LordOpie

I'm thinking of getting a new ride. I can't really afford it, but road biking is the only activity that I can do -and- like to do on a regular basis. So I'm thinking, maybe a new ride. I stopped by my LBS and they have these bikes that are appropriate for my style of riding -- casual rides, longer distances, 5-6 100+miles (some supported, some solo), 5000miles/yr.

I'd appreciate your feedback on 'em. Basically, is there a significant reason to spend more than the Pro?

2004 Fuji Roubaix Pro : $950

Lemond Croix de Fer : $1250

Lemond Sarthe : $1650 (2005? It's got Veloce 10-speed*)

Litespeed Firenze : $1900

I forgot to ask the guy what year the other bikes are *shrugs*

Thanks!


* please please please, no Shimano vs Campy. I'm all about the frame, comfort and overall package.

Brett 12

Croix de fer, that bike looks really nice.....True Temper Platnum oX

They are all nice really.....I'd probably go for the bike I mentioned above. I'm sure the Fuji is just as good though. I just like the lemond steel frames. Plus the color is nice.

BTW, I hear Veloce shifts a little rough till it wears in a little. You know the saying...Blah blah blah.

Serpico

Sarthe if you can handle the color. You either love it or you hate it.

I like the color of the Croix, but the Sarthe is spec'd nicer. About a 300$ difference, but if you add up all the upgraded components (compared to Croix) on the Sarthe it is a great deal.

SDS

You'll gain a little in aerodynamics by getting the fewer spokes on the wheels on the Croix de Fer v. the Roubaix Pro. I would be looking at a frame material that isn't attractive to refrigerator magnets. CF fork on both, so that is a tie. Sufficiently better parts on the Croix de Fer to justify the difference in price, I think. Decision goes to the Croix de Fer over the Roubaix Pro, because you only have to pay for the speed once, and after a while you will have beaten enough people with the slipperier wheels that you would have paid a dollar to beat, to make up the difference in price. As to how many cogs you should have, I think you set a minimum standard and accept everything above that. I'm not prepared to decide if I have to have ten cogs or nine cogs yet, but you might be.

LordOpie

not familiar with that material. The shop guy said it's a better grade of steel than 853.
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Good to know.
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Ya know, I didn't even think about aesthetics while shopping, but, uhh, I actually like the orange
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Good point. I'm far more about enjoying the ride and getting to the destination. Can the Croix wheels handle a heavier load? (I'm 200#) Also, I'm very rough on my toys -- I beat the crap out of my mtb. I won't hesistate to bunny hop a pot hole if needed. I don't do that often. So, are those wheels strong enough for a fat abusive guy?

You're suggesting to go with something other than steel? I like steel cuz of comfort, not concerned about weight, and I'm abusive. I'm afraid I'd break an AL or CF bike. Am I unjustified in that concern?

Nine's enough and I'm -- rut roh! -- going with a triple. Besides not being in the best shape, I have a knee problem... if it's more than 6% grade for any real distance, I need the 30 ring *shrugs*


Thanks all!

sydney

I don't think there is .02 worth of difference.Both are heattreated air hardening. One may be a bit lighter than the other due to more agressive butting,but you aren't going to get that spec from either lemond or Fuji. www.strongracing.com may still have a useful blurb on steel alloys and their basic differences.

gcasillo

Not sure if any of those are CF, but IMHO you should consider a CF bike if you can swing it. I was in your shoes last year.

I built up a Bianchi EV3 Alu last year when I set out to begin riding on a good, regular basis. Toward the end of the summer, I wasn't real happy with the ride quality. Specifically, how jarring it was. I was lifting my rear off of the saddle constantly. I decided to sell the EV3 and begin looking for a bike I could ride comfortably and thus frequently.

Long story short, I got a CF bike, a Look KG486. It's spendy, but it's buttah over the road. I almost went for a Specialized Roubaix Pro Comp adorned with Dura Ace or Ultegra and good Mavic wheels for roughly $1600. In fact, I would have gotten that bike if I hadn't been a wuss about bidding for one. My patience/stubborness was rewarded when I got an unbelieveable deal on my Look a month later.

Check out the Specialized Roubaix Pro Comp. Very, very comfy ride. Good looking to boot. You should be able to find a '04 for $1500 or quite less. I can't believe more folks don't talk about this bike, because it's a great value for the ride it provides.

velocipedio

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!! DON'T GET A PLASTIC BIKE!

sorry, gcasillo. just couldn't resist.

of the list, the litespeed has, in my opinion, the best frame. it's essentially last year's listepeed classic with a satin [dull grey -- very sexy] finish. i've been very impressed with the ride quality of ti, and the durability is second to none. the frame will last foah-evah.

having said that, the real test is in the ride, and i'd be surprised if you don't find something you like in the bunch.

fyi, true temper platinum ox is excellent steel. it's air hardened tubing like 853 and columbus zona, and has almost identical properties. in fact, i don't think it's accurate to say that it's better than either. it's just from a different manufacturer. in fact, when lemond couldn't guarantee that it had supplies of 853, it switched the tubing used in the porad to a mix of true-temper and reynolds.

the bottom line is: ride the bikes. buy the one that sings to you. if more than one sings to you, buy the one with the nicest colour.

