petermk

Hey guys,

I recently bought a new bike (Wilier GT) and figured I'd have a pro fit done before changing the stem and handlebars. My LBS offers the Body Geometry Fit by Specialized and the Guru Fit by Cannondale. Does anyone have experience with either? Which one would you recommend?

Thanks

Nachoman

Personally I would get the fit AFTER I put on a new stem and handlebar?

petermk

Ok, but what if I buy something that just doesn't fit me right?

ill.clyde

Why wouldn't you buy something during the fitting that DOES fit you right?

Smokehouse

I would NOT buy something before the fit...especially items like stems, seats, handlebars, etc. There's too many options out there and for good reason, it is fit related many times. Now...once you know specifics like stem length, handlebar drop/width, sit bone width...THEN look at options within that size. Randomly picking out a stem or seat without knowing specifics is pointless.

As for the fit...That's hard to tell. I've read some many things for and against them. I've decided to get a BG fit done professionally next spring. I guess I'll find out if it worth a darn or not. If it is...good. If not, I'm out the $150-225 it will take for me to get it. Either way I'll know and will be able to stop wondering.

roadwarrior

Get the fit done and figure out if the stem and bars are the right size, then get the ones that fit.

Why is everything so difficult out here?

Why would anyone suggest buying something else without knowing if it is the right size, or buying anything when the stock stuff may be just fine?

Arrrgghhhh.....

petermk

Because I don't feel like paying MSRP+tax at the LBS when I can get the same components online for 30-50% less. Not to mention that the selection at the LBS is very limited.

ill.clyde

Then follow Smokehouse's suggestion.

carpediemracing 

I'm only familiar with the Guru thing, at a very low technical level. The thing that struck me is that you can change a lot of things around very quickly since everything is mounted on motorized clamps. Usually what happens toward the end is that the fitter will quickly set the bike to different positions you've tried over the course of the fit. With motorized saddle and bar mounts (and even the option to adjust crank length quickly) you'll be able to actually compare different fits virtually instantly, without getting off the bike.

Since the bike has a powermeter on it you can see instantly if you gain or lose power for the different fits, albeit for a seated position. It's less useful for standing efforts like hard climbs or sprinting, but generally speaking you'll optimize your general riding position.

The only caveat here is that fit is closely tied to your cycling specific fitness. If you're fit (so, say, you're a runner who can run 5 minute miles all day long) but not cycling fit (this is your first road bike) then your body will lack some of the cycling specific muscles used to maintain an "advanced" position.

If you want any examples just look at pictures of a Cat 5 race and then pictures of a P12 or even a Cat 3 race. The 5s tend to be more upright with the bars closer and higher. The more experienced riders tend to have the bars further and lower and their saddles usually have some marked change in terms of fore/aft from when they started.

What this means to you is that if you're not cycling fit then you should keep in mind that as you get more cycling fit your position will change. It doesn't make your fitter wrong at the time of the fitting. It's simply an evolution of your body.

My last fit effort below. The guy I fit, SOC, is still a friend, and he's still in that position. He's actually wondering about "updating" it again. Short history - he started racing in 2003 or so on a bike fit professionally at a shop, in 2008 we radically updated his position (we're talking 2 cm changes with some total changes like reach-to-bar exceeding 4-5 cm), and now, with more hours on his legs, he's considering another change to go even further than what we did in 2008.
Fit is a relative thing.

cderalow

i thought the whole point of a fit was to make adjustments to things like stem and bar to optimize your efficiency?

ie; buy a bike that's generally comfy/the right size, then get the fit to tailor/perfect it.

Smokehouse

It is...

The problem is that "fit" is tricky.

Case in point...me...

I'm a natural "hunchback". I DO NOT have good riding posture at this point. I was having serious neck/shoulders pain when on the bike and kept thinking my frame was too large, or my stem too long...or whatever. Either way, my frame is fine...as is my stem and more than likely everything else on my bike. I found my problem to be the hunchback when I stripped down to my riding shorts only and had my wife take a few snapshots of me on the bike. The second I saw my position...I knew what was up. Horrible form.

The problem is, when I was mildly "fit" for free by my LBS, I pushed myself against my muscles into a "correct" riding position and they adjusted me to that. This is fine and dandy but I don't ride that way...I ride horribly out of proper position. This has manifested itself in one uncomfortable summer. I've already started a new workout routine that I'm going to hammer all winter long. It's focused on upper body strength, core strength and most importantly, back strength. Hopefully, by spring I'll have the hunchback thing licked.

Why am I typing this? Well...if I had paid for a full fit last summer, I would have wasted my $$. I would have forced myself in an unnatural position just to look proper for the fit, had my bike adjusted to that..then fought the fit all summer. I think someone should spend time on their bike and unless it is causing some serious pain somewhere...get comfortable, get a proper form and THEN pay the big $$ for a proper fit.

therhodeo

So you advocate getting comfortable with a likely poor fit and develop your form that way? Thats a good way to get lots of aches and pains and develop poor posture on the bike.

