ballistic

I rode a 2010 Giant Defy 3 about two weeks ago, and I just got back from riding a 2010 61cm Felt Z85. The Defy 1 costs more, but it also has a better crank and better wheels. But I didn't ride a Defy 1 because no one stocks one.

Defy 1 (105)
Rode a L (~55.5cm) Defy 3, but I'm guessing the Defy 1 only gets better. Nice bike. Nice frame. So-so color scheme. Saddle was pretty good (hopefully the Defy 1's is better). Better crank and wheels than the Z85. LBS quoted me $1250.

Z85 (105)
Rode a 61cm frame. Slick design. Not into the red tires, but tires will be changed eventually. Great color scheme. Saddle could be better, but I could probably get used to it for now. Lower-end wheels and crank compared to the Defy 1.

How significantly different is the FSA Gossamer MegaExo over the VERO Compact?


Unfortunately, the Felt reseller checked Felt's stock and said there aren't any more Z85s (of any size), and that I'll have to wait until June for the 2011 models. There's another Felt dealer in my area according to the Felt website, but the dealer's website doesn't list Felt at all.

The Z85 is $1150, and the Giant dealer quoted me $1250 ($1335 with tax) for the Defy 1. I suppose the better crank and wheels are worth $100+, but I'm not really looking to spend over $1300, especially knowing I'd still have to buy pedals and other accessories.

With both bikes I rode, I felt like I needed a shorter stem. I'm sure both shops could hook me up. The Felt dealer charges $150 for a thorough fitting ($100 goes towards the price of a bike if you buy from them). I really don't want to spend an extra $50. I really like the Felt, both for its look and somewhat cheaper price. But I have to wait until June.

I don't know what to do.

helmut

Vero compact is crappy because of the bottom bracket. The MegaExo BB on the Gossamer is a whole lot stiffer. I had a Vero on my OCR3 and I rode my buddy's Defy 1 with the Mega Exo and it is astoundingly different in the amount of flex. For that reason alone, I would go with the Giant. You won't be disappointed by the Defy. Charging you money for the initial fit is kind of a dick move too. Most dealers I've experienced will fit you for free and swap out your stem with a comparable one for no charge. So then the Felt is only $50 cheaper with crappier wheels and BB and you have to wait for months.

ballistic

Very good points. Another plus for the Defy 1 is that the Giant dealer is like five minutes from me.

atmdad

At the Felt dealer did they quote you the same $1150 price for the '11 model that you have to wait until June for?

Is waiting until June/July and lost ride time on a new bike that you will never get back worth $100?

How soon can the Giant dealer get the Defy 1 in for you?

ballistic

He didn't say specifically that the '11 would be the same price. I asked if he knew if there were any changes. He casually said it'd be the same price level, so I imagine they'd be the same.

I don't want to lose over a month of the warm weather, but the Felt is cheaper. I can't really say which frame I like more. I was happy with both. I just wish I could ride a Defy 1 first.

The Giant dealer never said anything about low stock or possible empty stock. Maybe Giant didn't scale back inventory like Felt did. He went over to his computer, looked it up, and gave me a quote. I have to assume he can order it right away if I asked him to.

ballistic

Giant dealer said it would be 3-4 days depending on which warehouse it comes from. But he'd still have to call to check stock given the time of year. He said $1250 + tax (so $1335), but I think I got him to toss in some free pedals. I just have to figure out which frame I should get so he can check availability. I was told that Giant's measurements may not be accurate, but what about Felt's? I rode a L Giant and a 61cm Felt. But what did I really ride then?

The Felt dealer doesn't come down from MSRP, but they give you a free water bottle and cage, free 30-day inspection/tune-up, and then a free 1-year tune-up. Maybe I could even schmooze some pedals too. Trouble is, they're 20 miles away. But if the VERO Compact really is kind of shoddy, that sort of kills the bike for me. I've seen the Gossamer MegaExo for sale for about $120+.

helmut

Well, ride a Defy 2 or 3 in your size, which it sounds like you did. The geo and fit are going to be the exact same on the Defy 1. You might be able to ride a Defy Advanced even to get the sizing right (although this may lead you to buying a $3000 bike, so beware). Once you've determined your size, order the Defy 1 in that size and in whichever color you want.

As for the free water bottle and cage and those tuneups, that is literally the least they can do. My bike store threw in the bottles and cages and free tuneups for LIFE including wheel truing, drivetrain and brake adjustments. And they took $400 off MSRP on a closeout model. So let's go over this again...

