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  1. #1
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    Zipp 101's vs. standard carbon clincher

    I'm sure everyone is already familiar with Zipp's offering of a 30mm aluminum clincher that retails around $1300 that claims significant aero advantages over standard v-shaped carbon clinchers.

    Question is, in your opinion, would you get the Zipp 101's over the likes of Williams System 38's, Boyd 38mm's for around $1000 (any of the similar direct to consumer carbon clinchers)?

    I know it's probably not a very fair question to ask that could spark differing opinions and debates, but I'm interested in seeing what opinions are out there.

    Myself, I'd lean towards the Zipps for the alum brake track, and to support my LBS (and not have to worry about paying for or obtaining service).

  2. #2
    jmX
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    Senior Member jmX's Avatar
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    I wouldn't buy "off" brand carbon clinchers if you live in SoCal and ride the mountains we have here. Doing the 4 mile descent down the switchbacks of Mt Baldy on Boyds or Williams (or almost every other carbon clincher) would be risky to me. It's *hard* on the brakes for a couple miles there. Only carbon rims I'd take to the top of Mt baldy are Zipp Firecrests or rims with an aluminum brake track.

    If you're not doing twisty descents, I say go for whatever is more aerodynamic. Zipp posted some tests for the 101's against the competition, maybe check out slowtwitch or zipp.com for those results.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Silvercivic27's Avatar
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    I'd get the Zipps.

  4. #4
    Senior Member tcwayne's Avatar
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    I've been on a set for nearly a year and they have been rock solid. This article sums it up perfectly
    http://www.slowtwitch.com/Products/T...ero__2707.html

  5. #5
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    yeah, the braking thing on carbon definitely has me scared enough.

    I'll be looking for a set of 101's as a reward once I hit 150lbs. (currently 160).

  6. #6
    Senior Member dayday82's Avatar
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    You can get a pair of 2011 Zipp 404 clinchers with the alum brake track for $1600 on ebay. You might be able to offer a lower amount.
    2011 Cervelo S2
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  7. #7
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    What about going with something like the HED Jet 5 express clincher. Similar wide toroidal shape to the firecrest models with an aluminum brake track. They retail for $1500 so you might be able to get them down a little.

  8. #8
    Senior Member pgjackson's Avatar
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    Seems like a lot of $$$ for an aluminum wheelset that isn't very light. I seriously doubt Zipp's areo advantage is anything you will actually notice.
    "These are questions for wise men with skinny arms." - Khal Drogo
    2011 Rossetti Vertigo w/ SRAM Rival 16.1lbs

  9. #9
    Senior Member WhyFi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgjackson View Post
    Seems like a lot of $$$ for an aluminum wheelset that isn't very light. I seriously doubt Zipp's areo advantage is anything you will actually notice.
    Weight Weenie isn't what they were going for. They're going for aero and a big part of that is the width, which adds to the weight, obviously.
    Quote Originally Posted by RollCNY View Post
    I would wager that not riding in Minnesota is just as fatiguing as not riding in New York.

  10. #10
    Senior Member pgjackson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
    Weight Weenie isn't what they were going for. They're going for aero and a big part of that is the width, which adds to the weight, obviously.

    Like I said, I think a recreational rider will not notice the aero-ness.
    Last edited by pgjackson; 05-08-12 at 11:51 AM.
    "These are questions for wise men with skinny arms." - Khal Drogo
    2011 Rossetti Vertigo w/ SRAM Rival 16.1lbs

  11. #11
    Senior Member WhyFi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgjackson View Post
    Like I said, I think a recreation rider will not notice the aero-ness.
    And your assumption is based upon what? Many recreational riders have stated a perceived benefit. Would you make your same assumption about all 40mm-50mm deep rims?
    Quote Originally Posted by RollCNY View Post
    I would wager that not riding in Minnesota is just as fatiguing as not riding in New York.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Adrianinkc's Avatar
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    If you ride fast the 101, if you like the look or just want poser status go with the standard v shaped carbon wheels.

  13. #13
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    I recently got the 101s on ebay for about 899 dollars. They are stiff, and handle REALLY well due to the width. I took it up kings mtn last weekend and loved them on the ascents and descents. Plus the hub noise is zipptastic. I can't say that I've tried boyds or other bang for buck wheels, but I don't think I'll ever need another alum or carbon set based on my experiences in the past few months.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
    And your assumption is based upon what? Many recreational riders have stated a perceived benefit. Would you make your same assumption about all 40mm-50mm deep rims?
    That's called placebo. It takes very careful tests under controlled conditions to detect a difference with a powermeter.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Seattle Forrest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sosojeffcc View Post
    I'm sure everyone is already familiar with Zipp's offering of a 30mm aluminum clincher that retails around $1300 that claims significant aero advantages over standard v-shaped carbon clinchers.
    What kind of significant aero advantages are you hoping to see for your money? In a 30 mile ride, how many seconds are you hoping to save?
    Don't believe everything you think.

