Luis G.

Provided there's no impacts to the frame and in ideal conditions, carbon will outlast steel.
1. It doesn't rust.
2. Does not suffer from fatigue (welding joints or tubing). It can flex infinitely.

Givmedew

The OP is MIA so I'm going to say we all got trolled,

That said it always depends on cost and what's most important to you.

Price/Weight: high end aluminum frame like the caad10 weigh less than many carbon frames and not much more than the best carbon frames. If you have a budget that's under $4k your wheels will make up a bigger difference in weight than any carbon frame in that budget compared to the caad10. Where as the money needed for those nice wheels will be gone on higher end frames.

Price/Comfort: this is where carbon wins... Let's forget about steel... Not saying it sucks but if you wanted steel you'd know... Anyways carbon is comfortable! Cheap cheap carbon can be horrible to ride but most carbon bikes in the $2k up price are going to be be comfy bikes... Your wheels will suck compared to a comparable alum frame since more of your cash ends up in the frame but it is certainly comfortable.

No budget/comfort: steel, titanium, or a carbon cross bike.

No budget weight: carbon or titanium


I have owned junk steel and own a great steel single speed.
I have owned mid to high price carbon and I own S-Works carbon.
I have owned low end aluminum, I have owned scandium, and I own high end old aluminum (caad3) and high end new aluminum (caad10)

If your going for weight and your budget is under $3000 then aluminum is the answer. $3k total thrown at a Cannondale CAAD10 SRAM groupo and aftermarket wheels is going to get you a lighter bike than you'd likely find for under $5-6k in good carbon. When I say good carbon I mean the frame weighs less than a caad10 and it is properly engineered to be both stiff where needed and compliant where needed.

My caad10 with carbon fork (stock), carbon bars, and carbon seat post provides a comfortable enough ride. The S-Works frame is more comfortable by removing road buzz but we are talking about a frame that as a built bike retails for $10k and I think you can maybe manage to build new with rival parts and crap wheels for probably under $5k. For $5k you could have a 17LB caad10 with Di2!

My bikes:
High end custom steel frame single speed w/ carbon fork and hand spun wheels (velocity fusion rims) 18.5LBs w/ brakes and pedals.
Cannondale Caad3 w/ carbon Headshok, SRAM Force/Campy mix and Ksyrium elite wheels (17.5LBs)
Cannondale Caad10
Specialized S-Works Epic 29
Niner RIP 9
Cannondale Bad Boy Lefty
Specialized S-Works Tarmac

redfooj

rust and material fatigue far outlasts the useful life of a bike frame.

how many people do you know have retired a bike due to rust or failure?

2lo8

There's about a pound of difference when comparing to sub-700g carbon like the Emonda, SL, etc. About the same pound of difference between a CAAD10 and a nice steel frame.

Mulberry20

Modern steel frames do not rust because of the paint systems used and the care and storage you would expect from someone paying a significant amount of money for a bike. Rust is simply not an issue.

Your #2 is simple wrong in engineering terms. The stressed life of a carbon frame is substantially shorter than a steel frame or even an aluminum frame. Sorry. In relative terms Carbon bikes are disposable.

In any event, people that need to save 1lb - 1.5lb on an entire completed bike are a special breed.

2lo8

12 High-End Frames in the EFBe Fatigue Test

redfooj

point well taken: we should all reserve great care to not allow 275# dudes kick at our bikes for 50,000+ times.

RJM

It has been my experience that carbon rides better than aluminum; it's just more comfortable and translates road buzz better. I like steel too but good steel bikes that aren't boat anchors are generally expensive.

Bikeracer123

For $5k you could easily have a -16 pound caad 10

JoshTheSkier

This.

How does this topic keep coming up when the answer is so very clear?

2lo8

For $2k you could build up a 15lb bike from a generic carbon frame like the one from Nashbar.

TallTravel

Agreed, 100 % accurate, in my opinion.

HazeT

Mine wasn't that clear. My alu bike sucked on bad pavement but after I installed a better set of wheels (HED belgiums with 25mm tires) it felt so much smoother on the same roads.
I went ahead and rented a TREK Emonda from the LBS for a day, swapped the wheels and went on the same ride again, honestly I couldn't tell the difference between the Emonda and my old Specialized Secteur.
With that said, I now own a carbon frame and my previous impression still haven't changed, I'm now on the market for a nice CAAD10 or 12 frame.

HazeT

I don't know where did he get his 5K from... you can build a 15lbs CAAD 10 for ~ 2K:
Frame ~$650
DA C24 ~$750
Force 22 ~600
that covers the 3 major expenses. Could even go cheaper on the wheels.

Stratocaster

Here's my take, for what it's worth:

I went shopping for a new bike the other day...not because I need one, but because I sort of want one. I want to look at bikes that I might want during a year-end clearance sale.

Anyways, I wanted to try a Trek Emonda. Specifically, I wanted to see if a size 52 or 54 would fit me better.
Of course, the LBS that sells Trek didn't have what I was looking for - the ALR5 or 6, or the S5 - but they had a SL 5 in a 54 that was about $2,500.
It wasn't what I wanted and more than I wanted to pay, but in order to at least check the size I took it for a spin.

