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  1. #226
    cyclepath daredevil's Avatar
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    If somebody actually thinks that a mirror compensates for skills as mentioned earlier, they are simply an idiot but again, we would be talking about the user, not the device. Don't condemn or consider how useful a mirror is based on some moron's inability to know how to use it properly and effectively.

    Personally, it's my belief that a person's comfort level with or without a mirror on a bike is directly related to their driving skills. Just my humble opinion. Go ahead, flame me.

    I do understand roadies that wear full kit and actually get some speed up out there not wearing mirrors for any reason though. I can excuse that for sure.

    side note: with my help we got this sucker to 10 pages! Sorry.
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  2. #227
    Senior Member tntyz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil View Post
    If somebody actually thinks that a mirror compensates for skills as mentioned earlier, they are simply an idiot but again, we would be talking about the user, not the device. Don't condemn or consider how useful a mirror is based on some moron's inability to know how to use it properly and effectively.
    I'm not sure if this statement applies to me - help me understand. I'm the guy who physically cannot turn around far enough to see deriectly behind me. It's not a skill issue, it's a physical limitation of my old and stiff body.

    Am I an idiot for compensating by using a mirror? Guess I better sell the bike and take up yoga.

  3. #228
    cyclepath daredevil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tntyz View Post
    I'm not sure if this statement applies to me - help me understand. I'm the guy who physically cannot turn around far enough to see deriectly behind me. It's not a skill issue, it's a physical limitation of my old and stiff body.

    Am I an idiot for compensating by using a mirror? Guess I better sell the bike and take up yoga.
    No it doesn't apply to you but you seem to be giving me crap anyway. You have physical limitations and I was talking about skills.

    Besides, if you've been paying attention, I am clearly an advocate for mirrors.
    Last edited by daredevil; 09-05-09 at 08:04 AM.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "Without music, life would be a mistake."
    -- Friedrich Nietzsche

  4. #229
    Senior Member Nachoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil View Post
    If somebody actually thinks that a mirror compensates for skills as mentioned earlier, they are simply an idiot but again, we would be talking about the user, not the device. Don't condemn or consider how useful a mirror is based on some moron's inability to know how to use it properly and effectively.
    Personally, it's my belief that a person's comfort level with or without a mirror on a bike is directly related to their driving skills. Just my humble opinion. Go ahead, flame me.

    I do understand roadies that wear full kit and actually get some speed up out there not wearing mirrors for any reason though. I can excuse that for sure.

    side note: with my help we got this sucker to 10 pages! Sorry
    .
    Interesting theory. I wonder if we can expand on this. My son is an excellent cyclist. He is careful and super aware of his surroundings. Under this theory, when he gets a drivers license, do you think he'll be an excellent driver too?
    .
    .

    Two wheels good. Four wheels bad.

  5. #230
    Senior Member tntyz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil View Post
    No it doesn't apply to you but you seem to be giving me crap anyway. You have physical limitations and I was talking about skills.

    Besides, if you've been paying attention, I am clearly an advocate for mirrors.
    Whew, I feel better now! Think I'll go ride some.

  6. #231
    Cold Rain and Snow Hot Potato's Avatar
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    Funny thread.

    I use the Mirrycle road mirror. Its purpose is to let me monitor the road behind me periodically. On the many desolate roads I ride, I can see the traffic before I hear it and make adjustments. With no traffic around, why not take the middle of your lane? With wind noise, cars can get close enough to me to have to slow before I hear them and move over, and I don't want to be looking over my shoulder constantly when I usually have the road to myself.

    But mostly it is of benefit when I am zooming down a road with cars intermittently parked on the right. I can see the gaps is passing traffic and time my arrival at the parked cars to coincide with a traffic gap, facilitating a smooth and easy lane taking after a glance over the shoulder. When I don't have the luxury of timing my zip past the parked cars with a gap in passing traffic, there is often one jerk in passing traffic that will cut it too close. The mirror doesn't cure the jerk problem, but all those times I can time my lane taking for my convenience and the convenience of the auto traffic makes life easier. And using a mirror is easier than contantly turning around.

