I just witnessed a cyclist die after being hit by a car.
01-18-10, 01:25 PM
#126
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No punishment for disagreeing.
However, BF is not the place to post this guy's FB or MySpace. The link to his booking is in this thread (several times) and if you can log onto BF you can log onto those sites as well.
Step back and give it a moment's thought and I'm sure you'll realize why BF doesn't want to facilitate the sort of stuff that is probably getting sent to this guy.
I made this a public reply instead of a PM as more than one person is interested.
I can understand being mad. I'm mad but BF isn't the vehicle to express your outrage directly to this guy.
However, BF is not the place to post this guy's FB or MySpace. The link to his booking is in this thread (several times) and if you can log onto BF you can log onto those sites as well.
Step back and give it a moment's thought and I'm sure you'll realize why BF doesn't want to facilitate the sort of stuff that is probably getting sent to this guy.
I made this a public reply instead of a PM as more than one person is interested.
I can understand being mad. I'm mad but BF isn't the vehicle to express your outrage directly to this guy.
Nor to foment some sort of vigilante justice!
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01-18-10, 01:27 PM
#127
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I am sure they can handle a few "crazy" Idiots, after all they are every where nowadays. As to the people with influence I don't see them doing much about it nor riding a bicycle to truly understand the problem and to find a solution which must start with EDUCATION & RESPECT for bicycles!!!!!!
I myself have been hit twice by cars RIDING ON THE BIKE LANE.
I myself have been hit twice by cars RIDING ON THE BIKE LANE.
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Last edited by Homebrew01; 01-18-10 at 01:36 PM.
01-18-10, 01:37 PM
#128
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Bond is now 100,000.00. I have mixed feelings about this...
On one hand I hope that they crucify him as a deterrent to those that act so immaturely and selfishly....
On the other hand, that could be any one. Clearly the decision to drink is a voluntary one and complete responsibility lies with yourself. But I am saddened that this person was not surrounded by friends or a support system that would have stopped him from taking the actions he took.
On one hand I hope that they crucify him as a deterrent to those that act so immaturely and selfishly....
On the other hand, that could be any one. Clearly the decision to drink is a voluntary one and complete responsibility lies with yourself. But I am saddened that this person was not surrounded by friends or a support system that would have stopped him from taking the actions he took.
This, though, is different. Leaving the scene, dragging the bike, resisting the police, all of that sets this up as one that needs special attention and a more serious penalty.
If one of my children were killed by a drunk driver, I'd want the guy dismembered slowly with dull gardening tools. That's largely the reason why judges and juries make those decisions, and not the victims' families.
01-18-10, 01:41 PM
#129
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The "No vaid driver's license" entry is odd, but no big deal. If his license had been suspended for something, the entry would say "Driving whiel license suspended," whihc in FL is dfferent than no valid DL. His license might have expired or something like that.
The immigration hold only means that he is not a citizen and immigration needs to determine his status. From the looks of his web page (which is now down), I suspect he is a legal immigrant.
His website had interesting tidbits about his life. He skiied with the Argentine ski team, he was a skydiver, and, interestingly, it said "Carlos' driving record IS NOT clean."
Leaving the scene of an accident involving death is a first-degree felony punishable by up to 30 years. DUI manslaughter is also a first-degree felony. Under the sentencing guidelines, the minimum sentence (that's with no prior record or other sentencing factor) works out to around 11.5 years. Miami has a bit of a reputation of allowing celebrities to by their way out of DUI crimes. Donte Stallworth, the Cleveland Browns receiver, last year killed a guy while driving drunk and got a couple of months in jail and house arrest, and paid an undisclosed settlement to the victim's family. I doubt Carlos has that level of celebrity. Stallworth also stopped and tried to help the victim, and otherwise cooperated fully.
The immigration hold only means that he is not a citizen and immigration needs to determine his status. From the looks of his web page (which is now down), I suspect he is a legal immigrant.
His website had interesting tidbits about his life. He skiied with the Argentine ski team, he was a skydiver, and, interestingly, it said "Carlos' driving record IS NOT clean."
Leaving the scene of an accident involving death is a first-degree felony punishable by up to 30 years. DUI manslaughter is also a first-degree felony. Under the sentencing guidelines, the minimum sentence (that's with no prior record or other sentencing factor) works out to around 11.5 years. Miami has a bit of a reputation of allowing celebrities to by their way out of DUI crimes. Donte Stallworth, the Cleveland Browns receiver, last year killed a guy while driving drunk and got a couple of months in jail and house arrest, and paid an undisclosed settlement to the victim's family. I doubt Carlos has that level of celebrity. Stallworth also stopped and tried to help the victim, and otherwise cooperated fully.
