LotusMan

I'm am trying to select a new cassette to go with a triple chainrings up front. (No granny gear comments -- I live in a fairly hilly area and I am getting on in years.) Looking at the Campy 10sp cassette selections I am wondering what the logic is to the gearing choices they offer. I can't seem to find much discussion on caseetee selection anywhere, so I figured I would ask here.

Here are questions I am grappling with.
1) what would one "normally" use with a triple (53/42/30)?
2) Why would anyone buy a 12-25 cassette when an 11-25 cassette is available?
3) why can't you get a 12-26, or an 11-26, or for that matter a 12-29, or an 11-29 (this one, I can see might be too large a range, yes?).
4) Is there any sense to a 13-29 with a 30 chainring up front? Is a 29 in the rear virtually unnecessary except for the most extreme inclines?
5) similar to any earlier question, why would you want a 13-26 when there is a 13-29 (unless, of course, your rear derailleur can't handle the 29?

It seems to me that unless you are outright racing and might benefit from finer gear ratio intervals and can target the overall ratio range to the course, you would want the widest gearing ratio you could fit. Thanks for your insight and assistance with this.

urbanknight

It's all a matter of need. Get the highest and lowest gears you "need" but don't over do it. If you climb steep hills, you want a large rear cog. If you barrel down hills pedalling the whole way, you want a small rear cog. The reason not to over do it is because the further apart your largest and smallest cogs are, the bigger the jumps in between, which makes it harder to select the correct gear while riding.

That said, my uncle does a lot of serious climbing and rides a 12-27 with his 52/39/30. That keeps a decent cadence as low as 6 mph, so you'd have to be climbing a wall of a hill to need a 29 in my opinion.

As for the 12-25, I have one on my race wheels because I sometimes encounter a climb I need the 25 on, but rarely use those wheels on anything steeper so I don't need a 27. I also don't need an 11 since most of my races don't go down steep hills either, so removing the 27 and 11 gives me a much closer spacing.

Did that help or did I just spew a bunch of crap?

logdrum

The closer the gears are the better - I think

AEO

I just went through this...

1: 12-27 cassette for a 30-39-53 triple seems to be pretty standard on most manufacturers.
2,3,5: You get tighter gear ratios, better for finding the right gear for your cadence.
4: The gear spread for going down in gear can be big, but it's much better to have 1T~2T steps for going up in gears.

Keeping the spread to a minimum helps to improve efficiency since you can find the right gear instead of wishing you had something inbetween.

oh yeah, there's also the Junior gearing requirement, which limits the top gear the riders can use.

ted ward

I agree and don't think you can overdo it; I ride 11-23 on my race wheels but am never bothered by the wide spacing of my 11-32 mountain bike.

supton

IMO, the deeper the gearing, the bigger the split can be. It's when you're up to speed that you start wishing for just a few percent difference as the conditions change (slight incline, headwind, etc)--but when you need to downshift for a hill or a patch of mud, by the time you've shifted you really need more than just a few percent.

If you're upgrading parts, you should have a better idea of what you want. Did you find the splits too wide, too many unused gears on one end of the range or the other? Or was it the right range of gears, but not enough close together?

rmwkokomo

I imagine cassette and chainring design options are influenced by how they will be used. Simply put, someone who needs a 29 tooth sprocket and 30 tooth chainring probably won't need to turn a 53x11 unless riding down a cliff.
Derailleur capacity limits sprocket selection. Using a Campy medium cage derailleur (36T capacity) with a 53/42/30 triple limits the cassette to a 13 tooth spread (13-26 for example). Going up to a long cage rear (39T capacity) takes it up to a 16 tooth cassette spread (13-29).

johnny99

Gaps between cogs in your cassette can be a big problem on group rides (or races) where you are trying to ride efficiently at someone else's pace. Narrower range cassettes have smaller gaps between cogs, making it easier to find a nice gear ratio for your group's speed.

enjoi

i use a 11-25 with a 52/37 up front. It seems to have most any situation covered

Homebrew01

Because I will almost never use an 11 with my 53. I'd rather have an extra cog in the middle like an 18 that I would use every day. Even the 12 is rarely used. a 13-25 would be more practical sometimes.

urbanknight

What brought you to a 37 small ring? I know plenty of people on 42, 39, 38, 36, and 34, but I don't even know where to find a 37t road ring!

enjoi

i meant 38, typo

salsa make it.

