MrCrassic 

I don't want to start any pissing contests here, but I am very interested to hear everyone's opinions on this.

I am very adament about keeping the toeclips that came with my bike. When I purchased it, I had the option to get Shimano clipless pedals at a cheaper price, but I took the toeclips instead. Overall, they feel much better to ride with, especially if trying to hold decent average speeds and ascending.

However, I see that lots of people here are heavily advocating "going clipless." The main problem that I have with doing that is:

1. It's an expensive transition: The pedals alone can cost up to $100, even though I've seen some sets at $50. Then there's the materials debate that need not be mentioned...

2. It's an uncomfortable transition: The old school pros managed perfectly fine on toeclips, even though they are hardly seen now. I really like the ability to dismount my bike and have no problems walking around and not ruining anything. I re-discovered this freedom when I had my bike incident this past Sunday (read about it in the "Upset" thread I made).

Are clipless systems a justifiable purchase? Furthermore, will I see any tangible performance benefits if I switch?

Thanks for your feedback!

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merlinextraligh

The old school pros were using toeclips with cleats nailed into cycling shoes. To get the same efficiency out of toeclips that you get from clipless, you need to be using shoes with cleats.

Such a setup is as bad to walk in as a shoe cleated for clipless; is harder to get out of than clipless, and is less comfortable.

I have a vintage track bike that I ride with cleated shoes (wanted to stay with the Campy pedals) and it is way less comfortable, and you need to remember to bend down and loosen the straps.

dcvelo

I have it from a reliable source that clipless pedals are for racer wannabees....

BillyD

You are not alone sir Crassic. I am not ashamed to say that I straddle the fence as well. One of my bikes is clippless, and one is clipfull (yes, a new word evolved from the BF culture, defined as: "having toe clips").

And I dare say that unless you race your bike, you do not need that extra 5 - 7% performance increase and energy efficiency that clipless pedals provide. If you just ride for fitness or recreation, what difference does that efficiency make to you? OK you'll be 90% tired when you get home as opposed to 85% tired. Or you only rode 37.5 miles today instead of 40 miles. Big deal.

If you don't feel you need them, don't use them. And don't let any of these blokes call you a Fred!!

Oh, BTW, flame on!!

flipflop

I tracked down a set of MKS sylvans through ebay and took the time to size the clips correctly... out of the various metal and plastic clips that I tried, never did get the ball of my foot centered on the spindle to not feel like a ballerina or walking up hill.

Finally gave up and went without clips and straps completely for a year... just changed to clipless, not going back!

merlinextraligh

^ ^I think your analysis is correct.

However, when the OP talks about toeclips working fine for the old school pros, he's mixing apples and oranges.

As I see it you can ride toeclips with tennis shoes, or non cleated cycling shoes and have an arguable convenience advantage, but give up a little performance. This may be a good choice for many depending on their goals and priorities.

However, if you want the performance of clipless, you need to have cleated shoes and tight straps which have more disadvantages than clipless.

ericm979

I started serious riding in the mid 80s, before clipless pedals that were useable for road use were invented. I switched when the first LOOK pedals came out (but had to use clips on my MTBs until MTB clipless pedals were invented). There is no way I'd go back, except for a short-distance commute bike that I wanted to wear regular shoes with.

The thing I hated about clips was that you got a choice of having the strap tight and not pulling out, but being unable to get your foot out at stops, and also having your foot slowly go numb. Or you could run the strap loose so you could pull out when needed and be comfortable, but then chance pulling your foot out on a climb. The comfort and safety advantages are what made me switch in the first place, and those have not changed.

But if you are happy with clips, use 'em.

MrCrassic 

I am probably going into racing. The situation is that the bike I own is also the bike I commute with, which is also the bike I train with and will soon be racing with. I'm sure many of you started similarly.

I really do not want to have to carry an extra pair of shoes every time I commute to work or go out somewhere. I try to bring everything I need for the days I bike to avoid carrying anything. Therefore, even though I could use all of the performance increases I can get (that are healthy and legal), I'm not sure if I want to sacrifice the ease of cycling for a higher horsepower ride.

I might just get clipless for pure training rides (like my weekend rides or centuries) and go "clipfull" (excellent word!) for the common stuff. How hard is it to change out pedals?

Also, my toeclips are not strapped on tightly at all (but not unstrapped), since I like having the ability to just slip my foot in and out at ease. It works great for me.

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merlinextraligh

Not very. Get a good pedal wrench, and use plenty of grease when you put them on.

If you're going to be doing it frequently, you may eventually wear out the threads in the crank.

You might consider 2 sided pedals with platforms on one side and SPD on the others. You could commute with regular shoes, and train with clipless. Then change to a lighte clipless pedal on race day.

Soloist Assassin

Toe Clips are just too hard to get out of. I have been ridding clipless pedals for years, and I love them. However I just bought a new set of road cycling shoes, to fit my Ultegra pedals on my new bike, and they are near impossible to walk in. I am contemplating buying some toe clip pedals for my commuter. Or possibly, just go with platforms.

celerystalksme

thing is, fitters will tell you have to be refitted for your bike when going from clipless to clipfull.

canthidefromme

Might as well ride a hybrid around... or even a mtn bike--loss of efficiency, no big deal.

