Treefrog3105

I need some help please.

I am looking at ordering a new Trek WSD, probably a 2.1 or a Pilot 2.1 but I am confused as to which frame size to get. I am 5’4”. The dealer suggested a 52 cm.

I have two older road bikes right now. The one I ride the most is too big for me. It has a 31.5 standover, 22” tube length. I can straddle the tube when standing, but just barely and I am stretched out too far.

The other bike is an older Georgina Terry. I am not sure of the frame size but the standover (28.75”) and tube length (19.5”) are almost identical to the 52 cm Trek 2.1 WSD. I have a good 2” clearance on the standover. The wheelbase on the Terry is 1” shorter than the Trek. When I first started riding this bike, I felt like I was too “hunched up”. My knees would come up and hit my arms and when I was on the drops, my forearms pushed up against the top bar. I added a longer stem and that took care of those problems but it puts me out over the front wheel too far and the bike is very unstable.

I have done a lot of research on bike forums and the Trek website, and they state that for someone my size I should be looking at a 47 or 50 cm frame. I am not sure that I want to buy a 52 cm bike considering that it is the same size as my Terry, let alone a 47 or 50. Am I missing something?

soliver

Hi there! I've got a bike which was custom made and its 52cm and I'm 5'8''. After that first road bike I have always choosen the same size for all road bikes I then adquire for racing.
I don't think you will be comfortable on that size. Avoid purchasing at a first sight, first try to figure out what's your size according to what says a real advisor. Based on my experience I think you should try 48cm, otherwise go to a specialize custom frames builder and let the guy advise you once you ride the prototype they have in their factory (simulate your going to buy a frame
Cheers.

TrojanHorse

What prompted the dealer to suggest a 52? Was it a guess or did he fit you? If he had you throw a leg over the top tube and check for clearance, just leave.

Find a dealer that will fit you, there are so many other things to worry about besides the seat tube dimension or stand-over height. That's supposed to be one big advantage of buying a bike from your LBS rather than the internet, so don't miss out!

Velo Dog

So you're saying to find a custom frame builder, a guy who's probably just getting by or working another job to pay for his bike-building habit, lie to him about your intentions, take up a bunch of his time and get the benefit of his expertise, then just walk out and buy the bike somewhere else? Nice.

invwnut

The bike shop is trying to sell you something too big. They give you the general crap about we can change out the stem and seatpost.....blah blah blah. I had the same thing happen to me in every bike shop I went to. Small frames for shorter people are just not in demand. They would rather sell you what they have on the floor instead of ordering the correct size for you. I ride anywhere from a 46cm to about a 50cm. I'm 5'5" and proportional. I know a person who is on a 52cm Scott and she is 5'3" and proportional. They swear it fits her even after their fitter put her through the paces. I still think her bike is too big.

mtnroadie

I ride a 52cm. Like Soliver I am 5'8. There is a good chance that your lbs doesn't have your size in stock. If they are worth dealing with, they will do what it takes to get the correct size for you. If they're trying to sell you something, just because they have it in stock, walk out the door and don't look back.

DaveSSS 

Do yourself a favor and ignore frame size numbers. Concentrate on the numbers that affect your position. Companies like Trek, Cervelo and C'dale all list the reach and stack values that tell you almost everything you need. The only thing missing is the seat tube angle, that affects how far back the saddle can be moved and how much seatpost setback you might need. If there are no reach and stack values, you have to rely on the next best thing - TT length and seat tbue angle work together to define the reach. The head tube length, with the headset, can be used to compare the approximate vertical stack, but watch for significant differences in the BB drop. More BB drop reduces the required head tube length.

You could probably benefit from a preofessional fitting - not a bike shop guy trying to sell you whatever bike he has on the shop floor.

A fitting always starts with setting the saddle height and setback and that's where the first mistake usually occurs. A plumb bob is used align the knee over the pedal. That's OK as a starting point, but not something magical that can't be changed for the better. Quite often, a further back position is more desirable, to minimize the weight on your hand and achieve a better balance over the saddle.

When trying to communicate your fit, post you acutal saddle height, measured along the seat post centerline, the saddle to bar drop, the amount that your saddle nose is setback from the BB centerline and the diagonal distance from the saddle tip to the center of your handle bars.

