matkinstall

I'm a fan of custom wheels, hand-built by me or someone I know. I'm thinking about a build for general use. Training, club rides, commuting, etc. I've been lurking on BF for a while now and have concluded that my next build will be niobium rims laced to WI or DT hubs. My questions are:

1. Which brand of nio rims should I order? The two I've heard of are Kinlin and IRD. Are IRD rims are just rebadged Kinlins? I'd be ordering these through my LBS, what do I ask for? Are any of these better than the DTs my favorite LBS prefers?

2. Spoke count: I'm 6'3", 185. I ride everywhere, and prefer a stiff wheel. I avoid potholes but some of the roads I ride are just awful. I'm thinking 28/32 front/rear.

3: Spoke brand/type: double-butted vs. aero: are the aero spokes worth the extra expense? I don't mind shelling out more for lighter and/or more aerodynamic spokes, but not at the expense of stiffness or durability.

what say you?

AEO

1: whichever is cheapest. as far as I know, fairwheel is the cheapest, but not always in stock. XR-300 are the 30mm deep ones. They're much lighter than DT 1.2 rims.

bananatugger and waterrockets are the experts on these.

I have mine setup as 28f ultegra radial/32r 105 3x with 2.0/1.8/2.0mm DB spokes and brass nipples, but they're highly overkill for my weight of <130lbs
pot holes and rail road crossings seem to do nothing to them.

Psimet2001 

Kinlin manufacturers the rim. It is imported under the IRD name as a "Cadence Aero" as well. Every LBS I dealt with was not able to get the Cadence Aero through their normal distribution channels, but they are able to get the IRD Cadence - different rim so be careful.

sac02

2. A while (maybe a year?) ago I called Mike G and talked to him about a set of wheels and he thought I would be ok on a set of 20/24 30mm Niobium rims (I'm ~175). Despite his experienced recommendation, I just ordered a set of 24/28 27mm Niobiums through the group buy after numerous reports of the Niobium rims not being the stiffest around.

3. I've built a few sets of wheels and prefer aero spokes for the simple fact that they are easier to build with. I've noticed little to no difference in stiffness or durability (so far - only ~3000 miles) in the wheelsets I've built that I could confidently attribute to the spokes. Whether or not you can, or want, to shell out 3 times what a round spoke would cost is up to you.

Mac

mihlbach

I'm 205 and I'm riding a 24/28 pair of Niobium30/cxray/white industries wheels that I built myself with parts purchased from MG. So far only 4000 miles on these wheels but they are holding true, with no loss of spoke tension.

Aero spokes won't make you much faster but they can't hurt. However, you can built a better wheel with them because you can prevent spoke twist by holding the spoke in place as you turn the nipple. MG sells cx rays for cheaper than anyone I know. They were $2 per spoke last time I bought parts from him.

gfrance

I'm 165 running 16 spoke front 20 rear on Niobiums. However, they are built with the slightly beefier Laser spokes. About 6 months of use without a problem so far.

waterrockets 

Don't skimp on spoke count. 28h/32h will be fine, especially for training. I'm racing and winning with a 32h Ultegra Deep-V up front.

jfmckenna

I wish I had more spokes on my Mike G wheels but none the less they have held up pretty well especially for the price. I forgot what spokes I have but they are aero but not obnoxiously aero like on Kyseriums or Bontragers. If you are careful building up the wheel then spoke twisting won't be an issue. I'd prefer non aero spokes but again the ones I have are only slightly ovalized.

CastIron

I'm looking at doing similar builds myself this winter.

A parts source that looks good (haven't tried 'em) and inexpensive: https://www.prowheelbuilder.com/

damocles1

Your shop can get the Cadence and the Aero from Merry Sales, out of SanFran.

I built a set of the IRD Cadence hoops with 32h f/r, White hubs and CX-Ray spokes and they've been bulletproof. 1405 grams and very stiff. I weigh 180-185.

If you're building training/commuting wheels, don't worry about spoke count. 28/32 or 32/32 will yield a bulletproof wheelset.

I also built my old PT on a Cadence Aero 32h hoop with CX-Rays. It was rock solid.

BananaTugger

You need spokes. Lots of them.

28 spoke radial front/32 spoke 3x DS, 2x NDS is what I'm thinking. Alloy nipples on the front and NDS with brass on the DS.

CX-Rays would be fine.

mr handy

Whats the advantage of radial lacing on the front? I thought 1x or 2x would be stronger. Or is it that the #x pattern simply makes the wheel more resistant to torque, which is only an issue on the drive wheel?

BananaTugger

Radial lacing is more aero, lighter and it looks badass. Two of these things are measurable, but they may not be perceivable when you are riding. They are there, though.

1x lacing would be weird on a 28 spoke wheel. 2x lacing would be good for a lower spoke count rear wheel that sees torsion.

jrennie

Why "spokes and lots of them" I'm running niobium 30's 20/24 aerolite spokes and dt hubs laced heads out and they are still plenty stiff and durable enough to hold up to nor-cal roads(we seem to like to race on crap roads)

BananaTugger

Wants stiff, rolls over crap roads all week.

Rutnick

Not to be confused with Ken Lee

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RgL2MKfWTo

Rutnick

what about direct from IRD?

https://store.interlocracing.com/caae70rim.html

BananaTugger

You can get Kinlin branded rims from Fairwheel Bikes for $10 less.

Rutnick

but NOT Ken Lee:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEbV5M59Xc8&NR=1

BananaTugger

What is wrong with you?

waterrockets 

How much do you weigh? How many miles on the wheels?

If long-term durability isn't as much of a concern, then absolutely fewer spokes is fine. Adding more spokes has a huge impact on durability, and a very small impact on performance.

DScott

I've currently got 32H '07 Record hubs, machine built onto Open Pro rims and Wheelsmith spokes. 8000 miles in, and they're still going strong. How would the 32H Nio rim with CX-Rays improve on this wheel?

Lighter? Stiffer? Stronger (or at least as strong as...)?

In order of importance, my criteria are: durable, light and aero. I'm 170#, ride 6000mi/year, and don't love to fuss with my equipment.

bitingduck

So what's the point of Nb rims? Cool them to 4 K and somehow use them in a superconducting motor? The mass of the cooling system would kill any advantages....

BananaTugger

They aren't made of niobium, niobium is used in the alloying process.

It also sounds cool.

CastIron

Exact same wheels from Performance and they're crap. I true them only weekly now after using two bottles of Loctite. WTH?