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  1. #226
    token triathlete Bah Humbug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RT View Post
    FWIW, after stupidly trying to adjust a 2x9 lever to a triple crank yesterday (I had forgotten the levers were not 3x), I had to tune out the 30t to make it work, and work it did. 42t even around here is plenty with a 12-27.

    Why not 53/42 with a 14-25 in the back for 9 speed?
    I know I couldn't climb in CO with a 42x27 bottom gear. Of course, you may be stronger and lighter than I am, or just ride east.

  2. #227
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    The Weird Beard RT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bah Humbug View Post
    Sure, but it does happen. The argument we have is that Di2 batteries suddenly leaving you without shifting is also extremely rare, in that the only examples of it I've seen are when people were intentionally testing its battery failure mode. Even in the cases of people who (presumably) had a short and excessive battery consumption they just had to charge it more often, on the order of weeks instead of months.
    It does happen, but the frequency with which it happens makes it a non-issue. At least it was a non-issue until something new came along. This happens with any technology, not just bikes. Roadies are just fussy teenage girls when you get right down to it. When they get something new, what is now old instantly becomes crap.

  3. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bah Humbug View Post
    I know I couldn't climb in CO with a 42x27 bottom gear. Of course, you may be stronger and lighter than I am, or just ride east.


    You crack me up, sir.

  4. #229
    token triathlete Bah Humbug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RT View Post
    It does happen, but the frequency with which it happens makes it a non-issue. At least it was a non-issue until something new came along. This happens with any technology, not just bikes. Roadies are just fussy teenage girls when you get right down to it. When they get something new, what is now old instantly becomes crap.
    If cable breakage is a non-issue, so is battery death. Can we agree on that? That's my only point here.

  5. #230
    token triathlete Bah Humbug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RT View Post


    You crack me up, sir.
    So, are you climbing the Rockies in 42x27, or do you stick to the plains?

  6. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bah Humbug View Post
    If cable breakage is a non-issue, so is battery death. Can we agree on that? That's my only point here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bah Humbug View Post
    So, are you climbing the Rockies in 42x27, or do you stick to the plains?
    Yes and yes.

    I do measure a good ride in miles, not feet. Working at the base of Pikes Peak makes the commutes good, but nothing a 42t can't handle. If the ride is over 15 miles, that bike stays home though.

  7. #232
    Senior Member JimF22003's Avatar
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    This post does kinda have compact crank content**...

    I've been using Di2 for about 2 years now. My battery has never lasted as long as some people claim, maybe because I probably shift more than average. I charge every 4-6 weeks.

    But three times now I have accidentally let it get low enough so that I lost shifting on the front derailleur. The problem is that I think the blinkie scaling is off. When it goes to blinking green you're supposed to have about half the power left. But when mine starts to blink green it goes to blinking red and then low power mode pretty quickly.

    Before a hard, hilly century ride last Sunday I noticed that it was on blinking green. I was out of town so I couldn't charge up. About 80 miles into the ride I lost the use of the front derailleur. It was stuck on the small chain ring. With the compact crank** that meant I could only pedal up to about 20 or 21 mph. Then I had to coast. Also because I was in low-battery mode I had to "ration" the number of times I shifted on the RD so I wouldn't run the battery down altogether, so I ended up being in too hard or too easy of a gear much of the time.

    I wouldn't go back to a bike without electronic shifting, but it's not 100% trouble-free either.
    2009 Cervelo R3SL TdF Edition, Ultegra Di2
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  8. #233
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    Get sheldon style 10lb wheel dynamo with DI2
    That, or perhaps an 800gram ventless solar paneled helmet should be standard equipment.