Doid23

Not having riden any of the 4 bikes on your list, I can't comment specifically on any of them. However, I am also above 200lbs (230), and I just went through the process of buying a new bike. I have a similar rider profile and goals as you (though no centuries and certainly not 5K/ year) as you, and I ended up chosing Titanium over steel, for no other reason than I've ridden steel my whole life, and wanted to get a lighter bike that will hold up for a long time (another 15-20 years like my last one). I had a $2,000 budget, and at my weight one of the first decisions I made was to get a Ti frame and build it up for a big guy, most specifically wheels. Nothing worse than being 30 miles out with a spoke or two popping, and I didn't see any production bikes with 32 or 36 spoke wheels out there. I was able to get a great deal on a 2002 Merlin Cyrene on eBay ($900), and had it built up with Ultegra with Ritchey parts and some Deep V 32/36 hole rims for ~$2K. I also wanted to steer clear of carbon forks with carbon steerers because of my size, and was able to get a Ouzo Comp. Excel Sports in Boulder has some nice deals right now on the Macula Ti frames (made by Litespeed or TST Sports, not sure) for $890 in 61cm or $950 for other sizes, might be worth a look. Good luck.

SDS

Looks to me as though those wheels are stronger than average with high-profile rims (?), but nothing but the very best wheels will last under a 200 lb guy that makes watts. I don't mean lightest, I mean the most unbreakable. That means Aerospokes or something else that does not have spokes, or something like the paired-spoke Shimanos with the nipples at the hub, which have been quite durable under my 240lb friends (ex: Shimano 540s).

If you are not concerned about weight or frame flex, you can keep the steel. I think you are unjustified in your concern that you might be able to break SOME CF and aluminum bikes. I think it is unlikely you can break a Trek CF or a Cannondale aluminum bike. I think my58vw is on a CF Trek? And I have a bunch of 240lb friends on Cannondales.

The Treks are too small for me (odd sizing requirement), so I have C'dales. I like them a lot, and they keep getting better. Each generation is butted and bulged and shaped and milled and curved to be even better. And they have CF forks. Right now they are pretty darn good, though I don't think I have fairly compared them against other bikes.

Unscrew the 30T and put on a 28T so you can do the steeper grades (10% and higher on Mount Evans?), with a 28 X 27T low gear. The STI triple system will handle it. Get your spin up where you want it to be. I am thinking about 24-36-50 and 11-27 next time I am up your way.

Doid23

I agree with the post, but the Firenze is not last years classic. The Firenze was out last year as well, and has curved seatstays, which is unlike the classics "classic" straight seatstays.

velocipedio

good point... maybe the tuscany is last years classic with curved stays... i just ordered a bunch of litespeeds for the shop, and i'm suffering from information overload. all i know is that i'm getting a teramo.

LordOpie

The Bianchi is AL? I appreciate your thoughts, but my low-end steel bike has been nothing but a champ. IF Fuji still made it, I'd totally recommend it to newbies.
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Yeah, gonna test 'em all Monday
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What's your concern about CF fork?
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stronger than average? Good to know. I've been riding Mavic OPs w/Ult for the past 2500 miles and they've been solid.
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I'm thinking of asking the shop to do that. They said they might not be able to give me any credit for swapping parts, but they'll do the labor for free.

Yeah, my spin's improving, I'm comfortable ~90 these days. Also, I've been standing more. With better shoes and pedals than when I started, I'm more comfortable testing my bad knee and building the muscles around it. I currently can spin most everything in a 30-27, been spending more time in 30-24, but I'm always worried that my knee will give out, so a 28-27 sounds smart.

24-36-50? No shifting issues with such a range? Next time you're up here, let me know. I'm hoping to do Mt. Evans this summer. I can ride half way -- Bergen Park to Echo Lake -- without issue. I think the biggest problem on Evans isn't the grade, but the wind?

SDS

I've been up there three times, once to hike toward Mt. Bierstadt past the Sawtooth, bailed due to weather including everything except lightning. Practically ran the whole way back to the parking lot and just beat the deluge. Got belted by the hail pretty good.

I rode up in the summer in the early '90's in perfect weather the whole way. I had no idea how lucky I was.

I did the race last July. I heard later they were thinking about cancelling, but they went. I did the Citizen race because it started early so I could drive most of the way back to Texas. About ten minutes after I got to the top a front slammed through and the temperature dropped about 30 degrees in two minutes. My hands planked up and I had to pull my gloves on with my teeth. I was so frozen I couldn't shift into the big ring so I couldn't make any power going down so I couldn't get warm. If I didn't watch my hands, they were so numb they would slide off the handlebars. It was not a good trip back down. The website said only 80% finished, but I think the DNFers might have been unevenly concentrated in the later starting divisions because of the weather change. Never been up there when it is blowing, and I think I don't want to know. Let's see if I can scrounge up a picture....