Never expect to just get on a bike and have the proper stem length or handlebar height. Those both have a lot of possible adjustment.

Big_Red

As long as you can stand over the 52 without being off the ground or on tip toe, I would be more concerned about the reach. A quick and dirty method to get you in the ball park is to have the shop set the seat height and setback as DaveSSS says and then put your elbow against the tip of the saddle and see where your fingers land with respect to the middle of the bars. Usually your fit will end up a couple of cm's longer than your finger tips. This does not replace a good fitting, but at least you can check if the frame is even close.

DaveSSS 

My fingertips are about 6cm short of reaching the bars. That's a worthless check, IMO. It does not take into account torso length. Mine's quite short, but a long torsoed rider should have even more distance from finger tip to bars.

Big_Red

Again, the arm thing will only get you a quick idea if the frame is close. Anywhere from 2-8 cm can usually be adjusted with a change in stem. Not a replacement for a more detailed fit, but might be enough for the OP to decide on the advice given by the shop.

Phiberglass

Check out the competitive cyclist fit calculator, that should give you a good idea on what to compare your fit to frame specs. Make sure another person or two helps you out with it though.

DaveSSS 

The competitive cyclist fit calculator is also close to worthless. It suggests no seat tube angle and no specific head tube length. A TT length without a STA to go with it is meaningless. It gives a wide range of possible saddle setbacks, but no info on how to convert that information to a STA and seatpost setback. It gives suggestions for such a broad range of fits, you could select any of three frames sizes and produce one of the suggested fits.

Treefrog3105

Thanks everyone. I was out of town for the weekend so I didn't respond to your answers. I would like to comment about a couple of things. The bike shop I went to is a small shop in a small town but the owner seemed very knowledable. He only had 5 road bikes in his shop and they were all larger. The smallest he had was a 56cm frame - he set it up in a trainer for me but did not take any measurements - he just stood back and had me peddle for a short time. He did say if I ordered a bike and it didn't fit me right I wouldn't have to buy it.
I certainly don't doubt when people say I should go smaller. I just don't understand. I can't imagine going smaller than my Terry. While sitting on it today, I tried Big Reds measuring my elbow against the seat suggestion above and my finger tips are 2.5 cm from the bars. I dropped a line from my knee when it was in line with the crank and it falls almost 2" past the pedal spindle. When my knees are at the top of their stroke, they come within a couple of inches of the stem. My saddle is set as far back as it will go. Doesn't that seem too small? Maybe the geometry has changed quite a bit since the late 80's when my Terry was made.
Thanks for everyones input!
Kim

Cat4Lifer

I'm 5'8" and ride a 54 c-t frame...
52 c-t frame for someone 5'4" does sound a bit too big, to me.

DaveSSS 

If you drop a plumb bob from your knee, be sure that the bike is sitting on a level floor, not a sloped garage floor. The bike must be sitting level for an accurate measurement. The easiest method is to drop the line from the very front of the knee to the end of the crank arm, as most-forward position. It's nothing but a starting point that is often too far forward.

If your knee is well ahead of crank arm, with the saddle all the way back, it means that the seat tube angle is too steep and/or the seatpost has too little setback. A lot of people make the mistake of buying nonsetback seatposts. Frame size has no effect on the saddle fore/aft position, since the saddle height should be the same on any frame. Smaller frames may have steeper STAs, but that depends on the brand. You may find that most brands have a 75-76 degree STA in your size.

Posting your acutal saddle height would be helpful. That would indicate whether you have long or short legs for your height.

Treefrog3105

My saddle height is 36"

I traveled a little further from home to a large shop today. The salesman took some measurements and said I would need a 50 to 52 cm depending on the model of bike. I road a couple - a Trek 1.5 WSD 50 and a Specialized Dolce Elite Compact 51. Both felt comfortable enough but the Specialized actually seemed a little smaller to me. The salesman thought my form looked better on the Specialized. I am going to try another shop this weekend and hopefully they will have at least one smaller that I can try.
Thanks everyone.

sygyzy

Just curious, what does posting her current saddle height tell you if she's been using the wrong height all along? I am not saying she is, but her saddle position could be incorrect, right?