RoboIsGod

I'm entertaining the idea of building up a steel frame for racing purposes. A friend of mine builds bikes and offered to build me up something at a good price, but I was also looking at modern production steel frames as well as slightly older offerings from the 90's and early 2000's.

For either applications (having a bike built or buying one), what types of tubing should I be considering? I'm a little under 150 lbs. so I don't need anything overly robust/sturdy (I'd like to think I could drop a bit of stiffness to save some weight). The newer stainless tubing's from Columbus, Reynolds and True Tempter (S3 is stainless right?) all look top notch, but are all definitely out of my price range.

I'm probably thinking something like TT OX Platinum or Reynolds 953. I'm the least familiar with modern Columbus tubing but I'm assuming they'd have something comparable.
Also with slightly older steel's, what are the good ones to look out for? A lot of the Bianchi's, Merckx's and Colnago's from the 90's look awfuly purdy and fast!

Thanks.

mazdaspeed

There are a lot of different things you can look at, it's hard to know where to start. However, if you buy a high quality racing frame from a good maker, it's pretty hard to go wrong. Stiffness varies significantly in steel bikes so be aware of what kind of ride you're looking for. At your weight flex shouldn't be as big an issue as some make it out to be. IMO with steel it's not so much a matter of how light of tubing will withstand your weight, but how light of tubing you can get away with in your size before it's too flexy. In that regard newer steels are generally better than older ones because of their higher strength (at the same weight) and improved heat treating.

SlimRider

I'd say that your racing road bike should be modeled after the Jamis Eclipse 853 chromoly steel framed bicycle.

The Jamis Eclipse

www.jamisbikes.com/usa/thebikes/road/eclipse/12_eclipse.html

- Slim

PS.

This amazingly fast and agile racing bike, only weighs 17 pounds!

bbattle

Check out Torelli.com for some very nice steel frames.

Lots of custom builders, too.

Orbea makes very light steel frames but I don't think they are available in the U.S. anymore.

Masi has their Gran Criterium frame for only $980
https://www.masibikes.com/framesets/crit

jamesdak 

You know I ride an old 2000 LeMond Zurich which is Reynolds 853 steel and a 2011 Trek Madone 5.9 which is CF. Both bikes have a different feel to them but in terms of speed there is no real difference at my ability level. I have set PRs on both of them over the last year on the various 20-40 routine courses I ride. The CF is better for climbing since it is lighter and a compact double. The LeMond is more comfortable for long rides for whatever reason. When pushed hard for many, many miles I think the only real difference is me and my ability to stay concentrated and working at max effort the whole time. The times between both bikes are that close.

Oh and the LeMond was bought used for a fraction of the cost of the CF bike.

garciawork

I had a custom steel bike made by a local builder. I have NO idea what tubing it has (other than that its Dedaccai), but I can tell you it is the best bike I have ever ridden. Got me to sell my Tarmac SL3, and I prefer it (so far) to my Lynskey set up the same way. I'd say either Gunnar, or custom OX Platinum from someone like Doug at Curtlo www.curtlo.com. I really want an OS Platinum bike... not sure why...

sced

That Eclipse looks hot. A couple on Ebay for maybe a good price with "make offer". Unless you're oddly proportioned or can get a really good deal on a custom, a stock 853 or comparable frame in your size will be as good as anything out there. Personally I'd get a used frame, paint it to taste, and put great parts on it.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2010-jamis-e...item43ac6a6f75
https://www.ebay.com/itm/2011-jamis-e...item43ac7016ec

cuda2k

If you got the coin: Kirk Frameworks JK-Special

pallen

I dont know about racing, but I love my Torelli - right at 18lbs with pedals, lights, bottle cages and everything.

Hida Yanra

Steel is fine for racing.
If your builder is a solid guy with good experience making nice frames - trust him, not a bunch of strangers in front of a computer screen.

Generally advisable steps to success in life:
1. Find & Vet an expert (the internet doesn't count)
2. Get the expert to work with you (this usually involves paying them)
3. Trust the expert

Hida Yanra

FWIW - I have a steel bike with a steel fork that is built up into the 23lb range... I raced it just fine two seasons ago - if anything it made me much more noticeable in the pack... "who is that guy attacking on the steel bike!?"

Other than getting more comments in the parking lot, there's no difference.