The thing felt like it had solid tires. It was a noticeably uncomfortable ride compared to my 2 aluminum bikes.

The sales dude was trying to sell me on compliance and weight and blah, blah, carbon is the way to go, blah, blah.

I told him that I didn't like the ride. I told him my 2 aluminum bikes had a better ride. He asked me what pressure I run my tires at. I said about 100. He said that the Emonda I tested had the tires at 110 psi- that's why the ride was less comfortable.
Also funny - he was trying to sell me on the weight of carbon. So he puts the carbon SL 105 on the scale, and it's about 18 lbs. He then puts a 60 inch ALR (aluminum) with Ultegra on the scale and its about 17.5 lbs.
OOPS! there goes the dude's selling leverage for carbon.

Note: Cycling magazine has declared the 2016 Caad 12 as their Bike of the Year - over much more expensive bikes. Aluminum is a good bike frame material - but I will say it helps if the bike has a carbon fork, which the Caad 12 does.

Having typed all that - If you're just going to ride to to work, passively ride around on it, etc - ANY frame material can work for you. If you want to do more than that (go on group rides, race, do some long travelling expeditions, etc) you might want to be more particular about your choice.
From my limited experience - there's more to bike comfort, weight, and performance than what the bike frame is made of. Get a bike that fits you well. Then tinker with tires.

TallTravel

I thought the same thing until I tested an aluminum road bike with a tighter and smaller frame triangle. This Giant Defy has carbon forks, and is almost as soft as any full carbon bike I've ridden.

That's my main road bike note, and I've spent as much as 6 hours on it at a time.

2lo8

Tires (and rims) and inflation pressure have a huge effect on comfort. If you aren't holding those constant, I'm skeptical if you can make claims about relative comfort levels of frame and fork materials. If you went buy pure platitudes, you'd assume my aluminum forks would be nigh unridable.

Luis G.

Hold it. They didn't put it over more expensive bikes. They gave it bike of the year because of the incredible value it offers. It's pretty much giving you the best aluminum frame you can buy for about $1600~ which is very budget carbon fiber bikes start.

Bolo Grubb

my experience has been that tire and tire pressure make the biggest difference in ride quality.

I have owned both Aluminum and Steel bikes and with good tires and reasonable air pressure, both were very comfortable.

bruce19

As have I. Both my Guru steel and Masi AL w/CF drops and fork are excellent rides.

jesspal

The new Sprint Allez Rival is pretty awesome for $2,000 msrp, and i'm sure can be bought for less.

Stratocaster

Um, there's more to it than that. If you read the description, they basically say it's a great bike, regardless of what it's made of and the price.
But yes, the value aspect plays into it as well.

CrankyNeck

Sounds like some of you really HATE steel and LOVE carbon. Oh well. Steel has become the bastard stepchild of the frame-building materials of late, and that's too bad. Custom-fit carbon fiber frame? Good luck. Steel? No problem. And an experienced frame-builder can tune it just how you want it. Yamaguchi makes some great custom aero steel frames. Now I'm not trying to disparage carbon fiber frames. If you like carbon and can get a good fit, fine. Really. What I am saying is that you have another viable option besides aluminum and carbon fiber for a high-performance frame. Some, because of their build, cannot find a good fit on a stock frame. Since fit and comfort are two of the more important factors in a frame, steel should not be forgotten about.

Maelochs

Sounds more to me like a very few people hate CF and Alu.

Facts as I see them: Yeah, custom CF only works if you are an aerospace engineer. But ... custom steel is not cheap, and you have to know pretty much exactly what you want to get any benefit of a custom frame.

Most people can take a bike off the rack and by adjusting the adjustable bits, can find an excellent fit. Not every person can fit every bike, but there are enough different bikes out there that most people can find a really good fit ... those who don't probably don't even know what a good fit feels like.

For most riders, the cost and the knowledge needed to take advantage of custom frame-builders renders custom steel Not an option. For those who have the cash and the knowledge ... likely they will always have that option. You can still buy wooden canoes and kayaks.

I don't see why anybody would disparage any frame material. I don't know why anybody would bother defending any frame material.

In time I doubt there will be anything but custom steel frames ... Alu offers so much more formability and CF far more than that, and as the technology spreads, CF will probably prove to be the most cost-effective frame material---it can do what the rest can do and more, and in time will be cheaper.

As bike weights drop, lightweight steel will grow more expensive and no one will want heavy steel--eventually only steel aficionados will seek out the small-volume builders, and most people will never have ridden steel.

On the other hand, in time even basic Alu frames will be as comfortable as today's CAAD 10s and CAAD 12s, and with CF forks and seat posts, ride quality will not suffer at all compared to steel.

The habit some people have of trying to deny others the experiences of different frame materials .... it is sort of frame-material racism, and has all the logical justification of actual racism. Not much point arguing the point.

SundayNiagara

It's all good.