What RPM are you riding at?
#26
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Is it your belief that all people are naturally great athletes and are able to reach their full potential without correcting the instinctive mistakes they make through focused training? There was a tennis coach many years ago that preached that. Just don't think about it, and everything will turn out right.
Have your ever watched people walking down the street? If people can't even learn to walk efficiently without instruction and coaching, what makes you think that any more complex activity can be perfected or even just improved that way. It sounds so right, but it is so wrong.
Have your ever watched people walking down the street? If people can't even learn to walk efficiently without instruction and coaching, what makes you think that any more complex activity can be perfected or even just improved that way. It sounds so right, but it is so wrong.
Now we need coaches for walking?!
Lemme tell ya, New Yorkers are known for being fast walkers. When I was younger, I used to zig-zag through the crowds on Midtown Manhattan streets, like some kind of maniacal Ferarri driver- just gliding through the already rather fast-moving hordes at about twice their speed; light on my feet; never stopping or making an abrupt move; just gliding through. I could do that, because at the time, I was at an optimum weight-to-power/muscle ratio; I spent a LOT of time walking; etc. etc. It was like magic; and I did it effortlessly. (And I could walk forever, with absolutely no consequence)
Today, I just walk like an average schlubb. I'm older; I'm more sedentary; I'm not as fit; my senses aren't as good; etc. -I know HOW to walk....but just putting one foot in front of the other and doing it faster isn't the answer; that's not how to walk faster...it's just a symptom of walking faster- and walking faster was the result of a bunch of other conditions- such as better fitness.
Ditto for cycling. It's insanity for the average recreational cyclist to try and match the cadence of elite athletes. What works for Lance Armstrong may not be optimal for Joe Sixpack. And what works for a 20 year-old, may not be so good for a 65 year-old. (Ever notice that most older riders tend to be mashers rather than spinners?)
LSS: It's more about our personal fitness and specifics of our bodies. A guy with really muscular legs, but who is not so great in the cardio department, is going to be a lot more comfortable/efficient mashing than spinning. A 25 year-old 130 lb. athlete is likely going to be a real spinner. To lump everyone together, and say "This is the most efficient cadence" regardless of age or fitness or terrain, etc. is just ridiculous.
As your fitness increases, you will likely spin faster....but spinning faster, itself, is likely not going to make your fitness increase.
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Is it your belief that all people are naturally great athletes and are able to reach their full potential without correcting the instinctive mistakes they make through focused training? There was a tennis coach many years ago that preached that. Just don't think about it, and everything will turn out right.
Have your ever watched people walking down the street? If people can't even learn to walk efficiently without instruction and coaching, what makes you think that any more complex activity can be perfected or even just improved that way. It sounds so right, but it is so wrong.
Have your ever watched people walking down the street? If people can't even learn to walk efficiently without instruction and coaching, what makes you think that any more complex activity can be perfected or even just improved that way. It sounds so right, but it is so wrong.
Track riders have to practice high cadence because they ride fixed gears. Road racers who get caught out and are unable to respond to changes in pace need to change up what they're doing because what they're doing isn't working for them. If the OP can achieve his (or her) goals doing what he's doing, it doesn't matter what his current cadence is. If he can't, he should change.
#28
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Between 80 and 90 is my sweet spot.
