Foblander

Anyone have any suggestions on a better set of wheels in the $500-$600 range? I want something lighter but durable enough for my weight (143 lbs). I have a 2009 caad9-7 and upgraded the tiagra/sora components to a full 105 5700 groupset. Imo it was a great investment because I've enjoyed riding my bike a lot more. I use it for commuting and weekend rides with friends. The last upgrade I want before I am satisfied with this particular bike would be a lighter set of wheels so that the ride is smoother, I'm able to accelerate a bit faster, and climbing would be a little bit easier. I know the gains from decreasing the rotational mass is not night and day but I'm hoping it will make riding a even more enjoyable experience through the little differences. What are some wheelsets that may fit what I'm looking for? I was thinking maybe mavic ksyrium elites or maybe a set of the ultegra 6700s? I do see a lot of better priced wheelsets online vs the lbs. Will it offend the lbs if I bought it online instead of through them? I like my lbs but they don't offer any extra benefits from buying through them. I was hoping they would help true my wheels if they ever came untrue but they don't even offer that without having to pay for that service. I would definitely buy through them if they were able to add something the internet wasn't able to provide like service. Eh maybe I am being being too cheap and should just support the lbs.

Mike F

I went from CXP 22's to Boyd Rouleur's and dropped over a a pound (2015 to 1527). They were $425 shipped.

ravenmore

Kinlin rims on a good hub. Think various Boyd and Rol wheels use this configuration.

Bacciagalupe

As long as they were built properly, you don't need to buy a new set of wheels.


Different wheels won't make a noticeable difference in terms of ride quality. Especially if you wind up with a wheel with fewer spokes.

Switch to 25c's and lower the pressure a little bit. That'll smooth out the ride more than changing wheels. Heck, they might even improve your performance a tiny bit, since they will reduce rolling resistance with no appreciable aero penalty.


Given your uses, 1 pound is not going to make a noticeable difference in terms of either acceleration or climbing.

E.g. on a 20 pound bike, a 5% grade climb that goes for 1/2 a mile will take you 3.77 minutes. Add 1 pound, and it'll take you a whopping 3.79 minutes. Even if the calculators are off by an order of magnitude, a slight breeze or a hesitation in shifting will cost you more time than an extra 1 pound on the bike.

CXP-22's are pretty decent, and if made properly will be as tough as any wheel out there. Rather than thinking about how to replace 'em, just enjoy 'em.

StanSeven

I don't know where you got those calculations but the best is analyticcycling and it should show a much larger difference. Plus 1 lb at the wheels makes a big difference in acceleration, particularly on sprints and hard efforts on climbs.

ravenmore

CXP-22's are a strong as effe rim but boat anchor heavy. I know because I have a set sitting about 8ft from me right now. You will notice a difference with a lighter wheel like the kinlins (sitting about 10ft from me atm).

Bacciagalupe

Which you state without actually running the numbers?

They're from bikecalculator.com. And no, changes in weight on the rim don't make a big difference, the effect is greatly exaggerated by people who a) love to repeat things they've been told without proof and b) love to upgrade.

When you use analyticcycling's "Less Weight on Hill": add 1 pound, 5% grade (0.05 slope), 800 meters, a difference of 1 second. So even if adding weight to the rim amplifies the effect by 3x (which it doesn't), you're looking at a 3s difference.

If you're racing or in a very fast paceline, I think I can accept that 3s over 800m starts to get important. If you're a dude who is on a commuter and rides with your buddies on the weekend, it's negligible.

Bacciagalupe

~2040g for a complete wheelset is "boat anchor heavy?" For a commuter and recreational bike? Seriously?


...which have what, 20 or 24 spokes? Since when do fewer spokes make a wheel smoother?

And I'm curious as to whether you've actually quantified the difference in tests, or just presume that 1 pound is significant.

Again, for a handful of riders the minuscule difference generated by 1 pound is actually important. It doesn't sound like the OP is in that elite group.

ravenmore

Yes to the heavy comment and 28 spoke for the Kinlins which use niobium to tighten the grain structure of the aluminum in them. Long story short this makes them lighter while retaining their strength. Great rim.

Bike Gremlin

Try riding some really heavy wheels. Like a hybrid, 40 mm tyres on some cheapo wheels. Then you'll see what difference is. CXPs are heavier than some 3 times as expensive wheels, but not that noticeable, although it is rotational mass. I have no problems following my friends on group rides and the biggest problem on my bike still is "the engine". So I'm sticking with 36 spoke, cheap "heavy" wheels and riding the hell out of them!

Having said this, some people think it's a good idea to keep a set of old wheels as a spare. That's how I got my wheels for cheap - the spare was never used. So I guess nicer wheels are still nicer and you don't want to go "back". This means nicer ride, but more expensive repair/replacement. Once you get used to luxury...


However, this all doesn't answer your question. You do want better wheels. An upgrade. How good are roads where you ride, how many spokes would you like (changing hubs, or staying with the old ones)? Those things could help people give you an advice.


About the LBS thing. My local lbs does a lot of things for free. I'm a regular customer and they recognize me as a cycling enthusiast (owner is that himself). So when he built my first road bike, he took like 10 euros for all the labour (putting it all together, truing wheels etc). Said he is just happy when he can build a really nice bike, doesn't get a chance to do that often. But he is never offended when I shop elswhere. He even openly says for some things: "you can get them cheaper thereAndThere", or "buy that second hand, look up adds. I won't find it second hand for you, but you can if you have the time..."