StanSeven

A good fit isn't done just by looks. See what carpediemracing said above about the Guru/Cannondale fit that uses powermeters for example. A good fit takes 2-3 hours and is done hopefully by someone very experienced that picks up lots of "signals" and not just how you look on the bike.

Smokehouse

Nope.

There's a difference between "close" and "100% dialed in". If a LBS is worth half a crap, most riders will get a "close" adjustment before they even take the bike home...or, if they get it used can get a quick close fit for little $$. This will get the rider within safe fit distance for normal riding without serious complications. After that's been done, I feel they should spend some time on the bike, settle in an find the things that cause problems. After that, go back, drop the big $$ and get 100% dialed in.

Until then...too many things change with the individual to do a full fit right off the bat before the rider has even spent time on the bike.

Smokehouse

"Hopefully" being the key word there.

I liken this to wearing glasses. I've had good optometrists and bad optometrists in my 25 years wearing glasses. Once I knew what "right" was...I could start assisting them. I knew what made for a comfortable, well adjusted pair of glasses, I knew what kind of lenses to ask for...I knew what a "dialed in" Rx looked like through my own eyes. I've had doctors suggest stuff that I knew was wrong for me and the only way for me to know to correct it was for me to know what "wrong" was in the first place.

The longer you cycle, the better you know what feels right and what doesn't. I refuse to blindly trust someone base on the fact they went to some class and tell me I should sit this way or that. They may be right...they may be wrong. If they're wrong I can get seriously hurt. The only way to tell is to know beforehand what "feels right", what "not yet used to adjustment" feels like and what "this is so off, its going to land up injuring me" feels like...





...I'm sure many will pick apart what I just said so how about this, long story short, I don't fully trust a fitter at a LBS. I want to find my own issues before I go to them. If someone whats to begin riding and get a full fit in right away, that's up to them.

therhodeo

I would tell you that your "hunchback thing" is fit related but you should probably discover that yourself since thats the only way you'll trust the information.

halfspeed

Because whatever I bought is obviously the right choice for everyone in all circumstances.

halfspeed

What does your fitter recommend? He's the one who has to understand and interpret the data.

petermk

They don't recommend anything. They just presented what options they had available after I contacted them via email.

Smokehouse

Sadly...I'm a hunchback by nature...my wife has been hammering me for doing it for years. I sit and stand hunched over...cycling just makes it worse. I'm using this as a reason to finally strengthen my back...

AndyK 

I had a BG fit a while back. When the fitter pulled out the plumb, bob to get my knee over the pedal spindle, I knew my money could have been spent better on something else !

AndyK 

I had a BG fit a while back. When the fitter pulled out the plumb bob to get my knee over the pedal spindle, I knew my money could have been spent better on something else !

xjustice09x

With all fits systems you want to find a good fitter to do the fitting. There is no 1 ideal position for everyone. They have to know how to work with any physical limitations you may have.

I have had a BG fit. It was pretty good. The fitter takes measurements of your body and can figure out a few things that way. Then they took video of me riding my bike on a computrainer which had would provide power numbers. The video allowed the fitter to stop the image a certain points and make some measurements on the computer in the BG software. It wasnt perfect, but I ended up in a better position than I was before.

GURU provides the dynamic fit bike which is nice be cause they can more quickly and easily make position adjustments while you ride. I see no reason the Guru fit bike couldnt be used in a BG fit. The fit bike can make fitting easier, but its still up to the fitter to put you in a position that is appropriate for you.

My latest fitting was a RETUL fit. Retul uses sensors mounted to specific parts of your body. It allows the motion of your body to be tracked. It traced the path of my knee, so I could see it moves away from the top tube on the up stroke. It also calculates distances and angles. Retul can be used with a dynamic fit bike like the guru one.

Personally I like the accuracy of the measurements made with retul. With a good fitter either BG or using a guru fit bike can get great results.

I would probably choose based on price and what each fitting included (retul, power analysis, video capture.....).

StanSeven

I had a fitting done using Guru combined with Retul. It took a long time and was expensive (included in my frame price) but was definitely worth it. I've been riding a long time and developed what I was thought was the right fit for me. The bike fitting changed things enough that I had lots of doubts at first. But after getting some miles in, I now see it was exactly right. I feel better and I'm sure ride better but I can't really attribute increased power to the new bike (wish there was a way to measure it)

Smokehouse

The problem is where you live...finding one locally isn't always an option...

I live in central Illinois...we have a few BG fit places but few rate well and the only one that rates "ok" charges $350 flat fee. I'm going to have to either drive to Chicago or St. Louis to get a fit so finding a good one isn't going to be easy...