    I'm curious, what is the running voltage on DI2?
    If its Lithium Ion recharge, am assuming 3.6-3.7.
    It'd be so easy to double your milliampH with 18650 battery in stem.
    These batteries, slightly larger than AA, will fit damn near anywhere. Seatpost, handlebars, stem, etc etc

  9. #234
    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Not sure how the Di2 thing got woven in...but for those considering changing their gearing via either cassette and/or crank, the following link is a good read for Campy guys. I believe there is an effort to reduce rear derailleur complexity by melding short and mid cage length with Shimano and Sram as more pie plate cassettes find their way onto road bikes spawned from the mtb crowd, but Campy sticks with three rear derailleur cage lengths. Since many of us run a short cage, the question is, how much chain wrap a short cage Campy derailleur can tolerate...like I have for example as I change to a 13-29 10 speed cassette in back. Chain wrap is defined by the difference in cassette spacing + difference in chain ring teeth in front. For example, initially I will likely run a 50/38 with 13-29. Quick math yields 12 + 16 = 28. Campy conservatively specs 27 as max chain wrap for their short cage derailleur. In other words it works with judicious chain sizing. (Campy tends to be conservative with component compatibility) One cyclist in the link below has run a 30 tooth aggregate spread without issue with Campy short cage. I may go there as I am considering a 50-36 with 13-29 = 30 tooth chain wrap on the button. This set up will avert the dreaded 50/34 hole in front shifting and provide nice short gear inches for climbing the steep stuff with toasted legs at the end of a long ride. Good read for those interested: http://forums.roadbikereview.com/campagnolo/13-29-short-cage-derailleur-131507.html


  10. #235
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    I second that emotion. Love how the 50 tightens all the ratios too. 39 is rarely seen and all that's needed 4 me.

    Quote Originally Posted by BoSoxYacht View Post
    I use a 50/39 standard crankset with a 12-23 cassette. Nearly all of my riding is in the big ring, and I love having the 18t cog that you get with a 12-23 cassette.

    My next crankset will be a 50-36 compact. 34x23 is useless here in Phoenix.

  11. #236
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    Capacity is only somewhat important. Like you said it is usually conservatively listed, and it only affects the 1-3 smallest small/small combos which in general should be avoided anyways.

  12. #237
    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redlude97 View Post
    Capacity is only somewhat important. Like you said it is usually conservatively listed, and it only affects the 1-3 smallest small/small combos which in general should be avoided anyways.
    Depends how you ride and how must discipline each of us have to avoid worse case X-chaining aka big big and small small. In the heat of the battle, sometimes we forget, or at least I do. Even though maybe not optimal, I sure don't want a set up that is too tight to shifting into big big. Just don't want to put that level of stress on my driveline. Quite right about Campy's conservatism when it comes to endorsing given combinations. They don't recommend 13-29 with a short cage rear derailleur but many ride this combo without issue. I will be another. The 50-38 is delightfully tight and good shifting and of course only contributes a 12 tooth spread to chain wrap so is directionally correct to run with 13-29 with short cage.

  13. #238
    Senior Member RedVVing19's Avatar
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    Right now the 52/36 with 12/28 on my tarmac is just to much gearing going up hills for me, I've be thinking of going with a 105 50/34 to ditch the FSA Gossamer crank.

    Just not sure how much real world lower I'll gain

  14. #239
    token triathlete Bah Humbug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedVVing19 View Post
    Right now the 52/36 with 12/28 on my tarmac is just to much gearing going up hills for me, I've be thinking of going with a 105 50/34 to ditch the FSA Gossamer crank.

    Just not sure how much real world lower I'll gain
    It's easy to calculate. It won't give you much; it'll be about like a 29t cog instead of 28t. You can do it, but really, not the hugest difference.

  15. #240
    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedVVing19 View Post
    Right now the 52/36 with 12/28 on my tarmac is just to much gearing going up hills for me, I've be thinking of going with a 105 50/34 to ditch the FSA Gossamer crank.

    Just not sure how much real world lower I'll gain
    As Bah said, not a lot but the point about gearing is you don't know if its enough unless you try. Numbers or percentages don't substitute for experience. I will say, if you are suffering a bit with climbing on the 36/28 combo, then you are likely riding some real steep stuff or...you need to ride a bit more. That said, if I lived in the mountains, I would be on a triple...so something to consider RedVVing if you are climbing some long steep hills. Plus, you will like the tight spacing of a triple. I will tell you, I am not much of a fan of 50/34. When you go to this type of gearing in an effort to cover both gear inch ends...short and long...then you pay for it in the middle where many of us ride at 18-20 mph...constant shifting in front. This is where a triple shines. My next gearing foray will be 50-38 with 13-29. Now I have the option of either 36 or 34 for small ring though my short cage rear derailleur will be challenged with either. OK if I stay off the big big though. But, I don't like wide gearing in front as stated. Gearing is basically a tradeoff. Don't rule out a triple if you haven't ridden one. If I ever make it to the Alps to ride for example, it will be on a triple.
    Cheers.