Juan Foote

Actually, unless there is something particularly different about your CXP's, they generally weight about 22-2300 grams a set. They are flexy, heavy, and typically poorly built. ANY half decent rim will be in improvement in feel and weight.

John_V 

According to Mavic's web site, the CXP-22 is not a wheelset and is sold as a rim. The problem, I think, is that it is used as an OEM component for many vendors which use different spokes and hubs and there lies the problem. My old Defy 2 came with CXP-22 rims, Sipan racing spokes and Formula hubs. When weighed against the Shimano R501 wheelset on my Colnago, the old wheels were heavier by a few grams but the hubs were not as good as the Shimano hubs. I think that I have to agree with Bacciagalupe, that going to a slightly wider tire and lower pressure will give the OP what he is asking for, unless I missed the part where he said he wants to race. Tires are cheaper than wheelsets and if going to a 25 cm tire doesn't do the trick, then consider changing wheels or hubs.

canam73

Rim weight vs other weight apparently doesn't make much difference at all:

https://www.training4cyclists.com/how...on-alpe-dhuez/

StanSeven

Did you read what you posted? It says

.

The ride was 51 minutes or so. The same weight moved from wheels to the bike resulted 1/2 minutes savings!

ravenmore

CXP22 is a rim, not a wheel. It has been around forever and is a solid rim but heavy. It's cheap so it is used on a lot of OEM wheels that come with bikes. No telling what spokes or hubs they paired it to.

Mine are heavy - very very heavy. I can feel a huge difference with the Kinlin wheels using Sapim spokes and Formula hubs (Formula hubs are sold under a bunch of rebranded names and are a nice and light hub). They spin up much faster and take less effort IMO to hold speed.

canam73

Incorrect.

Did you read my post? I said Rim weight vs other weight.

And did you actually look at the data? The difference in moving the weight from the bike to the rims was less than 30 seconds, and the difference in input watts accounts for most if not all of that.


And btw, you do realize that they added 4 lbs and road up L'alpe d'Huez to get those differences.

StanSeven

My bad. A typo from using my phone. I mean 1/2 minute. That's significant. Nothing else was changed and 2 watts doesn't make that difference. The author noted "Also it shows that weight savings on wheels might be more important than weight saving on non-rolling equipment"

Carbon Unit

I completely disagree with this. Wheels can make a huge difference in ride quality. I replaced my CXP33s with Topolino Wheels and the difference in ride quality was drastic. Topolino Wheels have spokes that are made of Carbon Fiber and Kevlar and have carbon hubs. They are also much stiffer because they have more spokes and the spokes go from one side of the wheel to the other without stopping at the hub.

The CXPs were harsh and the Topolinos feel like riding on carpet. The road buzz is greatly reduced.

I bought my first set of Topolinos used off of Ebay and then traded them in on a newer set.

canam73

According to https://bikecalculator.com/ the 2 watt difference would account for 22 out of the 27 second difference. So moving 4 pounds of weight from the bike to the rims would add 5 seconds of time when you climb l'alpe d'huez. The difference in actual rim weight when moving from a CXP to a Kinlin is more like 60g per rim. If the relationship is linear that would be a difference of 0.333 seconds for 2 rims. Again, when climbing l'alpe d'huez.

Still say that is significant?

StanSeven

Two things. One is I'm not going to debate those calculations. I'm just going to cite what the author said and that's "weight savings on wheels might be more important than weight saving on non-rolling equipment" The author wouldn't say that if his evidence didn't lean that way.

Second, wheel weight doesn't make much different anyway in a steady speed situation. Where it does have an impact is sudden acceleration like sprints.

Carbon Unit

Wheel weight also makes a dlifference when climbing too.

Bacciagalupe

30 seconds. Over 51 minutes. On an ~8 mile climb, with an average of ~8% grade. That's a 1% difference, which is very likely within the margins of error of the test.

Let's assume that the test was absolutely accurate. If you have a lighter wheel but the same tire, at least some of the weight you'll save is in the hubs and spokes.

Let's go crazy and assume that a lighter rim, in that situation, really will save you 30s. I think we can safely say that for a racer, this is unquestionably a significant time savings.

However, the OP isn't talking about racing, let alone climbing Alpe d'Huez in a competitive scenario. He's talking about commuting and riding with friends on the weekend. For his uses, dropping a pound from the wheel is utterly inconsequential, and probably below his ability to reliably quantify.

Bacciagalupe

As in, you sprang for what, a $1200 wheelset? Which is twice the OP's budget?

I'm sorry, but I'd say that using slightly wider tires and lowering the tire pressure is a far more cost-effective means of achieving the same results. Heck, you could add bar gels, a CF handlebar and CF stem, and drop $250 for the Specialized "COBL GOBL-R" seatpost or something similar and still come out way ahead.

Heck, the OP could probably buy an aluminum endurance bike for the cost of a pair of CF wheels.

ravenmore

I believe he said he got them used on ebay. Topolino does have wheels under $1k new - he didn't say which ones he had. Topolino's do have a superior ride quality. Wider tires and lower pressure would not be even in the same friggin' ball park as the Topolinos (btw Topolino means Micky Mouse in Italian, lol). It's really hard to describe but yeah I could go all day on chipseal with them.

moppeddler

I'd go with Boyd Vittesse wheels in that price range. The 23mm wide rims give a nice ride and they're strong. I got some VelocityA 23's (similar design but a little more $$), and I have noticed a difference over the Shimano R500's. Maybe just placebo effect, but I'm better at hills, and ride quality is definitely better.