#29
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[TABLE="align: center"]
[TR]
[TD]Intensity[/TD]
[TD]Duration[/TD]
[TD]Time Riding[/TD]
[TD]Distance (miles)[/TD]
[TD]Work (kJ)[/TD]
[TD]Average Power (watts)[/TD]
[TD]xPower (watts)[/TD]
[TD]Max Power (watts)[/TD]
[TD]Average Heart Rate (bpm)[/TD]
[TD]95% Heartrate (bpm)[/TD]
[TD]Average Cadence (rpm)[/TD]
[TD]Average Speed (mph)[/TD]
[TD]Elevation Gain (feet)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #efefef"]
[TD="align: center"]active recovery[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:59:09[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:55:15[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]26.6[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]595[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]83[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]90[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]474[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]96[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]108[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]82[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]13.9[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]139[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]endurance[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3:48:26[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3:42:17[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]60.9[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1813[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]132[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]139[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]646[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]126[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]137[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]91[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]16.5[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1129[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #efefef"]
[TD="align: center"]threshold[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:00:02[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:00:02[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]20.4[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]743[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]206[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]207[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]615[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]159[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]164[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]92[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]20.4[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]129[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]long VO2max[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]10:03[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]10:03[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3.6[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]146[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]242[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]236[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]588[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]171[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]179[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]95[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]21.3[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]33[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
About 10 RPM less at low inertial loads on a trainer or climbing, except after running out of gears where I take what I can get.
I used to pedal somewhat slower until I noticed I could ride intervals on consecutive days at 90-100 RPM but not at 80-90.
Averages also don't tell the whole story, especially at greater intensities with higher cadences where things like acceleration pull down the average more:
Threshold histogram:
Sprinting I shift at 120-130 RPM (you need about 120 for maximum muscle fiber recruitment and power), although I can hit 140 if I don't want to get out of my 39 ring.
Otherwise I shift according to intensity and speed. Stopping in my big ring I don't use the largest cog; so I'm starting in either 50x23 or 50x21. Otherwise I don't start in too small a gear; maybe 39x19 on flat ground.
Last edited by Drew Eckhardt; 08-02-15 at 11:05 AM.
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While cycling isn't a very technical sport there are a few things to learn and some riders need some guidance. Doing things naturally works sometimes, other times it can just lock in some bad habits. Golf is certainly a good example of this and cadence to a lesser extent.
I've seen riders dropped in racing in large extent because they ride with too low a cadence and are unable to respond to changes in pace quickly enough to avoid losing a wheel. Track riders specifically practice riding at high cadence to improve efficiency.
I've seen riders dropped in racing in large extent because they ride with too low a cadence and are unable to respond to changes in pace quickly enough to avoid losing a wheel. Track riders specifically practice riding at high cadence to improve efficiency.
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My cadence tends to fall between 75-80 average on my rides.
Which is odd as every time I look down at my real time cadence numbers, I'm in the 90's.
Granted, I weight 280 lbs and have muscular tree trunks for legs. I'm not sure I can get these things moving fast enough to average 100
Which is odd as every time I look down at my real time cadence numbers, I'm in the 90's.
Granted, I weight 280 lbs and have muscular tree trunks for legs. I'm not sure I can get these things moving fast enough to average 100
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I don't pay much attention to speed, but I am usually pedaling at 100-110. Definitely under 20mph on a flat though... not a lot of power.
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It's true they only have one gear but it still takes some practice to pedal smoothly at higher cadence. I suspect you've seen riders who 'bounce' in their saddles when pedaling at higher cadence. Not only does it look bad but it's inefficient as well. Just takes a little practice to smooth out the pedaling.
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It's true they only have one gear but it still takes some practice to pedal smoothly at higher cadence. I suspect you've seen riders who 'bounce' in their saddles when pedaling at higher cadence. Not only does it look bad but it's inefficient as well. Just takes a little practice to smooth out the pedaling.
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Yes, on a fixed gear bicycle, to go faster, one must pedal faster. Track riding, generally is not about efficiency. The events are short. Turning a moderate to high gear quickly is what track riders do.
#38
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While riding my 50-13/14 on flat ground, I'm usually cranking in the 80-85 range. 18-20mph typically. Basically the same as my running cadence (160-170). Guess I could probably crank 5-10 more RPM/SPM but this feels comfortable to me as a new (less than 1000 miles) cyclist.
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And attentiveness.