Felt
Pros: $50 cheaper, free $2 bottle and $3 cages.
Cons: crappy flexy BB, have to wait months, 20 miles away, no budging from MSRP.

Giant:
Pros: MegaExo BB, 3-4 day delivery, free pedals, shop discount already applied from MSRP, shop is 5 miles away.
Cons: $50 more expensive.

Seriously still considering this? Go order the Defy already!!

njkayaker

Penny wise, pound foolish. It makes no sense risking picking the wrong bike for no real difference in cost.

ballistic

I don't have to get the $50/$150 fitting though. The actual difference is about $106. But that's still less than if I were to buy better wheels and crank for the Z85.

Sucks that the Felt looks so nice. It really is a sweet-looking bike.

njkayaker

The OP said it was a "thorough fit" (presumably, some sort of "pro" fit). It doesn't appear that he's talking about an"initial [basic] fit". I'd guess that the dealer isn't any different than the "most dealers" you are talking about with respect to "basic" fitting.

ballistic

The expensive fit is a two-hour session where you're supposedly pedaling on the mounted bike for 45 minutes. Sounds like your "pro fit."

The Giant dealer is a small shop. The owner is probably the only employee. He's also the closest to me, and he's been in business for four, five, maybe six years or longer. I'll maybe head in Saturday after class to have him fit me on the Large Defy 3 and figure out what to order.

atmdad

Damn, that sounds awfully familiar


Anyways, go with the Defy 1, you'll be happy with it.

ballistic

The Giant dealer said $1250 when I visited him a couple weeks ago. On the phone today, he said $1300 + tax, to which I said, "You told me $1250 when I was in there a couple weeks ago." So then he said, "Okay. If it isn't American Express, I can do $1250 + tax." I said I could do VISA, or even cash. I asked if cash would get me a better price, and he said no, that the $1250 minimum is recommended by Giant.

Eh?

njkayaker

Meh.

You are quibbling over a few dollars. If you can't afford it, don't buy it.

Your worrying over a few pennies isn't really that compelling to other people here.

Be an adult and buy a bike already!!

ballistic

Your posts in my threads aren't that compelling.

njkayaker

Since you are asking people spend their own time to help you (for nothing), you really want to try to be somewhat compelling!

Complaining about $50 on a $1300 bike seems a bit trivial, no?

Camilo

$50 - $100 should NOT be your decision point. Yes, it's real money, but the whole "package" is more important. Remember, fit, service, convenience, immediate gratification are all worth real value. The component package on the Giant seems to be worth the price increase, but it seems the other factors greatly reduce that difference (in favor of the Giant).

Now, the looks of the bike are important too, so weigh that. But don't let $100 (probably more like $50) be the main factor.

It really sounds to me like you want the Felt and are using the (very sliight) price advantage to rationalize it. If so, just strike a firm deal with the seller and wait until June to get it.

Or talk the Giant dealer down $50 and get rid of that in your mind.

joe_5700

Does the Defy1 come in a compact double? That triple would be a deal breaker for me.

ballistic

Why are we throwing around $50 so much? It's not $50. The difference is $100, as I'm not getting the pro fit. I'm not spending two hours getting a super-exact fitting.

I like the Felt because it looks better and is cheaper, but it also comes with two cheaper components. Is a Triple really that bad? Even for my first real bike?

njkayaker

$50 or $100, it still isn't any thing to base buying a $1300 bike on.

Buy the best bike since the prices of each are basically the same.

If $100 is really a big deal, you are spending more than you can afford. The $100 isn't really interesting to anybody else. (If it's interesting to you, that's your choice.)

A triple gives 1-2 (maybe 3) lower gears. If you need the lower gears, then you need a triple. If you don't, a compact double shifts a little bit better. If you don't have hills, you probably don't need a triple.

Many people use triples and the world doesn't end for them.

njkayaker

Useless comment because it doesn't explain anything.

ballistic

Let me be the judge of my money, okay?

njkayaker

You are free to do what ever you want! No one is suggesting otherwise!

If you are that concerned about what people say, don't go on about it in a public forum.

Thinking that other people are really going to care about that trivial amount is odd.

It would be not very smart to buy the wrong bike to save $100!

Don't be so helpless!

ballistic

I'm not concerned. What I'm concerned with is how over-the-top you are.

helmut

You are rapidly becoming too annoying to consider helping any more.