OneArmedScissor

I loved having toeclips on my commuter road bike in tokyo. If I didn't want to wear my dorky cycling shoes into work (the old ladies loved to call me Lance, or Keirin-freak, or Bike-otaku) I could ride in a suit and dress shoes and just roll up my pant leg.

no hate for clipless, especially when your bike is more than just a hobby.

Duke of Kent

If you plan on racing, you WANT clipless pedals.

I never raced on toeclips, but I have crashed an MTB while using them.

I can't even imagine how bad it would be going down at 30-40mph with toeclips.

MrCrassic 

I use the commuting time as training time, so using platforms is very out of the question.

Do they have pedals that have toeclips on one side and clipless on the other (or adapters)? If they exist, then I can give serious though to getting that instead. I don't want to invoke any (further) damage to my bike.

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Duke of Kent

If you fall the wrong way with toeclips, most of the damage will be to you.

Obviously a crash is going to be bad, but toeclips open up a whole new bag of bad things waiting to happen.

njkayaker

I used to use toeclips with the cleated shoes and recently went clipless. The clipless pedals are much, much easier and safer to use than properly using toeclips.

I think a fair number of people commute with clipless pedals (and the funny shoes).

There are some pedals (Crank Brothers) that "platform" and "clipless" (but no toeclips) that might allow you to use normal shoes.

Toeclips do make using regular shoes possible. I hate riding without toeclips or clipless pedals.

Can you even get the old style cleats? If you could, that would be an option.


If such exist, they would certainly be preferred by mashists. (The up-side-down cage would always be dragging on something.)

Note that mountain bike (MB) clipless shoes allow you to walk around easier than the racing ones (I use MB shoes/cleats.)

Aloyzius

I have clips on my commuter, and clipless on my roadie. It's nice, and I wouldn't want it any other way. But I would like to be able to remember which I'm wearing. Sometimes I reach for a buckle that isn't there, or try to heal out of my clips. No crashes yet, but never say never.

ericm979

If you are running your straps loose enough to get your feet out easily and not pulling out by accident, then you have a pedal stroke that could easily be improved. You are wasting power because you are not pulling up enough. Each downward pedal stroke has to lift the dead weight of the other leg in addition to powering your forward motion.

If it were me, I'd get clipless pedals and ride in them all winter. If that means having to leave a pair of walking/dress shoes at work, or carrying them with you, do it. It takes years to develop a good efficient pedal stroke, so the sooner you start the better.

tpelle

I have old-fashioned toe clips on my Long haul Trucker. I found the MKS pedals at Harris Cyclery, which according to them are the only ones still being made especially for toe clips. I have the straps adjusted so that my sneaker-clad foot just slides in, and with the XXL toe clip my foot is perfectly positioned on the pedal.

I'm a recreational cyclist. I'm not a racer. I'm not really concerned with extracting the last milliwatt of efficiency out of my pedaling system. I'm just interested in riding for fun and for exercise. I like being able to ride in sneakers.

The only downside, for me, about toe clips is when I first start out from a dead stop. I usually insert my left foot into the clip, and start pedaling with my right foot on the "bottom" of the pedal. Until I get up enough speed that I can coast for a couple of seconds to get my right foot in, the right pedal's toe clip will scrape on the pavement if I'm turning to the right at all. No danger of it catching or anything, but it's a little annoying.

merlinextraligh

They are devices that clip into look style pedals to make them into platform pedals with toeclips. They're marketed for triatheletes that want to cycl in their running shoes. That could work for you.

Zouf

I move my pedals between my road bike and my trainer bike 2-3 times a week, been doing it for 2 years with this set of pedals and another 4 years before that - yet to get anywhere near "wearing out the threads in the crank". Unless you ape 60000 lbft torque each time you do it, I don't see a problem with moving/changing pedals frequently. Plus, you quickly learn not to torque them silly tight, since you effectively check them before every ride by changing them around...

+1 on the double-sided (platform + SPD), it's a great compromise on a go-anywhere bike.

MrCrassic 

This would absolutely work for me. Are they costly?

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littledjahn

Not as expensive as you think. The only really high quality quill pedals still being manufactured are the MKS Sylvans, which are about $30. Throw in a pair of good quality clips & straps, and you're at $50. There are plenty of decent clipless options reasonably close to that price.

noisebeam

Or get a type of clipless cleat/pedal that allows them to be recessed in the shoe and get shoes that a decently walkable. There are many available and will be (much) better than soft soled shoes with loose toe clips.

Leave a pair of work shoes at work and do you errands, daily trips in the (non-racer) cycling shoes with recessed clipless cleats.

Shoes for example include Shimano MO38, Shimano Sandals and many more.

If you going to get into racing, the clipless types that use recessed cleats will do you fine, very fine.

Al