I gave up with the bike computers - too fussy and unreliable. Not that they weren't accurate, just that too often they didn't work at all. I also found that there are other things more worth paying attention to than cadence, and I can generally tell when I'm being inefficient or when it would be a good idea to spin faster. One thing I've been more conscious of lately is the occasional need to spin slower, yes slower: on climbs. I don't need an electronic heart rate monitor to tell me that I need to ease up - when attacking a climb most aggressively, I can hear my pulse, and if I've still got a ways to go when that happens, I'll drop to a smaller cog to slow the cadence down.
Anyhow, on most rides, I don't 'work' the whole time - a lot of it is recreational, and I often find myself lollygagging. Then some guy in local racing team kit will pass by and I'll wake up, but even then, half the time I'll find that I have to pedal slower than him in order to stay behind, because I've gotten used to the slower cadence and anything faster just feels spastic and uncontrolled.
I suspect that among reasonably 'serious' riders, my cadence is a little slow compared to the rate at which others spin; however, I doubt there is so much difference in average cadence, since I coast much less often than most other riders. In fact, one of the things I love about fixed gear (which I just got into) is that it is so easy to keep pedaling while coming to a stop.
I gave up with the bike computers - too fussy and unreliable. Not that they weren't accurate, just that too often they didn't work at all. I also found that there are other things more worth paying attention to than cadence, and I can generally tell when I'm being inefficient or when it would be a good idea to spin faster. One thing I've been more conscious of lately is the occasional need to spin slower, yes slower: on climbs. I don't need an electronic heart rate monitor to tell me that I need to ease up - when attacking a climb most aggressively, I can hear my pulse, and if I've still got a ways to go when that happens, I'll drop to a smaller cog to slow the cadence down.
Anyhow, on most rides, I don't 'work' the whole time - a lot of it is recreational, and I often find myself lollygagging. Then some guy in local racing team kit will pass by and I'll wake up, but even then, half the time I'll find that I have to pedal slower than him in order to stay behind, because I've gotten used to the slower cadence and anything faster just feels spastic and uncontrolled.
I suspect that among reasonably 'serious' riders, my cadence is a little slow compared to the rate at which others spin; however, I doubt there is so much difference in average cadence, since I coast much less often than most other riders. In fact, one of the things I love about fixed gear (which I just got into) is that it is so easy to keep pedaling while coming to a stop.
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Grabbing a few representative samples from my data:
[TABLE="align: center"]
[TR]
[TD]Intensity[/TD]
[TD]Duration[/TD]
[TD]Time Riding[/TD]
[TD]Distance (miles)[/TD]
[TD]Work (kJ)[/TD]
[TD]Average Power (watts)[/TD]
[TD]xPower (watts)[/TD]
[TD]Max Power (watts)[/TD]
[TD]Average Heart Rate (bpm)[/TD]
[TD]95% Heartrate (bpm)
[/TD]
[TD]Average Cadence (rpm)[/TD]
[TD]Average Speed (mph)[/TD]
[TD]Elevation Gain (feet)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #efefef"]
[TD="align: center"]active recovery[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:59:09[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:55:15[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]26.6[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]595[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]83[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]90[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]474[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]96[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]108
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]82[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]13.9[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]139[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]endurance[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3:48:26[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3:42:17[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]60.9[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1813[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]132[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]139[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]646[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]126[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]137
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]91[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]16.5[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1129[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #efefef"]
[TD="align: center"]threshold[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:00:02[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:00:02[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]20.4[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]743[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]206[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]207[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]615[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]159[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]164
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]92[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]20.4[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]129[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]long VO2max[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]10:03[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]10:03[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3.6[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]146[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]242[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]236[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]588[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]171[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]179
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]95[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]21.3[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]33[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[TABLE="align: center"]
[TR]
[TD]Intensity[/TD]
[TD]Duration[/TD]
[TD]Time Riding[/TD]
[TD]Distance (miles)[/TD]
[TD]Work (kJ)[/TD]
[TD]Average Power (watts)[/TD]
[TD]xPower (watts)[/TD]
[TD]Max Power (watts)[/TD]
[TD]Average Heart Rate (bpm)[/TD]
[TD]95% Heartrate (bpm)
[/TD]
[TD]Average Cadence (rpm)[/TD]
[TD]Average Speed (mph)[/TD]
[TD]Elevation Gain (feet)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #efefef"]
[TD="align: center"]active recovery[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:59:09[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:55:15[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]26.6[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]595[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]83[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]90[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]474[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]96[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]108
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]82[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]13.9[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]139[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]endurance[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3:48:26[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3:42:17[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]60.9[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1813[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]132[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]139[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]646[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]126[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]137
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]91[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]16.5[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1129[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #efefef"]
[TD="align: center"]threshold[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:00:02[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1:00:02[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]20.4[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]743[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]206[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]207[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]615[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]159[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]164
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]92[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]20.4[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]129[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]long VO2max[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]10:03[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]10:03[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3.6[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]146[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]242[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]236[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]588[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]171[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]179
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]95[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]21.3[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]33[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
You don't have to drop to a smaller cog to slow down your cadence, you know. You can just slow down your cadence.
