rpenmanparker 

Funny, when I had my steel frame done by Bilenky about 15 years ago, the couplers, full repaint, moving the rear brake bridge and a new fork (I was converting 27 in to 700c) all came to $850. My how times change. I sold it a few years ago for $400. Oh well.

njkayaker

$850 then is about $1188.52 now.

The $1500 is for Ti (I wasn't quite clear) and includes the $450 case.

It doesn't seem that what you spent was that much cheaper (it was somewhat cheaper but not wildly so).

Even a few years ago, it would have been easy to tell that getting $400 for it might not have been a very good idea.

It seems that the couplers add about $500 to a custom steel frame.

njkayaker

The only difference is the head tube length. The seat tube angle is fairly steep (on both) in smaller frame sizes.

Since the integrated headset includes the cups where the bearins sit (basically), it means the effective length is even less than the standard (it appears).

https://chrisking.com/files/pdfs/Int2...sExplained.pdf

(Just to be clear: none of this is bad. Ritchey has been in the business for years and has a good reputation.)

Bob Ross

Powdercoat is considerably more durable than liquid paint, so that's a good alternative if you're not going for a metal that can be left naked.

rpenmanparker 

Well I just didn't have any room for another bike. I just was never happy with the 27" to 700c conversion. The fork had a "lift" on the crown to keep the top tube level. It was kinda funky. I was happy someone else could use it. But you are right, my price wasn't that much different.

island rider

So, now the real question is Cross Ritchey versus Road Ritchey....

rpenmanparker 

Can't help ya there. I don't even know what cross is!

Stevie47

It's a S&S coupled Waterford, 60cm frame with the standard S&S case. It's a tight pack, I have to remove the fork and crankset, but it goes.

rpenmanparker 

Up to date developments in bike parts can work to make packing the S&S case harder or easier depending... For example, compact bars fit better in the case than deep drop bars do. Compact cranks fit better and generally make sense for a travel bike which is often taken to mountain areas (that was my situation). But the new designs in cranks and bottom brackets are not helpful to packing the case. It used to be one could just remove the drive side of the crank leaving the smaller NDS and bottom bracket in place. Now both sides and rather ungainly spindle have to come out if you have a modern crank on large frame. Low profile box rimmed wheels are easier to pack than deep V wheels, because they take up less room in the middle of the case. This is especially true regarding fitting the bars and brifters in around the wheels. My point is that when outfitting a break-apart frame that you might buy bare to build up, you can choose your components with an eye toward the packing process and make life easier in future.

island rider

Good insights. Thanks.

rpenmanparker 

I just received a reply to an inquiry I made to Bill Holland regarding the packability of HIS Ritchey type design bikes in S&S cases. He assured me that he has not found a limit (even 64 cm) to the size of his Jet (Ritchey-type with his modifications) frame that will fit in the S&S case. Good information.

JoeB14

+1. I made the switch to compact bars due to easier packing, and ended up liking them so much I put them on my other bikes.

island rider

Great, now if he will give me a discount on the $6k the frame would cost, we are all set... But that is good info and I would presume it translates into the ritchey as well.

carpediemracing 

A bit late to the party.

I have a friend who helped me with Bethel for many years. He traveled extensively for work and bought a bike specifically to use when traveling, an S&S Merlin/Spectrum (made by Merlin, geo/sizing by Spectrum).

Some notes on his bike:
1. He rode the S&S bike more than his other one because it was stiffer. I believe he had an Extralight with S&S and a regular Merlin/Spectrum without S&S. The S&S effectively shorten tube lengths because they don't flex at all. This means that a 58 cm top tube might be more like a 38 cm after the S&S is installed.

2. With some S&S compatible case (it had rounded corners, it was square, light gray) he could fit his 58-ish cm frame fine. He deflated the tires, for the record. I think the worst thing was that he had to remove his crankarm or chainrings.

3. If you're willing to invest in the frame a bit you can get more than the normal 2 S&S couplings installed. I really liked Zinn's bike, which I saw and photographed.


(Photo by me)

You can see that the top/down tubes become just tubes, the stem splits, and I imagine he doesn't have to do much bar/stem manipulation to get this thing to pack up. If I was traveling a lot I'd want something like this.

There were a lot of Litespeeds and Merlins sold your way - you might be able to pick up a used one and have it retrofitted. We sold the Merlins, which when custom were labeled Spectrum, i.e. Tom Kellog's brand. A standard round tubed Merlin may be a bit flexible, even with S&S couplers, but an oversize tubed Extralight, with S&S.... that would be nice schnizzle.

Of course the breakaway thing is cool too. I just don't have experience with it.

rpenmanparker 

I'm sure of it! The case fit, not the discount.

island rider

It looks retrofitting the couplers costs $12-1400 at Bilenky, who appears to be the highest volume provider of the service. So, a $1000 e-bay frame turns into a $2500 investment. It seems to make more sense to go with the new frame once you look at those prices. Provided you can get one for $2k or less, which, if you include Ritchey is possible.

I'm not sure what value there is in having multiple couplers per tube on 56, since I don't think the top tube length will be the most limited factor after being taken apart (seat tube and Wheels some to mind). But I like the idea. If I were getting a retrofit done I would consider doing some extra.

rpenmanparker 

I agree with you, but would point out that since so much work will be done the frame including full repaint, it doesn't have to start out in very good shape (steel). I would look for a used brand for which full decal sets are readily available like Bianchi. Perhaps you could get the frame down into the low hundreds. Different situation if you are thinking Ti.

OGS_SD

Ritchey steel frame with a carbon fork, cable splitters and a suitcase can be purchased brand-new for about $1,100-1,200 (for titanium frame it's closer to $2,200). One advantage of Ritchey design is that it only adds about 100g over the weight of a typical steel frame of the same size/geometry, whereas S&S couplers add 500g or more and overall end up costing a lot more than Ritchey as well. S&S route may make more sense if you already have a steel or Ti frame or have some sentimental attachment to the frame, or need custom frame etc. Otherwise I would highly recommend Ritchey route, especially Ritchey Cross Breakway - makes it a LOT more versatile, can use it as a road or cross or touring bike (up to 40mm tires) with a simple switch of the wheels, have eyelets for panniers for touring, fenders etc. The Ritchey Breakaway design is extremely solid and rigid.

seattle29er

BUY THE RITCHEY.

If anyone's in Seattle area and want to get first-hand experience with a Ritchey, you can try out mine and we'll get a beer and talk travel bikes.

If you're bothered with the stock case, then sell it and buy an S&S, which fits the Ritchey, even larger sizes, nicely (you have to follow the S&S packing instructions). You're going to pay for the S&S case even if you buy a custom S&S bike regardless. I run an S&S case with my Ritchey (with S&S padding, compression members, and TSA net) and found it's the magic combo for me.

I've owned both Steel and Ti/Carbon road versions (sold the steel for the Ti). Love them both; excellent riding bikes. I sold my other bikes (carbon and aluminum frames) and kept the Ritchey. S&S is a nice concept, but frankly, unnecessarily overbuilt, heavy, and somewhat clunky... and mega expen$ive. I personally haven't been able to reconcile the justification in functionality or aesthetics or whatever, for the significant extra cost... unless the desire is for a tandem or something funky. (But Ritchey's Tandem Breakaway is reported to come available in about a year or so.) I'd rather spend that amount on my cycling vacation than on my bike. (and my bike is pretty bling as it is.)