Did they really think they would get away with using a motor?
01-30-16, 11:14 PM
#1
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Did they really think they would get away with using a motor?
I remember someone posting a thread some months ago showing a bike with a motor in the seat tube/BB area but I didn't think anyone would actually try to get away with using one. Makes me wonder if it's happened before and this person was just the one to get caught.
'Technological fraud' discovered at Zolder cyclocross worlds - VeloNews.com
'Technological fraud' discovered at Zolder cyclocross worlds - VeloNews.com
01-31-16, 01:16 AM
#2
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If (and that's IF) we believe the father, it was not even her bike. So let's not ruin the poor girl's life so fast. What a bike like that is doing even close to a race or especially the pits, is a whole other matter.
Hope they don't enforce the rule on the fine either way, 200 000 swiss francs is a lot of money for someone so young.
Hope they don't enforce the rule on the fine either way, 200 000 swiss francs is a lot of money for someone so young.
01-31-16, 05:55 AM
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UCI has acknowledged her name is on the frame of that bike, which makes any excuse not really that plausible.
Also, she climbed 10 seconds faster than anyone else in the Koppenbergcross, riding against all the women pro racers. In the saddle, with the others en danseuse.
Also, she climbed 10 seconds faster than anyone else in the Koppenbergcross, riding against all the women pro racers. In the saddle, with the others en danseuse.
01-31-16, 06:07 AM
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If its difficult to detect the temptation will be there to give an added advantage. It's sad to think that the bikes will have to be inspected or x-rayed to look for a motor after a race. I think the fines should be severe to send a strong message.
01-31-16, 06:30 AM
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Also, she climbed 10 seconds faster than anyone else in the Koppenbergcross, riding against all the women pro racers. In the saddle, with the others en danseuse.
01-31-16, 06:57 AM
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It should be easy enough to confirm if the bike is covered with mud or not. Photo evidence from the race? Perhaps even distinctive mud patterns on the bike from the race.
01-31-16, 07:58 AM
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Here's a youtube trade show demo of the Vivax Assist motor.
I thought the motor and gears were noisy. The motor has to spin at high speeds and have gear reductions, like a cordless drill. But this demo is pretty quiet.
It there's a fairly large battery in the saddle bag. I suppose for a race cheat, it could just be something like a Di2 battery.
Stealth
This would have to be a custom install.
I don't see any systems with a hidden battery. It probably needs a pretty large battery to work for a couple of hours in a normal non-race ride. How much run time from a small hidden battery? Maybe just an assist on the steep climbs is all that's needed.
These battery assist systems seem to have a wired handlebar control. For a race cheat, the switch would have to be hidden. I don't think it can be an automatic assist--what decides when it kicks in?
~~~~
EDIT--Here's some good details from this Cycling Tips article. It includes a ride report, which says: The motor isn't very noisy. The switch turns the assist on, then stopping pedaling turns it off again.
The crazy thing about these motors is that the rider has to be competitive already. The motor won't have power to stay on the whole race. It's a winning breakaway tool!
A product like this wouldn’t need to be used throughout an entire race, or even for anything length of time. It might only need to be engaged once or twice — when attacking on a climb or cobbled sector, for instance, and trying to create a defendable lead.Modifications:
I thought the motor and gears were noisy. The motor has to spin at high speeds and have gear reductions, like a cordless drill. But this demo is pretty quiet.
It there's a fairly large battery in the saddle bag. I suppose for a race cheat, it could just be something like a Di2 battery.
Stealth
This would have to be a custom install.
I don't see any systems with a hidden battery. It probably needs a pretty large battery to work for a couple of hours in a normal non-race ride. How much run time from a small hidden battery? Maybe just an assist on the steep climbs is all that's needed.
These battery assist systems seem to have a wired handlebar control. For a race cheat, the switch would have to be hidden. I don't think it can be an automatic assist--what decides when it kicks in?
~~~~
EDIT--Here's some good details from this Cycling Tips article. It includes a ride report, which says: The motor isn't very noisy. The switch turns the assist on, then stopping pedaling turns it off again.