Whether or not Stallworth "got away" with anything is a matter of opinion, but the facts of his case and his behavoir were both markedly different.
The hit-and-run THEN attempting to flee the police THEN resisting arrest is going to make it a lot tougher on Carlos. Especially if he already had a checkered driving history - or worse. And if he gets worse, he will have earned every bit of it.
01-18-10, 01:43 PM
#130
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From my understanding of the Donte Stallworth case, that situation was completely different. The way I read that case, while Stallworth had been drinking, he wasn't speeding, he wasn't violating any other law, the accident happened while it was still dark AND the victim stepped out from in between parked cars right into traffic and in front of Stallworth's vehicle. Also, Stallworth remained on the scene and cooperated fully.
Whether or not Stallworth "got away" with anything is a matter of opinion, but the facts of his case and his behavoir were both markedly different.
The hit-and-run THEN attempting to flee the police THEN resisting arrest is going to make it a lot tougher on Carlos. Especially if he already had a checkered driving history - or worse. And if he gets worse, he will have earned every bit of it.
Whether or not Stallworth "got away" with anything is a matter of opinion, but the facts of his case and his behavoir were both markedly different.
The hit-and-run THEN attempting to flee the police THEN resisting arrest is going to make it a lot tougher on Carlos. Especially if he already had a checkered driving history - or worse. And if he gets worse, he will have earned every bit of it.
01-18-10, 01:44 PM
#131
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I was MAD yesterday, not today (I steped back yesterday). I trust our judicial system. For now, I am about to go out on my bicycle and pay some respect to our friend as I ride the same exact route.
01-18-10, 01:52 PM
#132
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IMO that is a superb tribute and memorial. I'm about 130 miles north of you but I'm hopping on my bike in a few minutes and I plan to give some thought to the victim as well. I never knew him but he was a comrade.
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01-18-10, 02:28 PM
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+1 - Good on you!
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01-18-10, 02:40 PM
#134
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DUI, my penalty schedule:
Conviction 1: 90 days in jail, $25,000 fine.
Conviction 2: 5 years in prison.
Conviction 3: Life in prison without parole.
If you haven't learned by 1 and 2 society needs to be kept safe by 3. It's harsh, but this type of super-aggressive punishment is the only thing that's going to make a difference. DUI affects far more people than just cyclists...it's a societal problem that needs to be fixed, either by scaring the sheeat out of people or simply locking them away.
This has been a hot topic on talk radio here. We recently had one guy up in the northern part of the state get arrested for his 10th+ (I forget the exact double digit number) DUI. Obviously he can't stop and the only way to keep such an individual from driving is to simply put them in prison, permanently, period. Some people on the radio were arguing that it's a lot to expect a impared person to know not to get in the car and drive. B as in B, S as in S. What society should expect is to have the decision to get drunk thought out beforehand. Either you drink and arrange a way home (cab, friend, designated driver), OR YOU DON'T DRINK. How complicated is this?
I say life in prison at the least for this guy...does FL have the death penalty?
Conviction 1: 90 days in jail, $25,000 fine.
Conviction 2: 5 years in prison.
Conviction 3: Life in prison without parole.
If you haven't learned by 1 and 2 society needs to be kept safe by 3. It's harsh, but this type of super-aggressive punishment is the only thing that's going to make a difference. DUI affects far more people than just cyclists...it's a societal problem that needs to be fixed, either by scaring the sheeat out of people or simply locking them away.
This has been a hot topic on talk radio here. We recently had one guy up in the northern part of the state get arrested for his 10th+ (I forget the exact double digit number) DUI. Obviously he can't stop and the only way to keep such an individual from driving is to simply put them in prison, permanently, period. Some people on the radio were arguing that it's a lot to expect a impared person to know not to get in the car and drive. B as in B, S as in S. What society should expect is to have the decision to get drunk thought out beforehand. Either you drink and arrange a way home (cab, friend, designated driver), OR YOU DON'T DRINK. How complicated is this?
I say life in prison at the least for this guy...does FL have the death penalty?
01-18-10, 02:59 PM
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Thank you Randochap. According to NBC Miami the cyclist was riding in the bike lane.
01-18-10, 03:24 PM
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"His album "Times Are Good" was released in September 2008 and currently ranks #104,617 in MP3 albums downloaded."
Might have a little trouble making bail with those royalty payments.
01-18-10, 03:32 PM
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I passed by a few minutes after you probably arrived. Since 15-20 riders where stopped, I headed out to look for the car ASAP.
You should be commended for helping this gentleman. I was very sad to hear he died on scene waiting for help! It could have been any of us. So sad.