Shimano's nominal triple FD capacity is 22T, giving only 30-42-52, but it will work with more. I usually won't go past 25T, i.e., 28-39-53, and that works just fine, particularly on tandems. It seems to me I have used 26T once or twice. You do tend to run into limits like the bottom-back of the FD cage on the small cogs, but as long as you are only after useful combinations, it's not much of an obstacle. Shop people might not want to do this, because it is technically against the rules, but I do my own maintenance.

alraicercsu

I say get the litespeed. it cost more but in my opinion its the better overall bike.

Doid23

No concern with carbon forks, but carbon steerer tubes. And more a statement of the flexibility that specing your own build offers, not on the durability of carbon steerers. More of a personal issue, since I prefer traditional framesets vs. compact or semi-sloping frames, but since my upper body is proportionally longer than my lower body, to get any kind of standover and have a setup that allows my stem height to be close to my saddle height, I need more stack height than is allowed with carbon steerer tubes, that's all.

LordOpie

ha! Sounds typical. Man, I used to love hiking -- I'm gonna get me knee cut next winter, I think. We thought about crossing the sawtooth after summiting Mt.B., but it was just too late in the morning. Looks like fun tho!

^2

That's the thing about high altitude, ya almost gotta bring 10# of layers... I exaggerate, a bit I couldn't imagine negotiating the descent with frozen hands. Find the photo.

Putting a 28 on the front is a no-no for shops? What would I need to do to convince 'em to do it?

oneradtec

The nice thing about the Ti frames is that they are built to be the last bike you'll ever need to buy. You can add or upgrade components from time to time...but you can always count on the Ti frame as being immortal. That goes a long way in my book. That said..I just bought a new steed framed in carbon.

03FinestAL

Kinda related......

I got run off the summit of Mt. Princeton several years back because of the weather + I was suffering from hypoxia. Started early, but too far down (started the hike at 8500').

Two years later I hiked Mt. Elbert in perfect weather with no issues (spent 6 days at altitude before hiking that one).

Lord Opie-

If you buy a new ride I'll take that wonderful steel framed Fuji off your handsl

LordOpie

Similar to your Mt.P story, weather-wise... I was solo'ing Harvard when a fog rolled in. The top is nothing but boulders -- I couldn't see ANY cairns/totems/landmarks and kept slipping on the wet boulders, busting my legs. I turned around and headed home... only to find out the next summer that I was <50 feet from the summit!

Umm, what made you start at 8500? We usually start ~10k.

Ha! You'd have to make me a decent offer on my steel Finest bro, it still works great and I'm probably gonna turn it into a dedicated touring bike, racks and all that.

My first 14er -- Pikes Peak -- had a couple in their late 70s on the summit. I think they did the 4000' climb in <5 hours. This place is the fountain of youth.

wannaride

Take your time and really look around. In the months I was lurking around the bike stores and these forums I learned alot - including that there are some truly great deals out there. Look around everywhere. Look for leftover's look for orphan models look for returned bikes. While I very much understand that it is important to support your LBSs, know that 10-15% off list is very doeable. I think the one that sold me my last bike gave me a great price in part 'cause they were tired of me tying up the sales staff - maybe the wrecked bike played some part. Also know that if you size yourself properly you can get some great deals over the internet.

Best bike deal I know of right now is a Felt F15 in a LBS that they told me they would sell for $2,500. The MSRP on that bike is $4,100. The frame is aluminum with carbon fiber seat stays, forks, and seat post. It comes with full Dura Ace, Mavic Ksyrium SSC SL wheels, FSA K-Wing Aero-Anatomic bars, etc.

Keep looking around and jump when you find something that speaks to you.

03FinestAL

Didn't realize that there was a parking area FARTHER up (not that my father-in-laws car could have navigated the poor road to it).


I know, I know. But I had to try.......


Tell me about it! My father-in-law (in his 60's) knocked off a triple peak hike this past summer (without me ).

LordOpie

I hear ya about deals. Thing is, IF one of these bikes is right for me and it's a good deal -- tho maybe I could save 10-15% elsewhere -- the shop is gonna give me a free fitting on the new and my old bike. I'll have to pay for parts, but that's like $150-200 in free service, yeah?

Normally, I wouldn't be impressed, but I've been to this shop a couple times and spied on them doing fittings. The guy starts with all the measuring tools, but then he just starts tweaking things based on his art. I was impressed that he spent so much time doing, listening and going beyond the numbers. Hopefully, that all means something in the end.

LordOpie

One guy drove his Porsche up to the top parking lot of Grays Peak

Btw, when I said Pikes above, I meant Grays. I'm not a summit bagger, so I'd never hike Pikes. Drove it, may bike it someday, not hike tho.

sydney

What a load of barnyard waste.