RT

It sounds like Jenson is to you what Bike Stop is to me. My shop is even hiring right now, but I am otherwise employed during the hours they need help

EDIT: Please go check out the 2011 Aksiums and let me know if they are a steal at that price.

pallen

Every local bike shop cant have a huge warehouse for their high-volume online store. A few will do well with that model, but it obviously cant be the new way every local shop does it.

RT

Drop ship, my two-wheeled comrade. The shop works out an agreement in volume with the shippers, has it overnighted then re-ships or drop ships, depending on time. It is why if I order before 1:00 p.m. local time, I get it within 24 hours. You cannot beat that, and if you are ordering from across the country, they ship expedited with that one additional day tacked on.

twodownzero

There's a whole lot of words here, but not much substance. It's each individual customer's decision as to whether they are charging "too much." Your post seems to suggest that there's some sort of objective criteria for determining it, but there isn't. Deciding that something is too expensive is a purely normative judgment.

Right Said Fred

I think you are wrong. I think the vast majority of people go to Starbucks because there's one on every corner and they know what to expect from the product and service when they get there, not because of the statement it makes about them as a person.

RT

Word.

If I am judged by my cup, then so be it. I press my own coffee at home, and I drink truck stop coffee on road trips.

I also ride an un-badged frame with decal-less wheels. My bike rocks. Han Solo didn't even have the Millennium Falcon's name on the side of the ship, and he helped destroy the Death Star.

billyymc

Sort of like weekend hacks on carbon fiber bikes with $2k wheels?

I love this thread so much. I don't even have to read it to contribute.

bored117 

It was a steal... and it is gone now I noticed. Well, the color (silver) wasn't what I was looking for (was going to get a set for backup until I walked in to find color was not black).

pgjackson

Exactly.

velohenley

My rule is to buy bikes and other expensive products at the LBS but clothing and smaller things I go any where.

pallen

I've heard that QBP is starting to offer LBSs a web portal their customers can go to and order things through their local shop, but direct from the QBP warehouse. I think that model could work. A few big online companies with access points through local shop websites.

Dilberto

OP needs to find a new LBS, period. You buy a bike at full retail....they should offer you 10% discount, as long as you keep shopping there. Otherwise, paying their 20% markup is an exercise in (avoidable) futility. Face it - you're just another $$$ sign to them...

I would NEVER support pure-profit machines like that. Find a shop that cares more about the relationship FIRST....understanding you do have a choice, whenever you decide to buy something.

Bob Dopolina 

delete

roadwarrior

1. Harley Davidson makes more money on clothes than on motorcycles (Like a bike shop makes more on clothes than on bicycles). They make a quality product, so good that convicted felons will ride them.

2. Nordstrom, versus the other stores you mention does not scrimp on service. You get waited on in a nanosecond, if you need to make a purchase you can call ahead and let them know what you need, they will pull it and have to ready for you to look at. They accept returns, no questions asked and they appeal to a higher level of clientel as a result. If you want excellent service, there is a price to be paid for that, and in Nordstrom's case it is excellent extensive training and they are looking for a certain type of person. As is Wal Mart. You get what you pay for.

3. I own both a Tissot and a Tag Heuer. They are excellent timekeepers. When I hear Casio, all I can think of is "Planes, Trains, and Automobiles" as John Candy tries to negotiate a room at a motel with his Casio as collateral. And ends up sleeping in the car.

Our shop appeals to a certain type of client. One that wants to be waited on, get answers to their questions without being talked down to, clinics to teach them how to work on their bikes taught by experts, fun group rides not being lead by frustrated Lance wannabes, women only events (we sell a ton of stuff to ladies), and on and on. As a result, we sell close to ten million in bikes, and fitness, plus accessories and the like. So well that everyone is getting a bonus this month.

Because you need to go the inexpensive route do not put down people that are willing to pay for service.

BTW...the #1 reason why shops fail is because they charge top pricing but don't provide top sevice. Nordstroms exists, as we exist, because we do.