    So just admit it, you are just afraid of looking dorky with a mirror and getting ridiculed, so you come up with rationalizations about what a mirror does not do to justify not using one.
    Quietly elevating being dropped to an art form

  7. #232
    umd
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Potato View Post
    So just admit it, you are just afraid of looking dorky with a mirror and getting ridiculed, so you come up with rationalizations about what a mirror does not do to justify not using one.
    Incorrect

  8. #233
    Still can't climb
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Potato View Post
    So just admit it, you are just afraid of looking dorky with a mirror and getting ridiculed, so you come up with rationalizations about what a mirror does not do to justify not using one.

    i don't blame you for not looking back through this long thread, but it started because i tried to use a mirror having never used one before. so concerns about looks played no part.
    See? You are a mack daddy Coasting.....quote hannahmontana
    Coasting, you are a mack daddy and a genius....quote Serendipper

  9. #234
    cyclepath daredevil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nachoman View Post
    Interesting theory. I wonder if we can expand on this. My son is an excellent cyclist. He is careful and super aware of his surroundings. Under this theory, when he gets a drivers license, do you think he'll be an excellent driver too?
    I think that being out in traffic and learning rules of the road prior to getting a license most definitely will help his driving skills when the time comes.

    Even more important than that however will be his attitude and maturity level.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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  10. #235
    Cold Rain and Snow Hot Potato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by coasting View Post
    i don't blame you for not looking back through this long thread, but it started because i tried to use a mirror having never used one before. so concerns about looks played no part.
    You tellling me your OP was not trolling?

    OK, then please re-try the whole handlebar mirror thing. Adjust it so that it points in the most likely place you want to see while you are riding. This time when you look at the mirror, realize it only lets you see where it is pointed. If you need to see somewhere else, turn your HEAD and look there, do not turn the handlebar. The mirror is only a convenience tool for easy viewing to that area you pre-selected, it accomplishes nothing more, and is not a substitute for looking with your eyes when changing your lane position or direction.
    Quietly elevating being dropped to an art form

  11. #236
    umd
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Potato View Post
    You tellling me your OP was not trolling?
    Coasting isn't the brightest bulb, but he's not a troll...

  12. #237
    Long-time Curmudgeon DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carbon Unit View Post
    I would much rather look like a Fred and be alive than to look cool and be dead.
    Are you suggesting that not riding with a helmet mirror is a DEADLY practice? Seriously?
    "Unless he was racing there was no way he could match my speed."

  13. #238
    Still can't climb
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    Quote Originally Posted by umd View Post
    Coasting isn't the brightest bulb, but he's not a troll...

    that is 2 free hits i'll give you. next one and i'm going to smack you.
    See? You are a mack daddy Coasting.....quote hannahmontana
    Coasting, you are a mack daddy and a genius....quote Serendipper

  14. #239
    Still can't climb
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Potato View Post
    You tellling me your OP was not trolling?

    OK, then please re-try the whole handlebar mirror thing. Adjust it so that it points in the most likely place you want to see while you are riding. This time when you look at the mirror, realize it only lets you see where it is pointed. If you need to see somewhere else, turn your HEAD and look there, do not turn the handlebar. The mirror is only a convenience tool for easy viewing to that area you pre-selected, it accomplishes nothing more, and is not a substitute for looking with your eyes when changing your lane position or direction.

    Actually i just thought i would give a first impression of trying a mirror. i didn't think there would be such heated debate. i'm a bit surprised actually. if only i could actually troll as successfully.
    See? You are a mack daddy Coasting.....quote hannahmontana
    Coasting, you are a mack daddy and a genius....quote Serendipper

  15. #240
    Galveston County Texas 10 Wheels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by coasting View Post
    Actually i just thought i would give a first impression of trying a mirror. i didn't think there would be such heated debate. i'm a bit surprised actually. if only i could actually troll as successfully.
    You got the Racer Boys excited. They get disgusted when they loose a race and vent on the unaware.
    [SIZE=1][B]What I like about Texas[/B]
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  16. #241
    cyclepath daredevil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Potato View Post
    not a substitute for looking with your eyes when changing your lane position or direction.
    Actually, since it's a helmet/head mounted object, there is no blind spot as in a vehicle so a head check really isn't necessary. A person may turn around anyway out of habit or as a redundant safety move, but it's not required.

    edit: wait, you were talking about a bar mount weren't you? Not paying attention. Oh well, I guess that just points out the limitations of that style of bike mirror.
    Last edited by daredevil; 09-05-09 at 05:06 PM.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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  17. #242
    Long-time Curmudgeon DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil View Post
    Actually, since it's a helmet/head mounted object, there is no blind spot as in a vehicle so a head check really isn't necessary. A person may turn around anyway out of habit or as a redundant safety move, but it's not required.

    edit: wait, you were talking about a bar mount weren't you? Oh well, I guess that just points out the limitations of that style of bike mirror.
    Riding with a mirror... A true daredevil.
    "Unless he was racing there was no way he could match my speed."

  18. #243
    cyclepath daredevil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete View Post
    Riding with a mirror... A true daredevil.
    If you knew me, you would see the name does not fit. I'm no wimp (wanted to say something else but it's blocked ) or nothing but it was given to me by some friends based on another activity I do as a joke.

