the BH after feeling how much lighter it is, its stiffness and how it rides.

I've thought about just keeping the Orca and putting some DA C24's on them (10oz weight savings), but I'm not sure if that would change much in the way the bike feels or put it close to the feel of the BH.

Shuffleman

There will always be something out there that is lighter, better and faster. The itch to buy a new bike can get very strong. It is doubtful that it will provide you much more of a different feeling, especially when the novelty of the newness rubs off. The Orca that you have is a beautiful bike as is the BH that you are looking at. It is your money and you should do what you want and be happy with whatever it is. My only point is that you may be disappointed if you are looking for a long term WOW factor with the change.