The crazy thing about these motors is that the rider has to be competitive already. The motor won't have power to stay on the whole race. It's a winning breakaway tool!
A product like this wouldn’t need to be used throughout an entire race, or even for anything length of time. It might only need to be engaged once or twice — when attacking on a climb or cobbled sector, for instance, and trying to create a defendable lead.
Looking at the bike there are only a few things that announce the fact that it’s not a standard road bike: the wire running underneath the top tube to the prominently placed start/stop button is one, as too is a saddlebag with vivax Assist emblazoned on it. The seat tube also had a few extra clamps around it than you’d normally see and there’s a tiny pin, low down on the non-drive-side of the seat tube, to hold the motor in place inside the frame.
Even the stealth version has a water bottle sized battery:For an extra €499 (roughly AUD $700) the Invisible Performance Package allows you to “invisibly transform your racing bike into an e-racing cycle”.
The saddlebag battery is replaced by a “bottle battery” lasting 60 minutes and presumably connected to the motor via the seatpost bidon-cage mounting holes. The wired, start-stop button is replaced by a wireless option which can be positioned at the end of the handlebar drops or, according to the product literature, “anywhere you like”.
The saddlebag battery is replaced by a “bottle battery” lasting 60 minutes and presumably connected to the motor via the seatpost bidon-cage mounting holes. The wired, start-stop button is replaced by a wireless option which can be positioned at the end of the handlebar drops or, according to the product literature, “anywhere you like”.
Last edited by rm -rf; 01-31-16 at 01:41 PM.
01-31-16, 08:04 AM
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If (and that's IF) we believe the father, it was not even her bike. So let's not ruin the poor girl's life so fast. What a bike like that is doing even close to a race or especially the pits, is a whole other matter.
Hope they don't enforce the rule on the fine either way, 200 000 swiss francs is a lot of money for someone so young.
Hope they don't enforce the rule on the fine either way, 200 000 swiss francs is a lot of money for someone so young.
Her father is most likely not the best judge of character...or the guy I'd call to make excuses if my butt was about to go through the shredder.
01-31-16, 08:08 AM
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If (and that's IF) we believe the father, it was not even her bike. So let's not ruin the poor girl's life so fast. What a bike like that is doing even close to a race or especially the pits, is a whole other matter.
Hope they don't enforce the rule on the fine either way, 200 000 swiss francs is a lot of money for someone so young.
Hope they don't enforce the rule on the fine either way, 200 000 swiss francs is a lot of money for someone so young.
01-31-16, 08:15 AM
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How long before the German team gets tested for emissions?
01-31-16, 09:03 AM
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Pretty disgraceful story if it turns out to be dedicated fraud. I've never understood the concept of cheating to win an athletic event, how could you be happy with yourself afterward, or feel like you'd accomplished anything? Of course I know that's a niave way of looking at things, because lot's of people would do anything to win..
01-31-16, 09:12 AM
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Pretty disgraceful story if it turns out to be dedicated fraud. I've never understood the concept of cheating to win an athletic event, how could you be happy with yourself afterward, or feel like you'd accomplished anything? Of course I know that's a niave way of looking at things, because lot's of people would do anything to win..
As much as the men's peloton rants about poor budgets and bad pay....men's professional cyclists at least can count on a salary at the UCI world level. Most similar-class UCI professional women's team members don't get healthcare/insurance or even a salary. The only compensation all but the top-1% of the field get is comp'd kit and bikes. If it looks like they're just racing to have fun (on the few women's races that get any coverage), that would be because most are only getting fun and fitness out of it.
01-31-16, 09:20 AM
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The thing with "professional" level anything and real life....having a well grounded and actionable sense of right and wrong doesn't put food on your table or a roof over your head.
As much as the men's peloton rants about poor budgets and bad pay....men's professional cyclists at least can count on a salary at the UCI world level. Most similar-class UCI professional women's team members don't get healthcare/insurance or even a salary. The only compensation all but the top-1% of the field get is comp'd kit and bikes. If it looks like they're just racing to have fun (on the few women's races that get any coverage), that would be because most are only getting fun and fitness out of it.