    You're kinda late to the party Doc.
    Last edited by daredevil; 09-05-09 at 05:11 PM.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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    -- Friedrich Nietzsche

  19. #244
    Cold Rain and Snow Hot Potato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil View Post
    Actually, since it's a helmet/head mounted object, there is no blind spot as in a vehicle so a head check really isn't necessary. A person may turn around anyway out of habit or as a redundant safety move, but it's not required.

    edit: wait, you were talking about a bar mount weren't you? Not paying attention. Oh well, I guess that just points out the limitations of that style of bike mirror.
    Yeah, I made sure I was specific about that. I used a head mounted mirror years ago. Then when I started cycling again, I just could not get that type to work well for me. Aging eyes changed where I could look with clarity and comfort. Aging eyes also made looking over my shoulder less effective as well, and progressive lenses distort peripheral vision. Not to complain about aging, I never want to stop, but a mirror is a nice convenience. Certainly not a danger, unless you happen to impale yourself by crashing on it.
    Quietly elevating being dropped to an art form

  20. #245
    Long-time Curmudgeon DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil View Post
    If you knew me, you would see the name does not fit. I'm no wimp (wanted to say something else but it's blocked ) or nothing but it was given to me by some friends based on another activity I do as a joke.

    You're kinda late to the party Doc.
    I was just pullin' your leg...

    Yeah, I'm late to the party--work's been crazy lately and this is the first day in almost 3 weeks I've had some time to kill.
    "Unless he was racing there was no way he could match my speed."

  21. #246
    Senior Member ls01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsuru View Post
    So, again...... no one wants to answer this I guess..... WHEN, with your super-awareness do you dive for the ditch????? You see 'em coming, better than me apparently, so WHEN DO YOU DIVE?
    The reason to use the mirror is to keep your situational awareness updated constantly, that way when a situation arrises you are already prepared and move yourself out of harms way before it's time to take the flyer into the ditch. Using a helmet mirror ( what I am acustomed too) is no different than the habbit you form when driving a car or motor cycle. Your eyes automaticly flick upward and take a brief glimps of the mirror, you are not focusing and concentrating on the happenings in the mirror, you are checking for things out of the ordinary, most times things will grab your attention if they warrant it. Same as driving a car. Most of us check our mirror unconciously, and dont even realize we are doing it until something in the mirror sets off the alarm bell.
    Now the reason a mirror works for me is its faster for me to get a 6 check in the mirror than it is to try and turn my head and neck enough to get a good sight picture of what is behind me.I am 46 years old and flexable I am not, heck before I started using a mirror I was so concerned about holding my line thaton some of my stiffer days by the time I had turned and looked back and faced front again I couldnt remember what i had seen. I agree that if you are still flexable enough to turn and look it is probably better than my looking in a mirror, however I can take a look in my mirror just by flicking my eyes up and to the left. What's that take a 1/4 of a second. I still turn before any major manoovers. But in Michigan where I ride people in cars make great sport of trying to scare you out of your lycra by blasting the horn just as they pass you. or crowding you off the road or my personal favorite is the right hook while yelling "get on the sidewalk".
    Are they a perfect solution, certainly not. But they do contribute to a larger overall picture of what is going on behind me.
    The final thing that I would like to point out is periphrial vision. when you turn your head to look behind you, no matter how fast you do it, for just that long you are not facing the direction of travel. so if something does happen in front of you you will never see it. Now when I use my mirror to look behind me I still am facing forward and myperiphrial vision is still working for me. If something should happen in front of me while I am looking in the mirror, my periphrial vision should alert me to that. Same thing with the mirror, I have noticed many times that my periphrial vision alerts me to movement in the mirror and thus a quick check tells me if I need to focus on this object or not.

  22. #247
    umd
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10 Wheels View Post
    You got the Racer Boys excited. They get disgusted when they loose a race and vent on the unaware.
    You don't make any sense old man

  23. #248
    Has coddling tendencies. KiddSisko's Avatar
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    Many years ago when all I pedaled was a steel vintage bike on LA city streets, I used a sunglass attached mirror and can honestly say it was very useful. Now that I'm all CF roadie'd up, I've yet to use one. I still have that mirror (in a box somewhere), and may try it for the comparison.

  24. #249
    Senior Member bikeideas's Avatar
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    messengermirrordotcom

  25. #250
    Long-time Curmudgeon DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeideas View Post
    Yeah, that would impale nicely in a crash... No thanks.
    "Unless he was racing there was no way he could match my speed."

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