  16. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bah Humbug View Post
    The love for 52/36 is interesting; my goal for next year is to get my FTP from 251 -> 265 so my small ring can jump to 38t, which would mean I can move up to a 130bcd and 52/38. I wouldn't want a 16t jump again.
    I have a 52-36 with a 12-28. I find I spend a lot of the time in the 52/19. I don't like that. I'm thinking of putting the 50 on instead and spending more time in the middle of the cassette.

  17. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by Campag4life View Post
    Depends how you ride and how must discipline each of us have to avoid worse case X-chaining aka big big and small small. In the heat of the battle, sometimes we forget, or at least I do. Even though maybe not optimal, I sure don't want a set up that is too tight to shifting into big big. Just don't want to put that level of stress on my driveline. Quite right about Campy's conservatism when it comes to endorsing given combinations. They don't recommend 13-29 with a short cage rear derailleur but many ride this combo without issue. I will be another. The 50-38 is delightfully tight and good shifting and of course only contributes a 12 tooth spread to chain wrap so is directionally correct to run with 13-29 with short cage.
    Huh? You won't have any problems getting into the big/big if you size the chain correctly. The only place you run into issues is the small/small combos, and all that happens is that there wont be enough tension on the chain causing the chain to rub on itself. This doesnt' lead to a catastrophic failure like too short of a chain.

  18. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miller2 View Post
    I have a 52-36 with a 12-28. I find I spend a lot of the time in the 52/19. I don't like that. I'm thinking of putting the 50 on instead and spending more time in the middle of the cassette.
    how is the 19 not in the middle of the cassette? You have 4 lower gears than that...

  19. #244
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    [QUOTE=redlude97;15670715]how is the 19 not in the middle of the cassette? You have 4 lower gears than that.

    3.....22, 25, 28

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    Quote Originally Posted by ahsposo View Post
    50/34 - 12/27 works well for me but then I don't race and have nothing to prove. More efficient than a triple.
    Why "more efficient".

  21. #246
    token triathlete Bah Humbug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miller2 View Post
    I have a 52-36 with a 12-28. I find I spend a lot of the time in the 52/19. I don't like that. I'm thinking of putting the 50 on instead and spending more time in the middle of the cassette.
    If you do, please let me know how it goes... I'm a bit of a 50/36 evangelist.

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    I put a 42/28 on mine a few weeks ago and so far I haven't missed having 50 or 52 even once.

    However, I don't race, and, around these parts, it counts as a flat ride if you don't have to climb anything steeper than 6%.

  23. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miller2 View Post

    3.....22, 25, 28
    that seems silly for sram to do that. shimano's 12-28 makes way more sense, 19, 21, 23, 25, 28. Still puts the 19 in the middle 60% of the cassette. Going to a 50 won't allow you to use the 17t the most either. You'd have to go all the way down to a 46/47T chainring to get a gear similar to 52x19

  24. #249
    Senior Member jtwilson's Avatar
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    I do. I was a hater for a while, but once I made the switch, I am not looking back. I run a 11-25 or 11-26 on the back, depending on the wheelset. I find the 50t perfect for riding in the middle of the cassette at my normal cruising speeds. A 34t provides as low of a gear as I could ask for. I can always put a 11-28t on the back if I'm looking at sustained steep climbing. Moving to a flatter area next year and might switch to a 50/36.


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    On Saturday's group ride, for the first time, I found myself wishing I had a bigger gear than 50-11. Big bunch hammering along a long stretch with a tailwind and slight downhill grade, we were hitting 36mph and I kept pushing my gear lever something bigger. I think my cadence was around 110. Other than that though, I like it: I can use the big ring for most of a ride, only switching to the little ring for steeper stuff.

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