As much as the men's peloton rants about poor budgets and bad pay....men's professional cyclists at least can count on a salary at the UCI world level. Most similar-class UCI professional women's team members don't get healthcare/insurance or even a salary. The only compensation all but the top-1% of the field get is comp'd kit and bikes. If it looks like they're just racing to have fun (on the few women's races that get any coverage), that would be because most are only getting fun and fitness out of it.
Edting to add yeah I get what you're saying, maybe the women's side of the sport needs to catch up with the men's as far as salaries go.
01-31-16, 09:24 AM
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The motor costs around $2,700.
As as for alternative battery solutions, use a non-rechargeable Lithium-Air battery, you could put a series of them down the seat tube and take up far less space than the large li-ion battery packs.
For or the switch, it would be hidden through the frame and under the bar tape with the wire bound In a di2 bundle.
Claiming "that's not mine" is like a scene from one of those "Cops" tv shows when a person caught with drugs I their pocket claims "these aren't my pants"
As as for alternative battery solutions, use a non-rechargeable Lithium-Air battery, you could put a series of them down the seat tube and take up far less space than the large li-ion battery packs.
For or the switch, it would be hidden through the frame and under the bar tape with the wire bound In a di2 bundle.
Claiming "that's not mine" is like a scene from one of those "Cops" tv shows when a person caught with drugs I their pocket claims "these aren't my pants"
01-31-16, 09:25 AM
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Yep. Make the investigation, but odds are she's guilty. Even if she isn't, what kind of sketchiness is going on that a pro cyclist, or someone in her circle, even has a motorized bike, let alone brings it in the pit?
01-31-16, 09:54 AM
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I've always thought of athletics as a person being driven by wanting to accomplish something very difficult, the glory being the accomplishment of something few people could do. Cheating just kills that in every way in my mind. But yeah whenever money is involved corruption inevitably follows. It really is unfortunate.
Edting to add yeah I get what you're saying, maybe the women's side of the sport needs to catch up with the men's as far as salaries go.
Edting to add yeah I get what you're saying, maybe the women's side of the sport needs to catch up with the men's as far as salaries go.
01-31-16, 09:54 AM
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I really find it more amazing that in 150 years of bike racing, no one else has ever been caught with a motor. That indicates a strong, strong taboo.
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01-31-16, 09:57 AM
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The motor costs around $2,700.
As as for alternative battery solutions, use a non-rechargeable Lithium-Air battery, you could put a series of them down the seat tube and take up far less space than the large li-ion battery packs.
For or the switch, it would be hidden through the frame and under the bar tape with the wire bound In a di2 bundle.
Claiming "that's not mine" is like a scene from one of those "Cops" tv shows when a person caught with drugs I their pocket claims "these aren't my pants"
As as for alternative battery solutions, use a non-rechargeable Lithium-Air battery, you could put a series of them down the seat tube and take up far less space than the large li-ion battery packs.
For or the switch, it would be hidden through the frame and under the bar tape with the wire bound In a di2 bundle.
Claiming "that's not mine" is like a scene from one of those "Cops" tv shows when a person caught with drugs I their pocket claims "these aren't my pants"
I'm still honest for now, they current models won't fit my 27.2 seat post.
01-31-16, 09:57 AM
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Pretty disgraceful story if it turns out to be dedicated fraud. I've never understood the concept of cheating to win an athletic event, how could you be happy with yourself afterward, or feel like you'd accomplished anything? Of course I know that's a niave way of looking at things, because lot's of people would do anything to win..
01-31-16, 10:53 AM
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Yeah, just noticed... And saw the video of the race too, looks bad...
01-31-16, 11:13 AM
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Running a women's team is dirt cheap, because most don't pay their riders or even get them health insurance. To run a top-tier men's team you're looking at maybe $10 million USD+ minimum. A top women's team these days maybe $300K. Because only the top lead rider usually has any hope of getting any $$ to live on, if that.