urbanknight

It's time to replace my brake pads. At the recommendation of multiple people, I will go with Kool Stop salmon. My current calipers are Ultegra/600 from the 8 speed era, so I'll be getting the Dura Type shoes as well.

But this got me wondering, is there a reason to upgrade the calipers? Aside from the color that no longer matches anything on the bike and some scratches from 13 years of use, they seem to be the same dual caliper design as my friends with brand new Ultegra brakes. They work fine as far as I can tell, so are my brakes just as good as the newer ones? Should I just get the new shoes and keep rocking the steep grades with confidence?

operator

No

urbanknight

Well, when Operator speaks, it is THE answer! Thanks again, you're one of the people who suggested Kool Stop in the first place. Two people recommended the salmon pads even though it rarely rains here, claiming that they seem to have better braking control in the dry as well. Anybody agree or disagree with this? Yesterday's descent down a 4 mile hill averaging 12% (yeah, going up it was fun too) made me wish I had a little more confidence in my brakes.

fauxto nick

I love my salmons.

Geordi Laforge

always get kool-stops

San Rensho 

No, the whole idea behind riding a bicycle is going fast, and brakes just slow you down.

Any decent, modern brakes, heck even old 80s era Weinman brakes, are more than good enough to stop hard enough at full speed so that the rear wheel starts to come off the ground, which is the limit of braking on any bicycle.

urbanknight

^ Although you're right, braking control is a wonderful thing to have. I know that road bikes have had enough power to stop the wheels for a long time, but it can't hurt to have more control over that power so I don't skid the tire and wash out.

Anyway, it sounds like I have my answer. Keep the calipers and put Kool Stop salmons on them. Thanks!

captnfantastic

dura-ace pads are enough. Save some $$. I put them on my cake creek brakes and as strange as this sounds I descend slower now due to fear of locking up the rear (happened the first long decent after getting new pads). It's just taking some time to get used to but dura ace pads rock. Plus they are like less than $20 for a set of four.

timmyquest

I bought the girlfriend kool stops for her nameless tektro's. That helped, but the brakes still suck. She's moving up to 105 come next b-day

urbanknight

The 8 speed era brakes did not have replaceable inserts, so I have to buy a whole new shoe. The best price I see on Dura Ace pads is $90 for a full set, while the Kool Stops would run $35 and come with a spare set of pads.

On top of that, Kool Stop inserts are $7/pair and Dura Ace seems to be $10/pair. That wouldn't save $$$ either.


That was what I was wondering about. All of the dual pivot calipers seem to look about the same, but I know there must be some differences. So it would be interesting to know if there are any performance differences between 1996 Ultegra and the various current Shimano brakes.

timmyquest

I have a hard time believing that there would be no difference but i'm also not convinced it would be a difference you would readily notice. I'm also not sure how much of the stopping power is built into the brifter.

urbanknight

Hmmm, I hadn't thought about the stopping power of the brifter lever. I did have 8 speed brifters on originally, then upgraded to 10 speed. I noticed a slight difference, but the lever seemed to be longer, so I figured it just had more leverage.

bitingduck

I still have 9 speed 105 dual pivot calipers-- they work fine. Main difference between them and Ultegra at the time was color and maybe the material of one washer (or not even that much besides color). They still work great-- if you can skid your tires (which any dual pivot should do for your) then you won't gain anything from even more brake strength.

And kool stop are the only pads that matter. There was a while when DA pads were eating aluminum rims-- I don't know if they finally fixed that, but it was a real effect, and keeping the pads really clean didn't help.

Crast

Well, on the really cheap no-name calipers coming with the taiwanese fixed gears that roll through our bike co-op, they from 10 feet awy look hardly any different from say, ultegra 6600. But they are made of flexy cheap metal, with crappy springs and hinges. Braking under any sort of pressure causes them to flex and the brake shudders and becomes useless; I bent one of the brake caliper arms simply by trying to tighten the brake cable holding allen bolt. (Even after that, it just didn't want to hold a brake cable well. go figure.)

For Ultegra level brakes, I would think early 90's models would be just as good as ultegra 6600 now, though possibly heavier. I can't see any real reason to upgrade. Once you get the newer pad holders, you should be able to just keep buying dura-type pads and you'll be set for another decade to come, as long as the springs hold out till then.

thirdin77

Are you dissatisfied with your stopping power? Your modulation? If no on both counts, I think your current calipers are fine.

I guess the only pre-purchase comparison you could do is to test ride a bike with newer/higher-level calipers.

urbanknight

Just the color, really
I'll keep them.

frpax

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

ridethecliche

Get the kool stops, see if that helps (it will, i just moved to them too). If it doesn't help, then think of the brakes.

urbanknight

The funny thing is, it's not even a matter of "helping" anything. I don't really have any problems with the braking, but I need new pads because the old ones are worn. I just figured while I was at it, I might as well buy a decent set of pads.

ridethecliche

Having ridden old brakes, and newer brakes, I'll say that the biggest difference is in the ease of setup and adjustment.

I threw away my stock shimano pads, they ate some metal and were seriously messing with my rims. I threw on the salmons before the first race of the season, and they were wonderful. No scratchy sounds while braking, and no nonsense. Just pure stopping power.

Geordi Laforge

$16.95 each here: https://www.biketiresdirect.com/pkshd...der_set/pp.htm

DArthurBrown

I looked into upgrading my calipers a couple weeks ago. My conclusion was that it just wasn't worth it, and I've got the generic Tektro whatchamacallits. The pads are not great, and I replaced those, but my brakes work very effectively--I can lock up the back tire if I try hard enough, so there isn't much reason for me to drop extra cash on them.

I've also learned to obey the first law of mechanical replacement.

1) A mechanical part shall not be replaced unless it is broken, or is in someway deficient so as the user or connected mechanical parts may become broken.

Sapling

Amazing how a new set of brake CABLES & HOUSINGS will improve braking performance & feel...just thought I'd throw that in there.

Geordi Laforge

do you have a recommendation on cables & housing?

urbanknight

Hence my comment that it was about $35 for a full set