LotusMan

So, if you have steep hills, you would seem to want both an 11 (for going down) and a 27 (for going up). But, of course, no one seems to offer that.



That would seem to me to be a good range, but Campy doesn't offer it. The Chorus range, for example, offers 12-25, 13-26 and 13-29. I would not want to be without the 12 because I seem to use it a lot -- it just seems more comfortable/natural for me -- so the 13-2x is out.

Are there any quality third party cassette makers that make something to fit Campy that might offer a wider range? Or should I just suck it up on the steep hills and get the 11-25 or 12-25?

urbanknight

Look harder. I have an 11-28 from SRAM. But not everyone would need both the 11 and the 27. Some people might like to coast down hills or have a personal speed limit of say 30 or 40. Those people wouldn't use an 11, so they stick with the 12. Other people like to mash up hills and not worry about cadence, so they wouldn't care for the 27/28. I like to save my knees, so I got a 28 for the major climbing rides. I also like taking a couple minutes off my commute which goes down La Tuna Canyon, so the 11 comes in handy too.

Look for Miche (www.bikeman.com carries it). I think they're making 10 speed cassettes now, and you can mix and match cogs to your hearts content with theirs. The penalty is a little more weight since all the cogs are individual, but it's nice to buy one or two extra cogs and be able to change your gearing at will.

MIN 

44T by 11-34T (XTR cassette) for me. I hate the FD.

LotusMan

Are the SRAM cassettes compatible with the Campy freehub? Or do they just make a compatible one? Also, how would they work with the Campy ultra drive system -chain, RD, etc? Would there be any usability issues if it would fit?

bdcheung

No, Campagnolo is only for real racers. If you can't handle Zoncolan on an 11-23, then you don't deserve Campagnolo.

jcbenten

Seems to me that a 30 x 25 should be more than enough of a low gear. Unless you plan on climbing Mt. Washington or the Angliru.

urbanknight

No sorry, they're Shimano compatible. Miche is your only hope for Campy.

LotusMan

But I'm Italian and need to support the home team! Besdies, I'm used to the way it works.


And I guess the trade-off here would be a weight, quality, and smoothness and ease of shifting. I guess 12-25 will have to do.

slynkie

You can also mix and match depending on the construction of the cassettes. When I moved from a triple to a compact, I didn't trust my fitness so I took a campy 12-25 and 13-29, and mixed + matched cogs to get a 12-29.

A few months passed and I found I didn't need the 26 and 29 cogs, so I'm back to the stock 12-25 - but that's besides the point. Just be aware of the construction, as the cogs may not necessarily be separate pieces. SRAM for one, if I recall, connect all of their cogs together with some plastic. Campy Veloce are all separate.

urbanknight

When I was running Campy, my Miche cassette (12-29 made from a 12-26 and a loose 29) shifted just fine. I do believe it was about 20g heavier than a standard Veloce cassette, and even more when compared to Record. I can't attest to the durability since I sold the bike 1000 miles later.

uspspro

Triple + 12-25 is a great choice.

53-12 is huge enough, 30-25 is pretty damn small, and you'll have a billion ratios in between.

My old roadie (now commuter/beater) has a Triple (52/39/30) with a 12-25 (9 speed). I used to ride centuries on it with 7000+ feet of climbing and I consistently found myself using the 30-21 as my lowest gear utilized. The 23 and 25 were only for when I was completely shot.

So anyway +1 for the 12-25

Bostic

Miche cogs are tanks but they give you the option to choose any gearing you want. I put about 600 miles on mine and noticed the chrome was all worn to shreds. One 27t cog weighed more than a 23-25 Chorus spider and a 21 weighed more than a 24. If you are a weight weenie you might want to bring your gram scale to the bike shop and pick and choose the lightest of each cog in the Miche rack. Before I sold my Trek I put together a custom Miche 9 speed shimano cassette for climbing, 12 14 16 18 21 23 25 27 29. A brick was lighter.