#43
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100-105.....I will run up to 115 and down to 90 if I have a series of rollers that I can do without shifting. 80 feels really really strange.
Bill
Bill
Last edited by Willbird; 08-02-15 at 02:13 PM.
#44
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Seriously, the point was that when experiencing an elevated heart rate while spinning up a hill, simply slowing down the cadence often helps enough that it isn't necessary to slow down the pace; you can 'enforce' the slower cadence without slowing down so much by dropping to a smaller cog.
#45
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Why are you spinning up a hill at high cadence with elevated heart rate if you can climb the same hill at the same speed at lower cadence and lower heart rate?
#46
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My usual weekday ride is 25-30 miles round trip to San Jose or East Palo Alto optimized for the fewest traffic lights and stop signs. Mondays 3x10 or 4x10, Thursdays 1:00-1:15 Z4, Tuesdays as a short endurance ride, Wednesdays and Fridays at a recovery pace.
For a 4-hour Saturday ride looping through Portola Valley and Woodside only adds 1000 feet. Staying on Page Mill would make that 2000, Old la Honda 2300.
I should probably ride down to Saratoga and otherwise get more variety in my life.
Last edited by Drew Eckhardt; 08-02-15 at 02:49 PM.
#47
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In Berkeley it's hard for me to do a 1-hour ride without gaining 1200 - 1500 feet. That probably has some ability to explain why my average cadence and average speed are so much lower than yours (the other part is cuz I'd be slow even on the same terrain as you). But, in a larger sense, the reason I brought that up is to demonstrate to the OP that cadence and speed is heavily influenced by the terrain you ride on so asking what others' cadence is isn't always informative.
#49
Senior Member
"back in the day" I would draft behind friends on their tandems on my track bike and do 50 miles at 110 rpm or higher. I am less dedicated now. My Garmin says I average around 75 rpm but I do 80-90 on flats and I try to maintain 80+ while climbing. I have to consciously do this or I backslide down into the 60's and 70's. I found that by keeping the revs up that it extends my endurance especially on hilly rides. I will watch my average over time and try to increase that average into the 80's.
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Some of you guys spin the crank really fast.
I'm usually in the 85-95 range, 105-110 for sprints. Anything under 80 feels a little odd and feels like I'm pushing too hard. 105+ is hard to sustain for me as I get worn out.
I don't know if height has anything to do with these numbers, but I'm 6'3" and I feel like my shorter cycling friends have a faster cadence than me.
I'm usually in the 85-95 range, 105-110 for sprints. Anything under 80 feels a little odd and feels like I'm pushing too hard. 105+ is hard to sustain for me as I get worn out.
I don't know if height has anything to do with these numbers, but I'm 6'3" and I feel like my shorter cycling friends have a faster cadence than me.