I recently went into a Macy's and waited about 15 minutes and could not find an employee. Not someone to help me, as if everyone was busy. I could not find anyone on the sales floor employed by Macy's. So I said in a loud voice, "I was willing to give you money today, and no one seems to want to take it from me, so I am leaving." Like rats, all of a sudden Macy employees started appearing as if by magic. Did I mention I was the only customer in that part of the store?

That's the difference.

It's not stupid to want to get served. It is stupid to pay to get served and not get what you paid for.

roadwarrior

Who decides that? You?

BTW...the nearest Dunkin Donuts is six miles from where I live and the Starbucks is a half mile. But I generally do my own coffee. So, since you have appointed yourself the person who decides what we NEED, do I need to drive six miles at $4 a gallon to get a dollar coffee, or a half mile to get my $2.50 medium dark coffee (at Starbucks I have a choice of coffees)? Please let me know.

pgjackson

Neither. Make your own. Why do you have to go out for coffee?

pgjackson

In all three examples you provide, none of the actual products are superior to the less-expensive alternatives. If you want to shop at Nordstrom because it makes you feel fancy, great. If you want a to own a Tag because of some movie, awesome! It's your money. But it's all conspicuous consumption.

Right Said Fred

That is incorrect. In 2011, H-D revenues from clothing was about $275 million. Revenue from motorcycle sales was over $3.5 billion. THe company sold over 230,000 motorcycle last year, and so far in 2012, sales are up around 25 percent year-over-year and gaining market share on the competition.

So I guess PGJackson can dismiss them as not being better than cheaper alternatives, but the motorcycle buying public overwhelmingly says he is wrong.

fly:yes/land:no

just a clarification: revenue does not equal profit. my guess is that the profit margin on clothes is a good deal higher than on the bikes. now, of course, it would have to be significantly higher to for the profit on clothes to be greater than the profit on bikes assuming that your numbers are accurate.

halfspeed

I can't comment on Harleys or watches, but I think what you're missing about the Nordstrom's example is that the "product" isn't just the item in the bag on the way out of the store. It's help from expert salespeople who can help make a selection of products that fit well and look good in a minimum amount of time. There's a lot of value in that for those of us who aren't interested in spending a lot of time browsing and learning about fashion. By the same token, there are a lot of cyclists out there who just want a good bike that fits without expending a lot of effort scouring the internet for deals, learning to fit themselves, and learning how to maintain their machines.

pgjackson

I never said that HD didn't sell a lot of bikes. I just said that their bikes cost twice as much as other bikes. They are selling an image and people are willing to pay for that image.

Right Said Fred

H-D's overall gross operating margin was about 33 percent in 2011. I won't get into the split between product categories, but however you slice it, more total profit is made selling motorcycles than clothing. The margin on motorcycles would have to be less than 1 percent for profit from clothing to exceed profit from bikes, and that would be assuming the margin on clothing was 100 percent. My numbers are accurate and you can verify them through the earnings statements here:

https://investor.harley-davidson.com/...657&highlight=

PG, Harleys do not cost "twice as much" as other motorcycles. That would be like saying Specialized bicycles cost twice as much as other bikes. Just a stupid thing to say.

rebel1916

There is nothing wrong with Harley's, they are just old tech. I think it frustrates many riders that so many people are so enamored with a brand that produces heavy, slow motorcycles at a premium, when there are faster, lighter bikes available for less. I myself prefer something a little quicker and more modern, but a lot of people forget that riding is a visceral experience and performance numbers don't tell the whole story. To put it in bicycle terms, Harley = the steel is real crowd!

Right Said Fred

Guys like PGjackson must just go ballistic when they see bikes like Waterfords, Rivendells and Moots selling for six grand!

rebel1916

Like I said, it ain't my bag, but for the vast majority of us first world types, any two wheeled vehicle is a toy or a hobby or whatever you wanna call it. You gotta ride what moves ya. You oughta see whitewater canoers, now that's a weird breed!