You should be commended for helping this gentleman. I was very sad to hear he died on scene waiting for help! It could have been any of us. So sad.
01-18-10, 03:33 PM
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01-18-10, 03:39 PM
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01-18-10, 03:48 PM
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There is photograph of the cyclist bleeding to death on the bridge. There is a helmet on the ground next to him.
01-18-10, 04:08 PM
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Wow, this clown has a RIDICULOUSLY long rapsheet already.
https://www2.miami-dadeclerk.com/Traf...px?menu=public
search for the below
Defendant name - carlos bertonatti; DOB - 2/11/1981; Gender - M
He's listed under two different names.
Running toll booths, Parking Permit Fraud, expired registration, no insurance, improper lane usage, no DL carried, a few Driving While License Suspended, running red lights, 10 speeding tickets, running stop signs, improper u-turns, etc.
He has 43 moving violations!
Incredible. I can't believe he still has a license at all. They keep taking it away, then he still drives, they catch him, they slap him on the wrist and give it back. Then he gets it taken again.
He should get life in prison, considering the prior convictions.
But he won't, he'll get 6 months.
https://www2.miami-dadeclerk.com/Traf...px?menu=public
search for the below
Defendant name - carlos bertonatti; DOB - 2/11/1981; Gender - M
He's listed under two different names.
Running toll booths, Parking Permit Fraud, expired registration, no insurance, improper lane usage, no DL carried, a few Driving While License Suspended, running red lights, 10 speeding tickets, running stop signs, improper u-turns, etc.
He has 43 moving violations!
Incredible. I can't believe he still has a license at all. They keep taking it away, then he still drives, they catch him, they slap him on the wrist and give it back. Then he gets it taken again.
He should get life in prison, considering the prior convictions.
But he won't, he'll get 6 months.
01-18-10, 04:47 PM
#147
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Wow, this clown has a RIDICULOUSLY long rapsheet already.
https://www2.miami-dadeclerk.com/Traf...px?menu=public
search for the below
Defendant name - carlos bertonatti; DOB - 2/11/1981; Gender - M
He's listed under two different names.
Running toll booths, Parking Permit Fraud, expired registration, no insurance, improper lane usage, no DL carried, a few Driving While License Suspended, running red lights, 10 speeding tickets, running stop signs, improper u-turns, etc.
He has 43 moving violations!
Incredible. I can't believe he still has a license at all. They keep taking it away, then he still drives, they catch him, they slap him on the wrist and give it back. Then he gets it taken again.
He should get life in prison, considering the prior convictions.
But he won't, he'll get 6 months.
https://www2.miami-dadeclerk.com/Traf...px?menu=public
search for the below
Defendant name - carlos bertonatti; DOB - 2/11/1981; Gender - M
He's listed under two different names.
Running toll booths, Parking Permit Fraud, expired registration, no insurance, improper lane usage, no DL carried, a few Driving While License Suspended, running red lights, 10 speeding tickets, running stop signs, improper u-turns, etc.
He has 43 moving violations!
Incredible. I can't believe he still has a license at all. They keep taking it away, then he still drives, they catch him, they slap him on the wrist and give it back. Then he gets it taken again.
He should get life in prison, considering the prior convictions.
But he won't, he'll get 6 months.
This Carlos bertonatti guy was an accident waiting to happen. Now some innocent guy is dead.
It is a frigging shame really.
01-18-10, 05:25 PM
#148
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This is extremely sad and frightening. Does anyone know if the victim was cycling by himself or was he in a group? It certainly sounds like there were a number of other riders close by but I wasn't sure if he was riding with others.
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01-18-10, 05:34 PM
#149
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I understand from something I read on a different forum that he was riding alone without identification, which is why it took a while to identify him and release his name.
01-18-10, 05:45 PM
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The victims name has been published by the Miami Herald. However, I believe they have misspelled the name. Since by BF rules we are not allowed to publish names, I will not. If you know some french, just make the logical corrections to published name, and you will be able to find him. Here is a quote from what I believe is his personal site:
"I was born in Perigord (Where is this ?.....) have lived in Irak, Algeria, Norway, and the U.S. since 1992. I have travelled the 5 continents and can't wait for the next trip and adventure !"
Obviously, a person full of life. I hope he is having a great adventure in heaven.
"I was born in Perigord (Where is this ?.....) have lived in Irak, Algeria, Norway, and the U.S. since 1992. I have travelled the 5 continents and can't wait for the next trip and adventure !"
Obviously, a person full of life. I hope he is having a great adventure in heaven.
Last edited by Nils; 01-18-10 at 05:51 PM.