  16. #16
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    I have no problem with CF braking. Properly adjusted, and with the right pads, they are fine. No way I'm going to race on alloy, and changing pads is a PITA, so both my training clinchers (Bont Race XXX) and my race tubies (Zipp 404) are CF. They are more sensitive to adjustment, but I'm okay with that.
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  17. #17
    Senior Member WhyFi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregf83 View Post
    That's called placebo. It takes very careful tests under controlled conditions to detect a difference with a powermeter.
    My vocab does include the word "placebo," thanks. My statement which was a direct reply to a someone questioning whether or not one would notice the difference (hence the presence of the word "perceived," in my reply), as opposed to someone questioning the effectiveness of an aero rim profile. I do find it funny, though, that you're trying to educate me while suggesting that a powermeter, even under ideal conditions, might be a means of demonstrating how aero a rim is.
    Quote Originally Posted by RollCNY View Post
    I would wager that not riding in Minnesota is just as fatiguing as not riding in New York.

  18. #18
    Senior Member whitemax's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregf83 View Post
    That's called placebo. It takes very careful tests under controlled conditions to detect a difference with a powermeter.
    A powermeter can detect the aero qualities of a rim?

  19. #19
    Senior Member Nachoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregf83 View Post
    That's called placebo. It takes very careful tests under controlled conditions to detect a difference with a powermeter.
    Personally, I think even your average recreational rider can tell the difference between different sets of wheels. To me they all feel quite different. But it's much harder to determine whether that difference would equate to any significant time savings.
    .
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    Two wheels good. Four wheels bad.

  20. #20
    Senior Member pgjackson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nachoman View Post
    Personally, I think even your average recreational rider can tell the difference between different sets of wheels. To me they all feel quite different. But it's much harder to determine whether that difference would equate to any significant time savings.
    This is an accurate statement. According to Zipp, these 101 wheels can save up to 42 seconds over 40K ride. "Can" means "might" and "up to" means "anywhere from 0 to whatever number they come up with" in advertising lingo. So, in effect they are promising nothing.
    "These are questions for wise men with skinny arms." - Khal Drogo
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  21. #21
    Senior Member pgjackson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
    My vocab does include the word "placebo," thanks. My statement which was a direct reply to a someone questioning whether or not one would notice the difference (hence the presence of the word "perceived," in my reply), as opposed to someone questioning the effectiveness of an aero rim profile. I do find it funny, though, that you're trying to educate me while suggesting that a powermeter, even under ideal conditions, might be a means of demonstrating how aero a rim is.
    So is your point that thinking that you can feel a difference is the same as actually producing a difference?
    "These are questions for wise men with skinny arms." - Khal Drogo
    2011 Rossetti Vertigo w/ SRAM Rival 16.1lbs

  22. #22
    Senior Member WhyFi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgjackson View Post
    So is your point that thinking that you can feel a difference is the same as actually producing a difference?
    No. My point was that I was answering the question you asked.
    Quote Originally Posted by RollCNY View Post
    I would wager that not riding in Minnesota is just as fatiguing as not riding in New York.

  23. #23
    Two-Wheeled Aficionado ColinL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
    What kind of significant aero advantages are you hoping to see for your money? In a 30 mile ride, how many seconds are you hoping to save?
    I did a bunch of research before buying my wheels, Mavic Ksyrium Elite. I knew they were pitiful aerodynamically, but also that it didn't start to matter very much until beyond 25mph. At the time I was happy to average 13mph and excluding descents, I was really working to do 20.

    Fast forward a year and I'm doing interval workouts with a buddy who has a power meter. We're always going well over 20 unless we go straight into a strong headwind. We average 30 mph with a big tailwind.

    I'm not trying to say I'm fast. I'm not nearly fast. But I'm now going fast enough for some regret to creep into my head that I should've at least gotten 30mm aero clinchers instead of box-section wheels.

  24. #24
    Senior Member pgjackson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    I did a bunch of research before buying my wheels, Mavic Ksyrium Elite. I knew they were pitiful aerodynamically, but also that it didn't start to matter very much until beyond 25mph. At the time I was happy to average 13mph and excluding descents, I was really working to do 20.

    Fast forward a year and I'm doing interval workouts with a buddy who has a power meter. We're always going well over 20 unless we go straight into a strong headwind. We average 30 mph with a big tailwind.

    I'm not trying to say I'm fast. I'm not nearly fast. But I'm now going fast enough for some regret to creep into my head that I should've at least gotten 30mm aero clinchers instead of box-section wheels.
    How much faster will you be able to go with areo wheels?
    "These are questions for wise men with skinny arms." - Khal Drogo
    2011 Rossetti Vertigo w/ SRAM Rival 16.1lbs

  25. #25
    Two-Wheeled Aficionado ColinL's Avatar
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    I might save 10 watts, maybe. That's not enough to go even 1 mph faster.

    My point, however, is that I discarded aero because of the speed required for it to start mattering.

    Today I would care more about how aero my wheels are but I'd still work within the same budget. Aero is huge, but it's hugely body position. Small contribution from wheels. Smaller still from frame.

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