StanSeven

What kind of races are you doing?

I see a lot more aluminum frames than steel in races. Some of the Al frames also have pretty agressive geometry which suites them well for crits. Al also was raced fairly recently in some of the major tours. While it's not as comfortabel as steel, comfort shouldn't be a primary consideration for racing either.

LOGICK ONE

I still wish Landshark worked in steel =[

RoboIsGod

Thanks for the reply's everyone. I'm really liking some of the Torelli frames and even that Jamis looks quite nice. With a claimed weight of 17 lbs. and all of those stock parts you could easily get that down to 15 lbs.

Race wise I would probably use this for everything from crits to road races. I guess I'm more partial to longer races (climbing is my strength) but I would like to be able to race a crit on the bike if I wanted to.

Also, what is the race worthyness of the slightly older Columbus EL-OS tubing? I have a newly aquired 94-95 De Rosa Primato that has EL-OS tubes. I only did a 40-mile ride on it but was certainly blown away by the ride quality. When climbing it felt a little less snappy compared to my aluminum bike, but that could also be the heavier weight of the bike and wheels.

deyendznyr

The Jamis Eclipse is a nice bike, but it is way over priced. It is now up to $3400 MSRP. Reynolds 853 has been out for a while now. If you are going to go for a stock frame, go for a Gunnar Roadie. You won't regret it. And you can build it up the way you want instead of buying a complete bike, stripping it down, selling the parts you don't want, and then building it back up. And probably for a lot less than $3400.

BUT, if you are going to spend that kind of coin, I would suggest looking at the Guru Sidero (about $2000 for the frameset). It's an amazing frame. Among the lightest steel frames, and Guru will build it to your specs. I've seen them with BB30 and integrated seat masts before. And their paint jobs are simple and beautiful.

FKMTB07

I have a Soma Smoothie and I love it. Built up with light wheels, a light groupset, and a carbon fork, it would probably be in the 16.5-19 pound range. Mine sits right at 20 pounds with the matching Tange steel fork, Ultegra 6700 group, Thomson post/stem, IRD Cadence rims laced to White Industries H2/H3 hubs 28f/32r, cages and pedals.

I image with and Enve fork, race tubulars, and a Sram Red group, it would be very light indeed.

thinktubes 

Something 853 should be fine with a carbon fork. Handling would trump weight IMO as long as the course is flat.

dmcdam

They used to - still used steel Landsharks around. I was looking at one last week.

ultraman6970

If you want old steel you can find a lot of stuff moving around at ebay. Custom made steel will be way too expensive IMO.

Sure u can find colnagos, pinarellos, EM and others at ebay or maybe in the vintage section?

fstshrk

I am very happy with my Jamis Aurora. Having said, my SL2 Roubaix rides much smoother

Andy_K 

This makes me happy. I recently bought a 2001 LeMond Nevada City (853 main triangle, 525 rear, chromoly fork) in pristine condition for $300. I'm moving some Ultegra 6600 components, an FSA Gossamer triple crankset and Mavic Aksium wheelset over from another bike. It looks like it's going to weigh in around 19-20 pounds like that. I could probably get it down to 18 pounds or so with a carbon fork, lighter wheels and lighter crankset if I wanted to. I can't wait to get it on the road.

I was kicking around the idea of dropping $3000 on a nice carbon bike, but I don't do any road racing so it just seemed like more than I needed to spend.

StanSeven

Yep. I have one like that (Waterford) with the race geometry and it is a good race bike.

canam73

GVH usually has some Viners and the like starting at about $500 if you want new and cheap.

StanSeven

Be careful with that Jamis weight. They claim 17.00 lbs without saying what size. Most likely that's for the smallest, which is 48cm. That also doesn't include pedals or water bottle cages. A more standard size bike, with pedals, should be around 18 lbs.

Also my advis eis don't buy a stock stell bike with the intent of swapping a bunch of compenents to knock off 2 lbs. If a light weight bike is what you want, buy some other material to start with.

SlimRider

StanSeven says: Exactly how light weight do you want?...Even carbon fiber road bikes weigh more than 15 lbs. (many over 16 lbs.) without the pedals! ...

BTW- It's customary to take the weight of the smallest frame within a series...

correction: 15lbs.

953 and 853 chromoly steel framed bicycles can compete with any CF racing road bike on the market.